# Toyota's latest sub-compact gets a serious beat down from Consumer Reports **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 6, 2012, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811 "2012-09-06T00:27:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![wheresmymind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/91b2a8/32.png) [@wheresmymind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wheresmymind)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2012, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811/21 "2012-10-12T18:57:12Z")
> [@redtail23](#): > > I regularly got over 40 mpg in the Sprint. I barely get 35 mpg in my Civic. And I drive MUCH more conservatively than I used to. Ok, so I looked up the specs for a 1987 Sprint and a 2011 Honda Civic LX sedan, a middle-of-the-road trim level. I don’t know exactly what models you had/have, but this should be enlightening: The Sprint weighed in the neighborhood of 1500 lbs. It had roughly 50 hp, and made it from 0-60 mph in around 15 seconds. Now the Civic only gets around 35 mpg highway, maybe 10-20% less than the Sprint. **BUT** the Civic weighs about 2,700 lbs, nearly double the Sprint. It has 140 horses that push it from 0-60 in about 8 seconds. It’s also about 30 inches longer, is taller and wider, and I’m sure in general is a more comfortable car. The fact that this car gets even close to as many mpg as the Sprint (which is basically a toy in comparison) is amazing. ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2012, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811/22 "2012-10-12T21:58:27Z")
I sat in one of these, but didn’t drive it. I wanted to compare it to my Fiat 500. The iQ seemed small inside. I feel bad for the people I stuff into my back seat in my 500, but I couldn’t figure out why they bothered putting in seats for the Scion. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2012, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811/23 "2012-10-14T17:36:52Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > It appears that the only benefit is fitting into a shoebox sized parking space. Which is a _huge_ advantage in some places. Admittedly, more so in Europe and Asia than US. > [@](#): > > You start cutting chunks of car away, people expect to get some kind of savings, either in purchase price, fuel or both. People are used to paying _more_ for small size when it comes to electronics. Phones, laptops, etc - generally the more compact models, are more expensive. Why don’t people accept the same for cars? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2012, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811/24 "2012-10-15T12:46:57Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > People are used to paying _more_ for small size when it comes to electronics. Phones, laptops, etc - generally the more compact models, are more expensive. Why don’t people accept the same for cars? Cars are more like TVs and houses than they are like cellphones and laptops. There isn’t a whole lot of bleeding edge miniaturization going on when they make a smaller model, it’s simply using smaller versions of current technology. Smaller engine, smaller tires, smaller body panels. When we look at the typical slate of car models, the cheapest car is always the smallest car with the smallest engine. Price goes up as you increase size, get larger engines and add luxury features. These ultra-compact cars seem to break that mold. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2012, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811/25 "2012-10-15T15:53:09Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > There isn’t a whole lot of bleeding edge miniaturization going on when they make a smaller model, it’s simply using smaller versions of current technology. I would think designing a supermini that passes the crash test takes a lot more engineering work than designing a 2-ton SUV that does the same. Also, piston engines don’t scale down all that well, do they? I thought larger engines tended to be more energy-efficient. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2012, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811/26 "2012-10-15T21:48:03Z")
> [@thirdname](#): > > Cars in the 80’s were much smaller, lighter, less safe, and slower. You could get impressive mileage today in an 1800-pound car that takes 13 seconds to get to 60 mph, but not many people would buy it. There are also a fuckload more safety requirements for cars that are mandatory for the vehicle to be sold. Most of them end up putting more weight on the car and affecting performance in other ways. Thus, manufacturers have to work on new ways to shave weight off and improve performance while meeting safety (and EPA) regulations to get mpg improved. [sub]I own a 2012 Ford Fiesta hatch an it’s the bestest car ever. Then again, I was waiting impatiently for it since I first heard they were bringing it over from Europe and NOT fucking it up. I generally get 38-39.5 mpg combined. [/sub] ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811/27 "2012-11-02T00:57:33Z")
> [@wheresmymind](#): > > Ok, so I looked up the specs for a 1987 Sprint and a 2011 Honda Civic LX sedan, a middle-of-the-road trim level. I don’t know exactly what models you had/have, but this should be enlightening: > > The Sprint weighed in the neighborhood of 1500 lbs. It had roughly 50 hp, and made it from 0-60 mph in around 15 seconds. > > Now the Civic only gets around 35 mpg highway, maybe 10-20% less than the Sprint. **BUT** the Civic weighs about 2,700 lbs, nearly double the Sprint. It has 140 horses that push it from 0-60 in about 8 seconds. It’s also about 30 inches longer, is taller and wider, and I’m sure in general is a more comfortable car. The fact that this car gets even close to as many mpg as the Sprint (which is basically a toy in comparison) is amazing. this, for the love of god, this. people just don’t seem to comprehend how _different_ modern cars are from past models. I mean, my first car had a 2.2 liter 4-banger which wheezed out 80 hp on a good day, weighed 2200 lbs, and if I got into anything approaching a serious collision would have left me with critical injuries. A “compact” car nowadays can barely get under 3,000 lbs, has multiple airbags, has to comply with NHTSA crash standards (which implies thick-ass doors and pillars) and- if they don’t want a PR nightmare- has to do well on the IIHS offset frontal impact test as well as the new slide-into-a-tree test they cooked up. It also has to basically emit _nothing_ but carbon dioxide and water vapor; your carbureted 1987 Sprint was disgustingly _filthy_ in comparison. Put simply, you can be driving a shit-shaker like a Smart car, get into an offset 40-mph frontal collision with something like a Benz S-class, and reasonably expect to walk away. And the things which make that possible add weight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/toyotas-latest-sub-compact-gets-a-serious-beat-down-from-consumer-reports/633811.md?page=1)