Well, running out to become Muslims would simply be an exchange of one set of former slavers for a different set of former slavers (with a few hold-outs hanging on until the present).
No one has argued that blacks in the U.S. are mostly Christian for any reason other than that Christianity was the only accepted outlet for their religious aspirations, so that is no big revelation.
Characterizing black Christianity as the “last badge of slavery,” however, is simply a way of imposing your attitudes on history. If a history of imposed religion negates all later developments of a people in regards to religious thought, then we should simply dismiss the thoughts of Kierkegaard, Rahner, Bonhoeffer, Niebuhr, (as well as Nietzsche and others who were negatively inspired by Christianity), since their ancestors were only converted at swordpoint. (We also might have to throw out Copernicus and a few others whose scientific efforts were prompted by religious considerations.)
Slavemasters usually were not the ones that directly introduced Christianity to their slaves. In fact they resisted that for many years (Things like the “Sermon on the Mount” could lead to a radical insurrection couldn’t they?) There were missionary groups - often from the north - that existed largely to convert slaves. After these missionaries sort of promised to not cause any trouble, the slave owners, and white society as a whole, did see the conversion of blacks to Christianity as a positive step, that brought “order” to the slave communities. http://www.ipl.org/ref/timeline/
(This source indicates black Americans didn’t become largely Christian until relatively late in Slavery’s history)
Also, many slave owners eventually justified slavery by pointing out the “civilizing” and “Christianizing” effects of slavery…just as Spaniards could justify carting off boatloads of gold from Mexico and Peru by stating they were “Christianizing” the Indians - and doing them the favor of taking away all that sin inducing wealth!
And believe it or not, a few blacks at that time agreed Ever read Phyllis Wheatley’s poems?. http://www.vcu.edu/engweb/eng384/philbase.htm
Interestingly, in Catholic slave holding areas (Cuba, Haiti, Brazil, Southern Louisiana) there was a greater possibilty for the continuation African beliefs behind a Christian facade. This is where “Voodoo”, Santeria, Candomble, and other religions come from. There is really no equivalent to this in the Protestant denominations in North America is there?
Someone mentioned Mexico and the countries to its south also having good reason to reject their imposed religion…Well many people in those areas, especially “Indians”, blacks, and poor mestizos ARE rejecting the Roman Catholic religion for various reasons, but instead of turning to Islam in large numbers (there are some Muslims in LatAm), they are mainly turning to other branches of Christianity. Some places such as Guatemala are nearly half Evangelical (Protestant, Pentecostal and Mormon) now.
I live in DC and am black and I totally understand booklover. One time I was walking back to my dorm at night and some guy stopped me and told me to slow down because I was “going to get to where [I was] going”. Then he said “Don’t worry, I’m a Christian. Say ‘isn’t it great to meet a fellow Christian’.” First of all, what made him assume that I was a Christian, and second, I don’t care what religion you are, I’m not stopping to talk to anyone in a strange neighborhood at night. And stuff like this:
…is so familiar.
I don’t know if this is specific to blacks though. I haven’t been around white elderlies (it seems like it’s mostly elderly people who say stuff like that) enough to make a comparison.
[quote]
The women to which booklover refers are attempting to make themselves feel happy and secure by patronizing him, putting him down by showing how close to God they are and, by extension, how much of a sinner he is.
[quote]
And
I’d have to disagree, in general. (I will not claim that the observation has no merit.)
I have had quite close contact with a number of (white, usually elderly) very Fundamentalist Christians who behave the way you’ve described. In their homes and among themselves they speak in exactly the same way. I never got the sense that they were exalting their own “perfect” natures. There were a few sanctimonious idiots, of course, but the majority of them truly believed that God had a hand in their personal lives on a daily basis and that there was nothing that gave them greater joy than to try to share the beliefs that brought them their sense of having been blessed.
As a surely damned papist, I was often treated to little homilies regarding the ways in which we should all repond to God’s word, but those talks were always inclusive, as they spoke of what we needed to do to respond to God. Even the crankiest, most sanctimonious bastard of them all never gave me the feeling that he was smugly rejoicing that he was “saved” while I was not.
I will not say that you have not encountered such spiritual snobbery, but I suspect that in general terms you have not understood the majority of these peoples’ intentions.
The same reason other people are deeply religious. They were probably raised in a religious environment. I would think that a lot of them are christian because whatever religion their ancestors happened to be was phased out after one or two generations.
Your definition of force and mine are obviously two different things. I don’t feel put out or offended when someone says “God Bless you” or “Praise Jesus.” I don’t see how you could call that forcing their beliefs on you.
istara said:
“What are spirituals? And what is the spiritual code?”
Spirituals are songs that enslaved blacks sang during and after slavery, and many are still sung in black churches now. Spirituals became more formally recognized by the mainstream American public through the establishment of the Fisk Jubilee Singers who toured in America and abroad and performed these songs for audiences. They are religious songs based on the Old and New Testament of the Bible: songs like “Go Down Moses,” “Steal Away to Jesus,” Swing Low, Sweet Chariot," and so on. Frederick Douglass in his Narrative mentions how the “slave songs” or spirituals really represented how sad the enslaved were, even though the slaveholders thought the enslaved folks were showing how happy they were by singing, and enslaved folks played on the slaveholders’ misperception of the motivation for their singing. As far as them being codes, no one is really sure what about the spirituals was code because the secret of the spiritual codes died with the enslaved folks who designed and used them. All that can be said about them is that they were a very efficient means of communicating directly among themselves in front of slaveholders.
kalt said:
“Black Christianity is the last badge of slavery.”
Um, not really. I think that the covert and overt racism that is unfortunately still alive and well now is the primary scar of slavery. If you understood what I posted earlier, I talked about how Christianity in the American South, where a large percentage of blacks live or have relatives, is very much a part of the culture for blacks and for whites. Generally in the black community, the church is a place where folks go to socialize as well as worship. While Christian concepts of Jesus and Moses certainly provided comfort, they also served as role models that blacks oppressed by slavery, lynching, and Jim Crow segregation could relate to because these figures, like them, suffered and managed to find a means to liberate themselves from evil. Christianity in the black community generally is not a scar of slavery, but rather just a cultural artifact that developed from the institution of slavery. In fact it is one of the primary institutions that has helped black people find a means of organizing and working to attain socio-political gains in America.
Guess I’m looking at it from the standpoint that archaeologists believe that humanity as we know it (what religious people refer to as “Adam & Eve”) originated in Africa. You’re right, that’s not Christianity—just the beginning of the bible, which I regard as an historical document.
True—white evangelical Christians probably behave in the same way. I think that it may be just the fact that I live in an area with a predominantly black population that it makes it SEEM that black people do it more…
I have to agree with ** Satyagraha **. I think it’s that, to me, this type of thing sounds very self-righteous and holier-than-thou. Thanks for helping w/the self-analysis, guys!
