# Tolkien Fan Entmoot **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** middle-earth\ **Created:** [February 12, 2008, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328 "2008-02-12T20:38:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2008, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/201 "2008-03-12T20:37:26Z")
[QUOTE=bbs2k] What the heckles is that?! PS: Moot! [/QUOTE] Double click between the arrows. You should have seen the small message on reply anyway. ---
**Author:** ![bbs2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e495f1/32.png) [@bbs2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bbs2k)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2008, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/202 "2008-03-12T20:48:57Z")
:smack: ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/203 "2008-03-18T19:27:46Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] Can I be moderately pedantic and nitpicky and note that FA means First Age? What you want is FO, adopted to avoid that ambiguity. [/QUOTE] Quite by accident, I found that you were not correct. In the Prolouge, the Professor himself used either F.A. for the Fourth Age or as IV and the year. Examples being: > [@](#): > > probably at the request of the great-grandson of Peregrin, and > completed in S.R. 1592 (F.A. 172). Its southern scribe appended this note: > Findegil, King’s Writer, finished this work in IV 172. It is an exact copy > in all details of the Thain’s Book m Minas Tirith. That book was a copy, > made at the request of King Elessar, of the Red Book of the Periannath, and > was brought to him by the Thain Peregrin when he retired to Gondor in IV 64. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2008, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/204 "2008-03-19T02:04:54Z")
Of course, since it was the First Age, they had no other Ages yet to compare it to. They probably didn’t even realize they were in an Age, or that there would eventually be other Ages from which it would need to be distinguished. This problem was compounded by the fact that the appropriate runes hadn’t even been invented yet. Eventually they got around to addressing the situation by handing it off to Daeron. However, it was soon discovered that, by coincidence or design, the term he coined for “First Age” had a twofold meaning, and could also be translated “Daeron’s Age.” And so Daeron was never allowed near the Elvish calendar again. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/205 "2020-12-04T20:37:15Z")
12.5 years later, I feel like bumping this thread. So bump. Feels like a good time with one more book in the works. Probably the last one. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/206 "2020-12-04T20:51:09Z")
I remember this thread! My (completely pointless) Tolkien news of the day: some friends on Facebook were discussing “reputedly difficult” books that they have tried and failed to finish, like _Finnegan’s Wake_ or _Gravity’s Rainbow_. I, of course, thought of _The Silmarillion_, which I have never been able to slog through more than 1/3 of. That’s it. Carry on. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/207 "2020-12-04T20:58:21Z")
If you ever want to try it again, start not at the beginning, but with the **Quenta Silmarillion** Maybe just start with Chapter 18, Of the Ruin of Beleriand and the Fall of Fingolfin ---
**Author:** ![Filbert](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/filbert/32/3433_2.png) [@Filbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Filbert)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/208 "2020-12-04T21:11:08Z")
Are the introductions finished yet? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/209 "2020-12-04T21:13:16Z")
Let’s not be hasty. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/210 "2020-12-04T21:14:31Z")
Late to the party but I definitely got an invite. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/211 "2020-12-04T21:19:33Z")
I need to get back to my re-read of _The Silmarillion_ (probably my 8th or 9th time through it, going back to 1979). ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/212 "2020-12-04T21:21:37Z")
> [@vison](#): > > > [@Maeglin](#): > > > > Good grief, overlooked again. Nobody knows what it’s like to be the bad elf. > > > > Like many others, I was drawn in when I was quite young. I went to the show for the epic heroism, and I stayed for the medieval languages. > > Maeglin, I know someone who has written an HUGE fanfic about a “bad elf”. It’s wonderful writing, too, but since she is using Tolkien’s universe, it can’t be published except on a fan website. Too bad. I keep telling her to alter it, make it her own, and get it published, but so far, no luck. She doesn’t use the name Maeglin, but he was her jumping off point. So you aren’t always overlooked. And remember it’s sometimes a good thing to be overlooked. > > I read LOTR in 1966 for the 1st time. I’ve read it 3 or 4 times a year every year since then and when I stop to do THAT arithmetic I think, “Gawd, woman, didn’t you have a life at all?” My youngest son, who was an internet geek from pretty early days of the WWW, hounded me into visiting the “official movie website” and I did, in late 1999, and one thing led to another and here we are. > > I have read The Hobbit a few times. I think it’s OK but to be honest, if I had read it first, I would never have read LOTR. I’ve toiled through the Sil about a dozen times, but I can’t love it much. I don’t collect books about Tolkien or other books by him. **I think LOTR is a masterpiece, and that nothing else he wrote was.** > > It’s a wonderful story, wonderfully told. After all this time and all these readings it still moves me deeply. > > Now and again I feel obliged to say, “Thank you, PJ, for making the movies”. Not that I think they were good, but I’ve had such a great time over the years because of first joining that LOTR fansite. (The movies had their good bits, I admit. He certainly got “the look of the thing” right.) (my emphasis) Okay, I know this zombie is a tween, but … what?! Yeah, LotR is a masterful epic, but c’mon - Tolkien’s literary abilities went way beyond _Edda_-inspired epic fantasy. _Farmer Giles of Ham_ is a funny take on knights-and-dragons tropes, and _Leaf, by Niggle_ is a beautiful religious allegory such as C.S. Lewis could only dream of. I also once found a short playlet he wrote, about two Anglo-Saxon thegns collecting the body of Earl Byrhtnoth after the Battle of Maldon, written in the prosody of Old English. Very moving. @What_Exit, I don’t think I was posting much in 2008, so I don’t think you were referring to me. But I am a Tolkien and Pratchett fan who doesn’t much care for Heinlein. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/213 "2020-12-04T21:29:03Z")
Add me to the list. I read The Hobbit and LOTR for the first time when I was only 10 years old. (I was inspired to read it by the 1978 film.) LOTR was over the head of even a precocious 10-year old reader like I was, but I was hooked. I then reread them every couple of years through the rest of my school years. (I remember reading The Two Towers in the hospital as my mom was in labor with my youngest sister, and later rereading The Hobbit in a single day one summer.) I never did get into the deeper history of Middle Earth, though. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/214 "2020-12-04T21:44:46Z")
Huh, how did I never see this thread the first time around? ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/215 "2020-12-04T21:48:52Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Huh, how did I never see this thread the first time around? I had the same thought. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2020, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/216 "2020-12-04T22:06:41Z")
You were even mentioned by name. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/217 "2020-12-05T16:08:24Z")
Thanks for your timely bump to this thread, **WE**. For behold: > **[J.R.R. Tolkien House Comes on the Market (Published 2020)](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/02/realestate/tolkien-house-sale-oxford.html)** > > Literary fans and celebrities who starred in Tolkien films start a crowdfunding campaign to preserve the house. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/218 "2020-12-05T17:09:32Z")
If you’re truly interested in joining societies of Tolkien fans and scholars, I have two to suggest. One is the Mythopoeic Society. This is an organization of people interested in the Inklings (Tolkien, C. S. Lewis, Charles Williams, and a few others, who regularly met together at Oxford to talk and read their new writings to each other) and other works of fantasy and mythology. This organization has existed since 1967 and has held annual conventions called Mythcons. (And, um, I was chair of the convention in 1994 when it was held in Washington, D.C. in 1994.) It has regular newsletters and journals. Mythcon has been held every year since 1970, except that this year it was cancelled. It will be held in 2021 at the same place chosen for this year (Albuquerque, New Mexico) and the same guests of honor as was chosen for this year. I’ve belonged to the Mythopoeic Society since 1972 and have been to the majority of Mythcons since 1977. The other organization is the Tolkien Society. It’s existed since 1969 and has held annual conventions called Oxonmoots (which are always in Oxford) since 1974. It has regular newsletters and journals. I’ve belonged to it since 1987 and have attended quite a few Oxonmoots. Oxonmoot was held online this year only. Both the Mythopoeic Society and the Tolkien Society don’t make distinctions between fans and scholars, so you don’t have to feel that you need deep knowledge about Tolkien to attend them. You can find information about these groups online. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/219 "2020-12-05T21:05:28Z")
I ordered my copy of JRRT’s “The Nature of Middle-earth” in old fashioned Hardcover. It should arrive circa June 1, 2021 Might be the last publishing of previously unprinted material on ME from him. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2020, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328/220 "2020-12-05T21:25:30Z")
I need to wait until I finally get into my new house to order it. I’ve read the same thing about it probably being the last publishing of previously unprinted material on ME from him. So I need to order sometime in January. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tolkien-fan-entmoot/437328.md?page=12)