# Tom Cruise, you are an ass. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 19, 2003, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000 "2003-06-19T19:52:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/61 "2003-06-20T14:18:20Z")
That doesn’t prove they dredge up every dark past secret. All it proves is that they try to. Lie detectors certainly can be fooled. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/62 "2003-06-20T14:30:23Z")
The E-meter isn’t an actual lie detector, but that’s not really the point. Part of this whole scheme is that they **expect** you to dish all sorts of dirt on yourself, and if you don’t have dirt, you’re considered not “clear.” A real believer in this would more likely than not go ahead and confess - otherwise it’d be like lying in a confessional. I’m not saying no one has done this, but when you’re paying non-trivial sums of cash for the “privilege” of getting “clear,” you’re probably going to be very cooperative in giving the church’s personnel what they want. I think it was Freud who was one of the people who stated that people need to pay for therapy, or else they don’t get much out of it - as they don’t put very much into it at all if they don’t have a financial (and thus tangible) stake in the process. ---
**Author:** ![carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrot)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/63 "2003-06-20T14:30:47Z")
Yes, but if the belief is there, wouldn’t you think that they’d be successful with at least some, if not most, people who come through the door? Not everyone is going in trying to expose Scientology, or anything of that nature. Most (I’d guess) go in in an honest-to-goodness attempt to change their lives, as with any religion. As I said before, I have no love for the CoS. However, I think most of these people are just gullible and brainwashed. This, of course, doesn’t change the fact that the “leadership” are a bunch of litigious assholes. ---
**Author:** ![carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrot)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/64 "2003-06-20T14:32:36Z")
Well said, **Ferret Herder**. You jerk. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/65 "2003-06-20T14:33:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by quietman1920 \* > \*\*\*a few people who have been outspoken against Scientology in California in the past have found rattlesnakes in their mailboxes. \*\* Cite? I recall this about a drug rehab program back in the 70’s (can’t recall the name of it at this moment) but not other groups. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/66 "2003-06-20T14:40:25Z")
Point well made, **Ferret Herder** and **carrot** , but just because most people who undergo their “treatment” are gullible doesn’t mean that Mr. Cruise gave them anything. It could, after all, mean that he made up something to get in - don’t you think that when undergoing this questioning, those who are actually clean but do believe will make up something to get into the “club”? If they know the consequences of not “confessing,” I bet they would. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/67 "2003-06-20T14:50:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > **Exclsuions should not be allowed. If you wear the uniform, you are allying yourself with the principles that the uniform represents, and that make you evil.** Sorry, **gobear** , I’m going to have to call bullshit on that. This is called all or nothing thinking, and is regarded by psychologists as one of the forms of faulty reasoning. Very few (read: none) of the things in life are always this or never that. We tend to want to think they are because that makes life easier to organize. But it’s still faulty reasoning. I bet that if I searched all the world, I could come up with at least one Scientologist who was not an asshole, at least by some standard. It’s not that hard of a stretch to imagine. Life is messy and does not always fall into neat little buckets. Get used to it. On the other hand, I will state for the record that Scientology is a pus-filled open sore on that little space between the scrotum and rectum of the world. ---
**Author:** ![carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrot)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/68 "2003-06-20T15:03:08Z")
**tdn** : I believe that’s called the ‘perineum’. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/69 "2003-06-20T15:07:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by carrot \* > \*\ ***tdn** : I believe that’s called the ‘perineum’. \*\* No, I’d bet that Scientology is evil more than once per year. 😃 You’re right, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/70 "2003-06-20T15:08:13Z")
Thank you, **tdn**. Well said. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/71 "2003-06-20T15:08:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dantheman \* > \*\*It could, after all, mean that he made up something to get in - don’t you think that when undergoing this questioning, those who are actually clean but do believe will make up something to get into the “club”? If they know the consequences of not “confessing,” I bet they would. \*\* why would that be any different?? Scenario A: Cruise admits something that really happened and they’re using that to blackmail him. Scenario B: Cruise admits something that never actually happened and they can **still** use that to blackmail him (example - if he’d falsely claimed sexual acts, drug addiction, how can you, so many years later prove that they **never** happened?) ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/72 "2003-06-20T15:17:10Z")
Because of this: He doesn’t need to admit to a “big” thing, simply because he’s a big-name celebrity. If I were them, I’d be willing to accept a smaller confession (i.e., not sexual acts, drugs, etc.) just to get someone on board who is recognizable and who will promote my cult. Besides, what if he confessed something that was illegal but not necessarily immoral? What would the CoS do, threaten to turn over his “confession” to the police? What would they do with an old confession? They’d ask him about it, he’d deny it. They’d investigate it, of course, but if it was a relatively minor offense (shoplifting a magazine?) they’d either turn up nothing or not bother with it. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/73 "2003-06-20T15:24:22Z")
> [@](#): > > I bet that if I searched all the world, I could come up with at least one Scientologist who was not an asshole, at least by some standard. It’s not that hard of a stretch to imagine I never said they were assholes, I said they were asses, gullible, easily fooled, chumps, which they are. An individual Scientologist may be a lovely person, fun to be with, picks up kiunch checks, always willing to buy a round, but as far as he.she swallows the SoC claptrap, that person is a fool. > [@](#): > > Sorry, gobear, I’m going to have to call bullshit on that. This is called all or nothing thinking, and is regarded by psychologists as one of the forms of faulty reasoning. Very few (read: none) of the things in life are always this or never that. We tend to want to think they are because that makes life easier to organize. But it’s still faulty reasoning. And yuou should save the pop psychology for whrn it;s pertinent. This is not about stark dichotomies, but about responsiblity. If you are wearing the Nazi uniform, waving the Scientologist banner, whatever, you are allying yourself with their principles and beliefs and thus sharing their moral character. How very convenient it would have been for SS officers to say, "Yes, some excesses were committed, but I didn’t have anything to do with them, and I was quite kind to the Jews in my care. " Would you expect an Allied officer to say, “Oh well, that’s all right then. Off you go.”? ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/74 "2003-06-20T15:26:35Z")
whatever his ‘confession’ would be, it would be damaging to his current image (otherwise it wouldn’t be a confession). and he’s very very proactively defensive of his public image. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/75 "2003-06-20T15:31:30Z")
Well, the way he went after Kyle Bradford, the gay porn actor who falsely claimed he had slept with Cruise, tells me that he has something to hide. Lots of other attractive movie stars have gay rumors spread about them, but they laugh them off instead of launching massive lawsuits. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/76 "2003-06-20T15:40:01Z")
Maybe. Maybe not. The truth is, we don’t know what he confessed. We can speculate now that it’s probably damaging (if he did confess to something - perhaps, as I alluded, they needed him more than they needed a confession), but we have no way of knowing. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/77 "2003-06-20T15:42:12Z")
Tom Cruise has had those rumors swirling about him for years and years. Has it actually affected his career? Last time I checked, he was pulling in eight figures per movie. Therefore if it’s gay lover related, they would have to have substantial concrete proof. The innuendo isn’t a real factor right now. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/78 "2003-06-20T15:48:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*I never said they were assholes, \*\* OK. My bad. > [@](#): > > **I said they were asses, gullible, easily fooled, chumps, which they are.** Or ill informed. Or coerced. Or any one of a million other reasons. Of course, you could go ahead and lump all those in with the previous list, and still come out thinking you smell like a rose. You’ve stated that Scientologist are all asses. When asked for the definition of ass, you’d no doubt say it’s anyone that buys into Scientology. Perfect logic. Perfectly air-tight. And perfectly circular. That duck don’t fly around here. > [@](#): > > **I And yuou should save the pop psychology for whrn it;s pertinent.** It’s not pop psychology, and it’s very pertinent. You just happen not to agree with it, so you’ve got to disparage it. Nice. Oh, and will you please stop Godwinizing? It’s getting really old. We get it. We’re all Nazis. I personally am a well-decorated SS officer named Fritz. I eat schnitzel. I live in Dusseldorf. I drink beer. (At least one sentence in that last paragraph is true.) ---
**Author:** ![carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrot)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/79 "2003-06-20T15:53:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*Lots of other attractive movie stars have gay rumors spread about them, but they laugh them off instead of launching massive lawsuits. \*\* Something he learned from the CoS, no doubt. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2003, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000/80 "2003-06-20T15:58:05Z")
Mmm, schnitzel. Cruise smirks a little too often for me to feel comfortable looking at him. It never looks like a genuine smile; it looks like a self-satisfied smirk. And I do have some semi-personal experience with Scientologists. A good friend of mine worked for them for a while. Young, needed the money, you know the drill. Personally, considering the freaky-damn stuff they put him through just to WORK there, I think he could’ve been more morally secure if he’d just gone into porno. 😛 As gung-ho as I am about religious freedom, Scientologists give me the willies. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-cruise-you-are-an-ass/183000.md?page=5)