# Tom Petty versus John Mellencamp **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 21, 2017, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479 "2017-10-21T21:17:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/1 "2017-10-21T21:17:41Z")
In light of the disaster of the “Petty Overrated” thread, it got me thinking about how similar Melllencamp and Petty really are. Don’t you agree? They both have themes of small towns, midwest America, etc and both are what we could consider “middle of the road” in rock music, both have had a shit ton of pop hits, they are both from similar eras, etc. What do you think? What are the key differences? If pressed I’d say that Mellencamp’s drummer is better and is a legit force. But outside of that, aren’t the songwriting patterns and resulting success very similar? ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/2 "2017-10-21T21:24:53Z")
Tom Petty played with the Traveling Wilburys, and was an excellent guitarist. He’s leaps and bounds over John Mellencamp who made some radio music and MTV videos but is otherwise forgettable. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/3 "2017-10-21T21:28:05Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > Tom Petty played with the Traveling Wilburys, and was an excellent guitarist. He’s leaps and bounds over John Mellencamp who made some radio music and MTV videos but is otherwise forgettable. Do you really think so? I never heard anything from Petty that indicated he was “an excellent guitarist” other than playing chords. Both men cycled through decades of classic rock, both produced homey, identifiable lyrics that resonated with the charts. I’m not seeing the difference in your response other than Mellencamp was not invited to join what we would now call a “supergroup”. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/4 "2017-10-21T21:31:17Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > Tom Petty played with the Traveling Wilburys, and was an excellent guitarist. He’s leaps and bounds over John Mellencamp who made some radio music and MTV videos but is otherwise forgettable. I disagree. They’re both equally good. Mellencamp had a couple of good selling albums and some of his best work in _Scarecrow_ and _The Lonesome Jubilee_, but even his latest work, though not as commercially successful, is excellent. I’d put him up there with Petty and Springsteen among the elders of heartland rock. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/5 "2017-10-21T21:35:30Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > I disagree. They’re both equally good. Mellencamp had a couple of good selling albums and some of his best work in _Scarecrow_ and _The Lonesome Jubilee_, but even his latest work, though not as commercially successful, is excellent. I’d put him up there with Petty and Springsteen among the elders of heartland rock. This is what I mean. I like the phrase “Elders of Heartland Rock”, although I am confused as to singin’ about New Jersey Springsteen applies here. He’s devoid of the massive amount of hit songs as the other two. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/6 "2017-10-21T21:53:02Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > This is what I mean. I like the phrase “Elders of Heartland Rock”, although I am confused as to singin’ about New Jersey Springsteen applies here. He’s devoid of the massive amount of hit songs as the other two. Devoid of hit songs? _Born to Run_, _Hungry Heart_, _Born in the U. S. A._, _Glory Days_, _Dancing in the Dark_, to name a few. If you accept Wikipedia as a cite, Springsteen is listed with Petty and Mellencamp in their article on heartland rock. They characterize it as > [@](#): > > …a straightforward musical style, a concern with the average, blue-collar American life, and a conviction that rock music has a social or communal purpose beyond just entertainment. > **[Heartland rock](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heartland_rock)** > > Heartland rock is a genre of rock music characterized by a straightforward, often roots musical style, often with a focus on blue-collar workers, and a conviction that rock music has a social or communal purpose beyond just entertainment. > The genre is exemplified by singer-songwriters Tom Petty, Bob Seger, Bruce Springsteen, Jackson Browne, and John Mellencamp and country music artists, including Steve Earle and Joe Ely. The genre developed in the 1970s and reached its commercial peak in the 1... which is how I definitely think of Springsteen’s music. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/7 "2017-10-21T22:23:49Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > Devoid of hit songs? _Born to Run_, _Hungry Heart_, _Born in the U. S. A._, _Glory Days_, _Dancing in the Dark_, to name a few. > > If you accept Wikipedia as a cite, Springsteen is listed with Petty and Mellencamp in their article on heartland rock. They characterize it as > > [Heartland rock - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heartland_rock) > > which is how I definitely think of Springsteen’s music. I think you named them all. The two others have more hit songs. Not downing Springsteen but he definitely had a certain appeal that eluded the mainstream in many respects. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/8 "2017-10-21T22:39:38Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > I think you named them all. The two others have more hit songs. Not downing Springsteen but he definitely had a certain appeal that eluded the mainstream in many respects. I know we’re veering off topic, but at least 20 of his singles charted on Billboard’s Hot 100. Only two of those failed to crack the top 40 and 12 of them made the top 10. > **[Bruce Springsteen’s 20 Biggest Billboard Hits](https://www.billboard.com/lists/bruce-springsteens-20-top-billboard-hit-songs-charts/)** > > From "Born to Run" to "Born in the U.S.A." and more, a look at Bruce Springsteen's 20 biggest Billboard Hot 100 hits. As for mainstream appeal, his Broadway show is a smash hit. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/9 "2017-10-21T22:49:33Z")
The principal difference to me is that Tom Petty wrote a few songs that will have staying power. Mellencamp didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/10 "2017-10-21T22:50:37Z")
FINE! I’ve been out-argued, outmaneuvered, outplayed and outgunned when it comes to The Boss. Yes, he has the “workingman/average joe” thing covered, but he’s not singing about the Midwest, he’s singing about Jersey! He’s Bob Dylan with a better voice and a better band and subject material that tends not to veer into the poetic. I like him but I fear he cannot qualify for this thread. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/11 "2017-10-21T22:51:39Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > The principal difference to me is that Tom Petty wrote a few songs that will have staying power. Mellencamp didn’t. What? “Small Town”? “Pink Houses”? These are not as memorable as ANYTHING Petty ever wrote? ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/12 "2017-10-21T23:05:06Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > FINE! I’ve been out-argued, outmaneuvered, outplayed and outgunned when it comes to The Boss. Yes, he has the “workingman/average joe” thing covered, but he’s not singing about the Midwest, he’s singing about Jersey! > > He’s Bob Dylan with a better voice and a better band and subject material that tends not to veer into the poetic. I like him but I fear he cannot qualify for this thread. I don’t want to threadshit, but that’s like saying Petty doesn’t qualify because many of his songs were about California. If we can agree that they all have “…a straightforward musical style, a concern with the average, blue-collar American life, and a conviction that rock music has a social or communal purpose beyond just entertainment,” then we can agree they all count as heartland rock. I think you greatly underestimate Springsteen’s mass appeal and influence on American rock, but since this thread’s about Petty and Mellencamp, I’ll say no more, except to fully agree that Mellencamp is as influential an artist as Petty was. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/13 "2017-10-21T23:20:38Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > I don’t want to threadshit, but that’s like saying Petty doesn’t qualify because many of his songs were about California. If we can agree that they all have “…a straightforward musical style, a concern with the average, blue-collar American life, and a conviction that rock music has a social or communal purpose beyond just entertainment,” then we can agree they all count as heartland rock. I think you greatly underestimate Springsteen’s mass appeal and influence on American rock, but since this thread’s about Petty and Mellencamp, I’ll say no more, except to fully agree that Mellencamp is as influential an artist as Petty was. I agree, and now I need to listen to more Springsteen! ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/14 "2017-10-21T23:27:54Z")
There’s a Springsteen song that plays on the kroger sound system, I am trying to find it. Outside of him helping Jimmy Fallon to whip his hair, it’s his best song I’ve ever heard, ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/15 "2017-10-21T23:35:11Z")
I think you’re coming at angles, here. It’s not exactly right to say that both Petty and Mellencamp were writing small town stuff. Yes, Mellencamp did that based on his Bloomington, IN upbringing. But Petty focused on the south - where he was from - which is a whole different culture than the heartland. Then he shifted to LA and wrote songs about that. The real difference is where the two were heading. Petty seemed to always be angling to emulate the jangle-pop songs of the late sixties like the Birds and the Searchers and such while Mellencamp - when freed from label interference - aimed straight for a more acoustic Rolling Stones model. Difference spots to aim at. Springsteen, of course, shouldn’t enter this discussion at all. Jersey ain’t the south ain’t the midwest. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/16 "2017-10-21T23:51:02Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > Springsteen, of course, shouldn’t enter this discussion at all. Jersey ain’t the south ain’t the midwest. How many of his songs are specifically about New Jersey, though? In most of them, he could be singing about people everywhere. And I maintain the heartland doesn’t exclusively include the Midwest. It could be anywhere in flyover country between the two coasts. If your songs are about everyday common people with broken dreams, then where a singer is born and where he lives doesn’t enter into it. I enter into evidence the albums, _Nebraska_ (a place about as far inside the Midwest as you can get), _Devils and Dust_, and _The Ghost of Tom Joad_. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/17 "2017-10-22T00:04:22Z")
One difference between Tom and John: Mellencamp always wanted to be an artist(painter) and considered being a rock star a “pain in the ass”. Petty wanted nothing other than to be a musician from the day he met Elvis when he was 11. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/18 "2017-10-22T00:10:44Z")
> [@blondebear](#): > > One difference between Tom and John: > > Mellencamp always wanted to be an artist(painter) and considered being a rock star a “pain in the ass”. > > Petty wanted nothing other than to be a musician from the day he met Elvis when he was 11. Mellencamp’s first manager tried to mold him into another David Bowie, even christening him “Johnny Cougar,” something that he resented. His insistence on doing things his own way earned him the nickname “L’il Bastard” among record company executives. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/19 "2017-10-22T01:42:01Z")
[slight hijack] John did a great interview on World Cafe a few months back. He talked about the new album and a lot of other stuff too. Really interesting and worth a listen if you’re a fan(or even if you’re not) [[URL=“http://www.npr.org/sections/world-cafe/2017/05/01/526103113/john-mellencamp-on-world-cafe”]World Cafe interview w/Mellencamp](http://www.npr.org/sections/world-cafe/2017/05/01/526103113/john-mellencamp-on-world-cafe) [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![DooWahDiddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e9bcb4/32.png) [@DooWahDiddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DooWahDiddy)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479/20 "2017-10-22T01:45:34Z")
The difference between Petty and Mellencamp is demonstrated by the power of melody. Yes, lyrically and instrumentally the two are similar, but Mellencamp’s half-drunk, talky way of singing makes it hard for his melodies to ingrain themselves into the listener’s brain, much less survive the test of several decades. Petty, on the other hand, instantly established a strong melody, and sang it strongly (yes, he sometimes slurred, but he used it sparingly). That, to me, makes him the clear winner of this contest. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tom-petty-versus-john-mellencamp/799479.md?page=2)