# toward being a free man on the land **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 24, 2013, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826 "2013-06-24T21:31:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/241 "2013-06-25T17:21:28Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > No I’m not [HERE](http://www.devvy.com/notax.html) You are mistaken. Your cite is lying to you. In 2012, the federal government collected [$1.13 trillion dollars in individual income taxes](http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=203), and paid [$359.80 billion in interest on the debt.](http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/ir/ir_expense.htm) So the amount paid on interest on federal debt is slightly over a third of the federal revenue from individual income taxes. ---
**Author:** ![marcmcroy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@marcmcroy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marcmcroy)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/242 "2013-06-25T17:23:21Z")
> [@Running\_with\_Scissors](#): > > An anti-income-taxer, a 9/11 conspiracy theorist, and a birther, all in one. There’s someone I want to get reliable information from… > \ shhh… it’s alright, go back to sleep now. everything is alright ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/243 "2013-06-25T17:24:39Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > ah… the usurping dogma.Can it be questioned? [One Judge thinks so](http://www.sweetliberty.org/fourteenth.amend.htm) Judge L.H. Perez? The one who disagreed with the 14th Amendment because it was forcing his state (Louisiana) to outlaw segregation? You cal upon a racist for support? Why is this racist scumbag of a judge deemed to be a positive source for your delusional claims? FWIW, his opinion has not been supported by any other real judges. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/244 "2013-06-25T17:25:00Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > ah… the usurping dogma.Can it be questioned? [One Judge thinks so](http://www.sweetliberty.org/fourteenth.amend.htm) And that outweighs the large number of judges who think otherwise? Obviously, you haven’t noticed there’s a crackpot who will espouse any viewpoint possible no matter how idiotic. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/245 "2013-06-25T17:26:50Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > ah… the usurping dogma.Can it be questioned? [One Judge thinks so](http://www.sweetliberty.org/fourteenth.amend.htm) [Here’s the scoop on Leander Perez](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leander_Perez), racist and corrupt political boss. Great source, dude! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/246 "2013-06-25T17:27:39Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > shhh… it’s alright, go back to sleep now. everything is alright There are knowledgeable, informed and observant people here, and you are without a doubt not among them. ---
**Author:** ![Running\_with\_Scissors](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Running\_with\_Scissors](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Running_with_Scissors)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/247 "2013-06-25T17:30:14Z")
I also find it ironic that the medium you’re using to promulgate your anti-government screed is one that was initially funded by (wait for it) [the government](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANet). ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/248 "2013-06-25T17:32:05Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > No I’m not [HERE](http://www.devvy.com/notax.html) Dewy of the family Kidd? Is she the wife of the time cube guy? ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/249 "2013-06-25T17:46:08Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > the article was updated 2012 and yes there is a quote from 1984. Do you think we are spending less now.. C’mon Mate..really? Like so many others, I’m mocking you, having given up on debating you. Mate. ---
**Author:** ![marcmcroy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@marcmcroy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marcmcroy)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/250 "2013-06-25T17:48:41Z")
> [@Running\_with\_Scissors](#): > > I also find it ironic that the medium you’re using to promulgate your anti-government screed is one that was initially funded by (wait for it) [the government](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANet). wow, where did that come from…I’m not saying that certain instances are not without merit and that was around 40 or 50 years ago. we didn’t have the patriot act then either did we? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/251 "2013-06-25T17:50:33Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > shhh… it’s alright, go back to sleep now. everything is alright He’s not the person living in a fantasy world here. ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/252 "2013-06-25T17:56:45Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > Who created the law? Man. I am Man. I am the creator. Love is blind. God is love. Stevie Wonder is blind. Stevie Wonder is God. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/253 "2013-06-25T17:59:46Z")
Wow…6 pages for THIS??? :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/254 "2013-06-25T18:02:02Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > wow, where did that come from…I’m not saying that certain instances are not without merit and that was around 40 or 50 years ago. we didn’t have the patriot act then either did we? Have you decided yet what kind of cites you will accept from us? It can’t be _too_ high a standard, considering you quoted a racist corrupt political boss as an authority on the Constitution. ---
**Author:** ![marcmcroy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@marcmcroy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marcmcroy)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/255 "2013-06-25T18:12:21Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > There are knowledgeable, informed and observant people here, and you are without a doubt not among them. you don’t know what my talents are, Mr. Barbarian. To question matters and have curiosity is one of the signs of intelligence. I have seen parts of the world both better off financially, quality of life and yes more freedoms than this country.I have been party to orders from the powers that be, that has greatly affected many lives I have seen oppression to the likes the average person would not want to see. I have been the jackboot on the throat as well as the liberator. I am an American indigenous man. I am of an age that saw your liberties erode right in front of your eyes through statute after statute.If you are less than 55 years old all you have known has been a totalitarian regime in lieu of a free republic. The water temp is rising in the boiling pot of frogs and you don’t see it. Stay free as you can. Love and peace yea I’.m out ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/256 "2013-06-25T18:15:58Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Wow…6 pages for THIS??? :eek: New to this message board, are you? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/257 "2013-06-25T18:19:10Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > thats an assumption mate erroneous at that. > Contractual law is what its all about. You haven’t been keeping up. Let’s say someone walks up to my house and breaks a window before helping himself to my stuff. Sure, if I’m on the spot and armed, I’ll do my best to fight him off; failing that, though, I’ll of course go to the authorities and say I’d like to press charges. (And should he be caught, I of course hope the judge and jury will follow my lead in refusing to listen if he says he’s immune to prosecution by dint of failing to consent or contract or whatever.) Let’s say someone walks up to your house – and let’s say he makes off with some of your stuff if you’re not around, or maybe he breaks some of your bones if you’re there and he feels like it. What do you do? (And, at that: what do you do if the authorities apprehend that guy, only to have him politely inform them that he is Man The Creator, or some such?) ---
**Author:** ![Running\_with\_Scissors](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Running\_with\_Scissors](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Running_with_Scissors)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/258 "2013-06-25T18:20:11Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > I am of an age that saw your liberties erode right in front of your eyes through statute after statute.If you are less than 55 years old all you have known has been a totalitarian regime in lieu of a free republic. The water temp is rising in the boiling pot of frogs and you don’t see it. Stay free as you can. > Love and peace > yea I’.m out I see this claim from the far-right all the time. Pray tell, what liberties have been lost? Are you sure you know what a totalitarian regime is? (I’m not going to claim that the US or US Government is perfect, far from it, but I’m still of the opinion that the government does much more good than harm). ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/259 "2013-06-25T18:20:34Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > If you are less than 55 years old all you have known has been a totalitarian regime in lieu of a free republic. So what happened exactly, in the middle of Eisenhower’s second term that made the US go from a free republic to a totalitarian regime? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826/260 "2013-06-25T18:21:33Z")
> [@marcmcroy](#): > > you don’t know what my talents are, Mr. Barbarian. To question matters and have curiosity is one of the signs of intelligence. I have seen parts of the world both better off financially, quality of life and yes more freedoms than this country.I have been party to orders from the powers that be, that has greatly affected many lives I have seen oppression to the likes the average person would not want to see. I have been the jackboot on the throat as well as the liberator. I am an American indigenous man. I am of an age that saw your liberties erode right in front of your eyes through statute after statute.If you are less than 55 years old all you have known has been a totalitarian regime in lieu of a free republic. The water temp is rising in the boiling pot of frogs and you don’t see it. Stay free as you can. > Love and peace > yea I’.m out Despite any claims to the contrary, this person does not represent the American people as a whole, either officially or unofficially, and most of us are as appalled as you at this level of delusionary ignorance. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toward-being-a-free-man-on-the-land/661826.md?page=14)