# Tony Snow dies. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 12, 2008, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243 "2008-07-12T15:34:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/321 "2008-07-13T21:25:57Z")
[QUOTE=pseudotriton ruber ruber] Come, come. Let us not be disingenuous. They were both willing spokesmen, often apologists, spinners, and propagandists for governments that deliberately manipulated facts in order to justify declaring specious but ruinous invasions of countries whose policies they opposed in a misguided attempt to restore national pride and other imperialistic reasons. That’s a little closer than both being white males. [/QUOTE] Have you really gleaned nothing from what I and other posters have in great detail pointed out about the gross dissimilarity between the careers of Snow and Goebbels? And your assertion that both rationalized aggressive war “in a misguided attempt to restore national pride and other imperialistic reasons” is a highly contentious one with regard to Dubya’s regime, unlike the near total historical consensus judgment of the Third Reich. This whole “Bush = Hitler” thing is really imbecilic. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/322 "2008-07-13T21:33:22Z")
[QUOTE=Fuji] And your assertion that both rationalized aggressive war “in a misguided attempt to restore national pride and other imperialistic reasons” is a highly contentious one with regard to Dubya’s regime. [/QUOTE] Ok. Great Debates. You and me. Let’s go. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/323 "2008-07-13T21:37:00Z")
It’s an interesting question: Should we grieve for good men who served an evil cause? Doesn’t the pain of their final days grant them absolution for their support of wicked bosses? Or does their association with evil continue to taint their soul? But enough about Bobby Murcer. /Thank you, thank you, I’ll be here all week. ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/324 "2008-07-13T21:56:38Z")
[QUOTE=pseudotriton ruber ruber] Ok. Great Debates. You and me. Let’s go. [/QUOTE] You set it up, and I’ll be there. I definitely would like to see your evidence that the Iraq War was started “in a misguided attempt to restore national pride”. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/325 "2008-07-13T22:14:51Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] Apparently, I’m serving as your excuse to be irrational. [/QUOTE] Well, shit,\*\* Lib\*\*, an accusation of egotism from _you_? You are least as much a diva as I, and you know it! Its like Brittany accusing Madonna of being a drug addled slut! ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/326 "2008-07-13T22:34:25Z")
[QUOTE=Carol Stream] I thought you were dropping out of this thread. What happened, liar? [/QUOTE] x-ray’s law: When a poster claim’s he will no longer be responding in a thread…he’ll be back. ---
**Author:** ![Pedro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@Pedro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pedro)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/327 "2008-07-13T22:46:54Z")
[QUOTE=Carol Stream] Posts that you disagree with are not thread-shitting. [/QUOTE] Ok. Be good now. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/328 "2008-07-13T23:15:01Z")
[QUOTE=x-ray vision] x-ray’s law: When a poster claim’s he will no longer be responding in a thread…he’ll be back. [/QUOTE] The **Liberal** corollary: When a poster claims he’s leaving the \*board \* for good, he’ll be back. No matter how many times it happens. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/329 "2008-07-13T23:18:15Z")
For the love of fuck, don’t you people have _lives?_ ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/330 "2008-07-13T23:23:02Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] For the love of fuck, don’t you people have _lives?_ [/QUOTE] Speaking only for myself: sadly, no. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/331 "2008-07-13T23:23:13Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] For the love of fuck, don’t you people have _lives?_ [/QUOTE] Sure! This is part of it. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/332 "2008-07-13T23:25:29Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] For the love of fuck, don’t you people have _lives?_ [/QUOTE] {checking **Cervaise** ’s post count …} Odd comment to make in a thread about a dead guy, innit? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/333 "2008-07-13T23:27:10Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Well, shit,\*\* Lib\*\*, an accusation of egotism from _you_? You are least as much a diva as I, and you know it! Its like Brittany accusing Madonna of being a drug addled slut! [/QUOTE] Except that I have power over you. I’m able to rob you of reason and enlightenment simply by existing. My opinion is so important to you that you are willing to desregard what you called “a good point” in order to make a larger point about your bruised ego. So although you were shown why comparing Goebbels to Snow is an exercise in idiocy, not only will you not concede the point, but what satisfies you is that you’re no more slutty than I. Maybe I could find some widow so I can taunt her and her children about what a shame it is they do not suffer more, and by that deed gain the respect and admiration you have given Dio. You’re my bitch, **Luc**. Hate me. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2008, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/334 "2008-07-13T23:30:32Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] For the love of fuck, don’t you people have _lives?_ [/QUOTE] I was going to post this but I had too much stuff to do 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2008, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/335 "2008-07-14T00:40:32Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Sincerity and regret, it appears, aren’t enough to ward off attack dogs who are determined to chew on his ankles. The problem is, it seems that some folks in this thread don’t buy that **Dio’s** regret was at all sincere. Here’s a question for discussion (I’m trying not to take sides here, but I’m really curious about this point): what difference, if any, is there between **Dio’s** comments and beliefs about Snow and **Der Trihs’** statements about American soldiers in Iraq deserving death? I’d like to hear opinions from both sides on this one. As I said, I’m genuinely trying to think this through. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2008, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/336 "2008-07-14T00:50:12Z")
[QUOTE=Leaper] The problem is, it seems that some folks in this thread don’t buy that **Dio’s** regret was at all sincere. Here’s a question for discussion (I’m trying not to take sides here, but I’m really curious about this point): what difference, if any, is there between **Dio’s** comments and beliefs about Snow and **Der Trihs’** statements about American soldiers in Iraq deserving death? I’d like to hear opinions from both sides on this one. As I said, I’m genuinely trying to think this through. [/QUOTE] One major difference, off the top of my head, is that Snow died of natural causes. I haven’t called for anybody to be intentionally killed. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2008, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/337 "2008-07-14T00:58:14Z")
That’s true, but I find that, by my (perhaps mistaken) understanding of what’s being and been said, many of the reasons expressed for the “hoping for death” part to be much the same. That’s more of the angle I was looking for. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2008, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/338 "2008-07-14T01:47:25Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] …You’re my bitch, **Luc**. Hate me. [/QUOTE] In your fevered dreams… ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2008, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/339 "2008-07-14T01:53:45Z")
[QUOTE=Leaper] That’s true, but I find that, by my (perhaps mistaken) understanding of what’s being and been said, many of the reasons expressed for the “hoping for death” part to be much the same. That’s more of the angle I was looking for. [/QUOTE] The troops are doing their jobs, and they were sent there _without_ the knowledge that it was all for a lie. They lack the complicity of their civilian leadership. They’re just tools, like the tanks and the helicopters. They’re also victims. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2008, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243/340 "2008-07-14T02:04:25Z")
People frequently do things like rub their hands at the gleeful prospect of some criminal getting raped in prison, which sets a standard for a certain brand of permissible hateful thinking. It’s far more common to do this to street criminals than political hacks, but if they both cause death and destruction, then it’s not hard to see Dio’s vitriol not far out of line with what “goes on” on the Internet. I myself find all forms of it rathe in poor taste, myself, and whether it is rape or colon cancer, few people who’ve been through it would wish it on anyone else (however odious). However, I find it increasingly difficult to get worked up and indignant anymore or what somebody _said_. Hell, with all the outrage we’re supposed to be feeling daily or over what something someone of _nominal importance_ is supposed to have said (Phil Gramm, Jesse Jackson, etc.,) who still has the energy to get outraged over what Diogenes the Cynic says to an audience of a few dozen? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tony-snow-dies/456243.md?page=18)