# Tori Amos - The Beekeeper **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 22, 2005, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355 "2005-02-22T16:18:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Heart\_On\_My\_Sleeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/77aa72/32.png) [@Heart\_On\_My\_Sleeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heart_On_My_Sleeve)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2005, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/21 "2005-02-24T22:21:24Z")
I like all of them and even have a few singles albums. I discovered her with _Boys for Pele_. I like the variety of styles, not just piano-centric stuff. I’m warming up to _The Beekeeper_. There is at least one song that is reminiscent of her Venus days (I think, could be Choirgirl). I don’t know the names of songs on her albums unless it’s obvious by the song itself. If you ever get the DVD _Welcome to Sunny Florida_, there are some cool (also piano-centric) tracks on the bonus CD. Who wouldn’t like a song called “Bug a Martini”? I listen to her the most. Her songs and voice speak to me in a way that’s very nourishing. I just got a ticket to her concert in Chicago April 15! Presale, and it’s not going very well for the fans…I got lucky. I guess the Chicago Presale is sold out. Tickets go on sale on Ticketmaster this Saturday. But here’s the link if you’re interested. [Tori Presale](http://www.toriamos.tickets.musictoday.com/ToriAmos/calendar.aspx) ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2005, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/22 "2005-02-27T08:15:59Z")
I’m liking the album a little more. I can listen to it. It doesn’t really blow me away, and there are a lot of things I think the Tori of Under the Pink could have added or changed. Too many songs are weakened by some just plain uninteresting lyrics, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Kizarvexius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Kizarvexius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kizarvexius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/23 "2005-03-11T16:27:29Z")
I’d never even heard a Tori Amos song until last week. Being most a classical sort of person, I don’t listen to the radio much at all, and none of the local stations would be likely to play her music anyway. So based on a review I read, I downloaded a song on I-Tunes just to see what it was like. It turned out to be _Parasol_. I liked it. A lot. Downloaded the rest of _The Beekeeper_ and burned it to a CD. I’ve been playing it in the car ever since. Most of the comments on this thread have been all about comparing this album to older works. Not having heard any, I don’t have any basis to compare. But I love almost every song from _The Beekeeper_. The melodies are lush and memorable, and her voice is much prettier than I expected. I’m left very confused by some of the lyrics, though. Are they supposed to be utterly cryptic, or are they more easily parsed by her long-time fans? My favorite song, for example, is _Martha’s Foolish Ginger_, but I can’t figure out what on earth the title refers to. Can anyone enlighten me? ---
**Author:** ![Rodd\_Hill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3ab097/32.png) [@Rodd\_Hill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodd_Hill)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/24 "2005-03-11T16:49:33Z")
Very disappointing. I was hoping for tips on dealing with Wax-moth and half moon disorder. Nothing. This means an angry letter to the _Apiculture Times._ ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/25 "2005-03-11T17:22:02Z")
I bought _the Beekeeper_ and kinda liked it. I still think that her lyrics are gettings worse with the years, but I like the sound. Looking forward to _Scarlett_ now. ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/26 "2005-03-11T17:40:40Z")
> [@Kizarvexius](#): > > I’d never even heard a Tori Amos song until last week. Being most a classical sort of person, I don’t listen to the radio much at all, and none of the local stations would be likely to play her music anyway. So based on a review I read, I downloaded a song on I-Tunes just to see what it was like. It turned out to be _Parasol_. I liked it. A lot. Downloaded the rest of _The Beekeeper_ and burned it to a CD. I’ve been playing it in the car ever since. Most of the comments on this thread have been all about comparing this album to older works. Not having heard any, I don’t have any basis to compare. Welll, we’re actually all comparing it to our younger years of course: beng cynical and all we are used to a lot of her work, and it can’t help but feel to longtime fans that new stuff never matches up to old stuff, or that things feel too familiar, and so forth… > [@](#): > > But I love almost every song from _The Beekeeper_. The melodies are lush and memorable, and her voice is much prettier than I expected. It’s not an operatic or R&B voice, but she has some pretty stylings indeed. > [@](#): > > I’m left very confused by some of the lyrics, though. Are they supposed to be utterly cryptic, or are they more easily parsed by her long-time fans? My favorite song, for example, is _Martha’s Foolish Ginger_, but I can’t figure out what on earth the title refers to. Can anyone enlighten me? Her earlier stuff is definately as cryptic, but at least I thought once that I could understand some what some of it meant. It’s certainly often meant to be evocative and stream of thought most of the time. If you actually hear her describe what she thinks her songs mean, it sounds a little batty, so you’re better off interpreting it yourself. Take parasol: I think this one is pretty straightforward: there’s been some horrid news that someone has just gotten, and to cope they are reading into the calmness of a static picture on the wall (perhaps that famous ponitalist picture?) Under the Pink had some pretty out-there lyrics (Little Earthquakes is awesome, but I would say that Pink is the absolute height of music + lyrics). But for some reason, it all worked: all sorts of crazy images that somehow have a definately underlying emotional content. I think over time he’s become more conventional and coherent in the actual lyrics as written but also less coherent in the evocative meanings. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/27 "2005-03-11T20:40:09Z")
> [@Kizarvexius](#): > > I’m left very confused by some of the lyrics, though. Are they supposed to be utterly cryptic, or are they more easily parsed by her long-time fans? Sometimes in a while you can figure out what a song is about, but most of the time it’s cryptic to everybody. In my opinion she kind of speaks her own language when she writes, picks a lot of images and ideas that mean something to her and mean something in total, but you get more of a vibe than a literal understanding. **Apos** : when I read what she says about her own songs, I usually think she’s either overexplaining it, or that I have a better explanation. 😉 > [@](#): > > My favorite song, for example, is _Martha’s Foolish Ginger_, but I can’t figure out what on earth the title refers to. Can anyone enlighten me? There’s a gardening thing going on throughout the album, but past that I don’t have a clue. ---
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/28 "2005-03-11T20:49:46Z")
Tori does love the cryptic nature of her lyrics. If you go to a fan website called [“Here in my Head”](http://www.hereinmyhead.com/collect/lyrics.html) you can read the lyrics and see a collection of Tori’s comments about songs that help explain them. [Cornflake Girl](http://www.hereinmyhead.com/collect/under/utp8.html) being one of the more interesting: > [@](#): > > “I read the Alice Walker book, Possessing the Secret of Joy, and there’s umm, in that book, the mothers take the daughters to the butchers to have their, let’s say their genitalia removed. And even though it’s a patriarchal culture that she’s talking about, and that this custom was put into practice a long, long time ago by the patriarchy, it’s the mothers that take their daughters. And, what I was singing about was, it’s funny how from generation to generation women really betray each other in the ladies’ room. There is a whole secret society that happens, and a lot of times a mother will say ‘I’m doing this for your good’ whether it was binding the feet in the Eastern cultures or whether it’s marrying your daughter to this gangrene, smelly-breathed, old, decrepit, rotting scumbag that’s 80 years old with dough. ‘You know, this is really the best for you,’ when the truth is, it’s the best for everybody else. And, that’s an extreme of women’s relationships brought to just like, your girlfriend that you’re hanging out with, but betrayal is betrayal, and I was thrown in to many situations as I was reading that book where girls, my girls, we were just dissin’ each other. The things that we were doing, umm, it’s like I would have never imagined that we could be so unsupportive of each other, and it was just happening while I was reading this book, and Cornflake Girl is the betrayal really of girls.” ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/29 "2005-03-11T21:14:20Z")
Yeah, there’s a good exception. Helped me make sense of the song, which I think is one of her best. But if you read that and thought “what the hell does that have to do with Cornflakes?” I think I can provide the answer. [John Harvey Kellogg, the inventor of the corn flake](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Harvey_Kellogg) was a temperance nut, sort of like Sylvester Graham (of the Graham cracker). Unfortunately, this guy had a license to practice medicine. > [@Dr. Kellogg](#): > > A remedy for masturbation which is almost always successful in small boys is circumcision. The operation should be performed by a surgeon without administering an anesthetic, as the brief pain attending the operation will have a salutary effect upon the mind, especially if it be connected with the idea of punishment. In females, the author has found the application of pure carbolic acid to the clitoris an excellent means of allaying the abnormal excitement. So there’s the link back to the Alice Walker book. ---
**Author:** ![Baggins111](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9fc29f/32.png) [@Baggins111](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baggins111)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2005, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/30 "2005-03-12T02:35:07Z")
I was a big Tori Amos fan whith _Little Earthquakes._ Since then, I’ve been kinda, meh. Same stuff, same strife. Got a little old. I still download some of her live stuff from time to time. Still, I had never wanted to be a piano bench more in my life. ---
**Author:** ![Go\_You\_Big\_Red\_Fire\_Engine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/eada6e/32.png) [@Go\_You\_Big\_Red\_Fire\_Engine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Go_You_Big_Red_Fire_Engine)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2005, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/31 "2005-03-18T06:00:42Z")
I got it yesterday, I like it. I’m listening to Cars and Guitars right now, and I kinda don’t mind it. It’s ‘smoother’ than previous albums of hers. I’m a Boys Of Pelé fan, as well as Little Earthquakes. ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2005, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/32 "2005-03-18T09:48:23Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Sometimes in a while you can figure out what a song is about, but most of the time it’s cryptic to everybody. In my opinion she kind of speaks her own language when she writes, picks a lot of images and ideas that mean something to her and mean something in total, but you get more of a vibe than a literal understanding. > **Apos** : when I read what she says about her own songs, I usually think she’s either overexplaining it, or that I have a better explanation. 😉 > > There’s a gardening thing going on throughout the album, but past that I don’t have a clue. I have the special edition with the DVD on which she tries to explain some of the topics of the album. It has to do with the sacred femininity and Mary Magdalene and a bunch of other “Da Vinci Code”-ramblings. She also speaks of her songs as people who came to her and told her their story. I think it is best to not hear Tori speak about her songs and/or lyrics as she is about as batty as Charlie Manson (but a lot friendlier). ---
**Author:** ![PinkMarabou](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ec9cab/32.png) [@PinkMarabou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PinkMarabou)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2005, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/33 "2005-03-18T16:50:32Z")
(check my location, die-hard Tori fan here) I love Tori and all her albums for different reasons. ‘Under the Pink’ was obviously my favorite, but each of her albums have something unique to share about her quirkiness. I like her BECAUSE she’s not like everyone else and because her lyrics are cryptic and symbolic. Right now I haven’t gotten the whole CD yet, but I’ve bought _Sleeps With Butterflies_ and _The Beekeeper_ and I absolutely LOVE both songs. I think her maturity grows with each project and this one so far is incredible, but that’s just the opinion of someone who’s followed her from the beginning. YMMV ---
**Author:** ![Idlewild](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8491ac/32.png) [@Idlewild](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idlewild)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2005, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/34 "2005-03-18T17:02:00Z")
I love Parasol and find myself humming it all the damn time. Jamaica Inn is also getting dug into my brain. None of the other songs have really caught my attention yet but I’m enjoying the album in general, and it usually takes many listen-throughs for various songs on any album to jump out at me and grab me. Then again I _LOVE_ From the Choirgirl Hotel. So I’m probably atypical. ---
**Author:** ![Heart\_On\_My\_Sleeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/77aa72/32.png) [@Heart\_On\_My\_Sleeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heart_On_My_Sleeve)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2005, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/35 "2005-03-19T00:35:56Z")
I’ve listened to the album a little more, and my favorites right now are _Beekeeper, Parasol, Ireland, the one that goes “What I would have done…”_. She said something recently to the effect of that she’s 40 years old and angry music by a 40-year-old is just sad, but she fully supports younger women expressing anger through their music. As **Marley** said, sometimes it’s better to get a general feeling from the music rather than trying to understand the lyrics. ---
**Author:** ![JDeMobray](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/85e7bf/32.png) [@JDeMobray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JDeMobray)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2005, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355/36 "2005-03-19T04:17:03Z")
The first of her albums that I bought was “Little Earthquakes”, way the hell back when I was in high school. I loved it and love every subsequent album up to and including “From the Choirgirl Hotel.” Unfortunately, her work since then hasn’t done anything for me. “To Venus and Back” was probably the biggest disappointment but I’m not fond of “Scarlett’s Walk” or “The Beekeeper” either. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tori-amos-the-beekeeper/291355.md?page=1)