# Tops off! The acceptability of public half-nudity for women **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 28, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630 "2013-01-28T18:20:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/1 "2013-01-28T18:20:49Z")
Despite the unfortunate trainwreck of [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=680495) I thought the OP had a germ of an interesting topic on the subject of whether public toplessness for women is and/or should be acceptable in contexts where toplessness for men is already acceptable. The OP posted this interested titbit (pun intended) in the other OP: > [@TopTom](#): > > In 1992 the New York State Court of Appeals, the highest court in New York State, ruled that the state law which made it illegal for women to expose their areolas and nipples in public only applied to women who were paid to do so, so it is now legal for women to expose their areolas and nipples in public, as long as they are not paid to do so, in New York State, at least as long as there is no local ordinance prohibiting it. There is no such ordinance in New York City. For the last couple of years there seems to have been an increase in the number of women who go in public without a top on in New York City. I hadn’t heard that there were topless women roaming NYC (the odd “slutwalk” and similar aside) but if so it strikes me as a surprisingly progressive move for the generally prudish USA. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/2 "2013-01-28T18:24:32Z")
Oh, and while I realize this is wishful thinking, could we at least _try_ to avoid peppering this thread with requests for female members to post pictures? Thank you for your cooperation. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/3 "2013-01-28T18:27:13Z")
What, exactly, are we supposed to debate here? Whether or not this is a good idea? Should there be limitations? Age restrictions? Parameters, man! We need parameters! ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/4 "2013-01-28T18:30:11Z")
I think the law, at least, should strive to avoid gender discrimination. Whether or not the social milieu is ready for it should be beside the point. (Then again, I think nudity laws in general are stupid.) ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/5 "2013-01-28T18:31:20Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > The OP posted this interested titbit (pun intended) in the other OP:I hadn’t heard that there were topless women roaming NYC (the odd “slutwalk” and similar aside) but if so it strikes me as a surprisingly progressive move for the generally prudish USA. It’s my experience that in places where such is legal, whether New York City or Quebec, very few women choose to do it. Even in France, I’m told, it tends to be more the exception than the rule at public beaches and swimming pools. (I also think it would take an extreme frame of reference to classify the USA as “prudish”.) ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/6 "2013-01-28T18:34:49Z")
In related news, as of his week, nudity is now illegal in San Francisco. Gentrification sucks. ---
**Author:** ![HoboStew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f17d59/32.png) [@HoboStew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HoboStew)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/7 "2013-01-28T18:36:36Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > In related news, as of his week, nudity is now illegal in San Francisco. > > Gentrification sucks. As someone who lives there and doesn’t particularly want to see naked dudes on the street, I strongly disagree. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/8 "2013-01-28T18:41:10Z")
In the great state of Ohio, [this happened](http://gotopless.org/news.php?item.3.1): > [@](#): > > In 1995, 5 women went topless in the Columbus, OH Gay Pride parade, were arrested and later released. The charges were dropped one month later. Indeed, in the Ohio Law statute, breasts are not considered “private parts”. Therefore, women exposing their breasts in public is not considered indecent exposure. In 1998, 3 of the women who had been arrested 3 years earlier, sued the city of Columbus for false arrest and won their case . They were paid $15,000 in total for damages. Since then, the police force is being educated not to arrest top free women but warns that if the site of a top free woman causes disturbance, they have the right to ask the topless woman to leave. Note that not all the cities in Ohio seem to honor this statute. Consequently, we get to enjoy a boob-filled hippie festival called “Comfest” every year in Columbus. I’ll let y’all do your own GIS on your own time 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/9 "2013-01-28T18:41:18Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > What, exactly, are we supposed to debate here? Whether or not this is a good idea? Should there be limitations? Age restrictions? > > Parameters, man! We need parameters! > [@me](#): > > whether public toplessness for women is and/or should be acceptable in contexts where toplessness for men is already acceptable You may expand upon your arguments as you like. ---
**Author:** ![Blaster\_Master](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Blaster\_Master](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blaster_Master)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/10 "2013-01-28T18:56:05Z")
I’m perfectly fine with allowing and/or restricting both sexes to identical “exposure” laws. Frankly, there’s plenty of places where I’ve seen shirtless men where I don’t really feel like it’s appropriate, but not to the point it should be illegal, but I don’t really see why at a beach or whatever, why a woman’s nipple is somehow more offensive than a man’s. I’d rather let property owners and culture keep that stuff in check. I think we’d still rarely see it, outside of swimming areas and some festivals or whatever, because I also imagine that a lot of cases where it’s reasonable for men to go shirtless where it’s impractical for women. For instance, it’s not uncommon for men to go jogging or do yard work shirtless, but that could be problematic or painful for a lot of women, so I think we’d be unlikely to see it. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/11 "2013-01-28T19:05:42Z")
> [@HoboStew](#): > > As someone who lives there and doesn’t particularly want to see naked dudes on the street, I strongly disagree. What about those who live there and want to be naked dudes in the street? ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/12 "2013-01-28T19:06:45Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > It’s my experience that in places where such is legal, whether New York City or Quebec, very few women choose to do it. Well, yeah, it’s freezing in Quebec. > [@](#): > > (I also think it would take an extreme frame of reference to classify the USA as “prudish”.) The USA is definitely prudish when it comes to public nudity. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/13 "2013-01-28T19:08:13Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > The USA is definitely prudish when it comes to public nudity. Looking at the average American, I see it as considerate, not prudish. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/14 "2013-01-28T19:08:57Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Looking at the average American, I see it as considerate, not prudish. Fine. I will never expose my areolas to you. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/15 "2013-01-28T19:16:41Z")
I got no problem with women having the legal right to the same level of denuding as a man. I also expect that, as the covering up thread demonstrated, very few women would have any interest in taking advantage of such a right. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/16 "2013-01-28T19:17:29Z")
Considering the other thread where men said they couldn’t possibly not stare at a woman’s chest, that they have no self-control, even with a little bit of cleavage showing, I don’t know that I’d want to go completely topless anywhere. Anyway it’s COLD up in upstate NY! ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/17 "2013-01-28T19:36:57Z")
> [@HoboStew](#): > > As someone who lives there and doesn’t particularly want to see naked dudes on the street, I strongly disagree. I feel that, if you’re going to live in San Francisco, you ought to have a certain minimum comfort level with naked dudes. Otherwise, you might as well live in San Jose. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/18 "2013-01-28T19:52:50Z")
I’ve no objection to seeing breasts, or with nudity in general, but I think it’s a little naive to try to pretend that a topless female is exactly equivalent in every way to a topless male. ---
**Author:** ![Furious\_Marmot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dfb087/32.png) [@Furious\_Marmot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Furious_Marmot)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/19 "2013-01-28T19:53:18Z")
It seems reasonable. It would protect nursing mothers, women who inadvertently momentarily expose their breasts (as when changing clothes at the beach), and people engaged in public art. It may even save the police from wasting resources on the occasional call from busybodies who are scared of low-cut tops. Unlike total nudity, there’s no public health problem. A bit of back sweat on a park bench is no big deal; ass sweat would be a whole 'nother story. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2013, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630/20 "2013-01-28T20:04:38Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Considering the other thread where men said they couldn’t possibly not stare at a woman’s chest, that they have no self-control, even with a little bit of cleavage showing, I don’t know that I’d want to go completely topless anywhere. Would you go topless if men were not staring? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tops-off-the-acceptability-of-public-half-nudity-for-women/648630.md?page=2)