# Tracy Morgan in critical condition after an accident **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 7, 2014, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272 "2014-06-07T12:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2014, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/61 "2014-06-08T23:29:37Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I was trying to explain why I felt this driver wasn’t doing anything more reckless or unusual than other drivers on the road that night. The problem of sleepy driving is well known and studied. I gave cites and links to statistics. Criminalizing a normal and unavoidable human response (to fatigue) just doesn’t make sense. Unless this guy’s logbooks show he was driving longer than the rules allow. Truck drivers do follow stricter rules than other drivers. > > I was just surprised because usually these types of charges are for deliberate acts. DUI’s, speeding etc. They typically don’t throw sleepy drivers into prison for causing accidents. We’d have to build a lot more prisons if we did. [Tucker Carlson? Is that you](http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/06/08/tucker-carlson-defends-trucker-after-tracy-morgan-crash-sleep-driving-not-always-reckless/)? ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2014, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/62 "2014-06-08T23:57:36Z")
I’m not surprised others agree with me. Tucker sounds like quite an intelligent fellow. 😃 They had an update on ABC news about Tracy. Broke nose,ribs, and leg. He’s going to hurting for awhile. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/63 "2014-06-09T03:39:59Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I’m not surprised others agree with me. Tucker sounds like quite an intelligent fellow. 😃 > > They had an update on ABC news about Tracy. Broke nose,ribs, and leg. He’s going to hurting for awhile. Ya think? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/64 "2014-06-09T15:54:11Z")
[Police say the truck driver hadn’t slept in more than 24 hours.](http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tracy-morgan-crash-trucker-was-awake-over-24-hours-cops-n126221) Operating a tractor trailer without sleeping for more than a full day in violation of the law is the kind of thing that can happen to anybody! ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/65 "2014-06-09T16:04:40Z")
That information changes everything. Now the charges make sense. Why didn’t the cops release this rather important information yesterday? It would have prevented a lot of needless debate across the internet. I’ve seen arguments in the comment section of several news articles. Saying pretty much what was said in this thread. Some like me, questioning the charges and others supporting them. A total waste of everyone’s time. Drop by my house and I’ll treat everybody to a cold beer. 😉 or open one of your own. No need to pass up an opportunity for cold beer. Sorry for wasting everyones time this past weekend. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/66 "2014-06-09T16:10:21Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > That information changes everything. Now the charges make sense. > > Why didn’t the cops release this rather important information yesterday? It would have prevented a lot of needless debate across the internet. I’ve seen arguments in the comment section of several news articles. Saying pretty much what was said in this thread. Some like me questioning the charges and others supporting them. A total waste of everyone’s time. You decided, without any facts to justify your claim, that the police had grossly overcharged the driver, and that is the police’s fault? You decided that you knew better, without any facts, than the people with all of that facts? And they had some sort of obligation to release all of the facts right away so you wouldn’t look like an idiot? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/67 "2014-06-09T16:11:26Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Why didn’t the cops release this rather important information yesterday? Because it was Sunday and their job of telling the public is secondary to their job of investigating the accident. They said several days ago that the driver was tired and the charges were serious, which should have told you something. > [@](#): > > A total waste of everyone’s time. Some of us wasted more time than others. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/68 "2014-06-09T16:15:40Z")
My entire argument was based on the facts reported last weekend. I mentioned several times that truck drivers are required to keep a log book to enter rest periods and other information. Obviously that log book makes all the difference. I completely agree with the charges now that the facts are accurately reported. At least I’m in good company. A lot of people across the internet got suckered by the way this story got reported. To list extremely serious charges with no reason for them did seem wrong. Now we know the truth. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/69 "2014-06-09T16:36:08Z")
Just so people know what truckers use.[Heres a standard daily log book page.](http://www.davisinjurylawfirm.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/truck-driver-log-book.jpg) Theres an area where they indicate off duty times, rest times in the sleeper berth, and driving time. They also enter the miles driven on that day. They probably have electronic logs now. But the older guys may still use the paper sheets. GPS can be used to track when the truck is moving. If the log claims the driver was sleeping then its probably a fraudulent entry. ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/70 "2014-06-09T16:42:03Z")
When you see that there are serious charges, what’s more reasonable, to assume that you don’t have all the information, or to assume that the driver has been overcharged? Whenever a story sounds funny to me, my first assumption is that I don’t have all the information. It could be the information about just how tired the driver was, was not released, because he hadn’t been driving for 24 hours, but had been awake doing something else, and while the police suspected that his story was fishy from the beginning, and the DA chose to hit him with serious charges to make sure he stayed in jail, it took a few days to confirm through witness interviews and other evidence, an exact timeline of the driver’s activities 24 hours before the accident. It’s better to hold back the information until it is confirmed, than release it, and have it turn out to be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/71 "2014-06-09T16:45:13Z")
A lot of people on the internet spoke to soon. It happens to everybody, but it’s also preventable in a lot of cases. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/72 "2014-06-09T16:49:33Z")
Any discussion on a thread is based on what ever the press is reporting. Its understood that as new information comes out that opinions or positions on an issue will change. Thats true of water cooler conversations at work too. What we said Friday in the break room (about a news report) may change in Monday’s conversation. It would be pretty boring to say “gee I don’t agree with this issue in the news” but lets sit around a day or two and see what gets reported then. I should have qualified my remarks about the trucker. Said, maybe new info will come out in a few days. I just didn’t think about adding that to my post. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/73 "2014-06-09T18:25:39Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Any discussion on a thread is based on what ever the press is reporting. Its understood that as new information comes out that opinions or positions on an issue will change. Thats true of water cooler conversations at work too. What we said Friday in the break room (about a news report) may change in Monday’s conversation. > > It would be pretty boring to say “gee I don’t agree with this issue in the news” but lets sit around a day or two and see what gets reported then. > > I should have qualified my remarks about the trucker. Said, maybe new info will come out in a few days. I just didn’t think about adding that to my post. But when you’re reading reports of an incident, you don’t know as much about the incident as the people who are actually present. So you need to remember that when you have a different assessment of the situation than the people at the scene have, their assessment is almost certainly based on more information than yours is. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/74 "2014-06-09T18:44:44Z")
> [@Small\_Hen](#): > > What is ridiculously over the top about saying that drivers are almost certainly ‘a little sleepy?’ at one am? Sounds pretty reasonable, even likely to me. Apparently you didn’t read the post I quoted. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/75 "2014-06-09T18:45:17Z")
[QUOTE=aceplace57] I should have qualified my remarks about the trucker. Said, maybe new info will come out in a few days. I just didn’t think about adding that to my post. [/QUOTE] Yeah, that would have saved a bit of trouble, especially if you’d not tried to back it up with distracting cites about tired drivers. Semi drivers should never be tired. For the record, I never thought he might have been undercharged. If you’re piloting a vehicle that can weigh upwards of 80,000lbs\*, with marginal stopping power, and upwards of 1500hp; you’re working in an area where a different set of laws apply than most drivers, with much more strict responsibilities. Due to those much more strict laws and responsibilities, I had assumed he had crossed the line at some point in the last 24 hours, and merited a charge. He had screwed up in piloting a very dangerous vehicle, and people had died. Any infraction on the regulations would have been enough to bring some sort of charge. In light of the extreme time he had gone without sleep (_more_ than 24 fucking hours, seriously?\*\*), I’m surprised he’s not charged with murder instead of what seems to be manslaughter. \*Your car weights around 4,500lbs if it’s a behemoth. Small, older cars can easily weigh around 2,000lbs. Most cars are somewhere in between. Besides speed, the destructive power in a crash is determined by weight, which is present no matter what speed you are going. Add that weight to the problems of driving a trailered (possibly multi-trailered) vehicle, and it adds up to a very complex vehicle. Truck drivers don’t really get the responsibility and respect of a ship’s captain, but it approaches it. \*\*I work 12 hour overnight shifts. I’m one of those people who would be crisp and quick at 1 am, because I woke up at 8pm. After a 12 hour shift, and having been up for around 15 hours, I’ve occasionally been very glad I drive a car which brakes well and has plenty of nanny state safeties to keep it straight and true. If I drove a semi in even that state, I should be charged with something. 24 hours without sleep is inexcusable, even if you’re driving a Lotus 7. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/76 "2014-06-09T18:50:34Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > When you see that there are serious charges, what’s more reasonable, to assume that you don’t have all the information, or to assume that the driver has been overcharged? Whenever a story sounds funny to me, my first assumption is that I don’t have all the information. > [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But when you’re reading reports of an incident, you don’t know as much about the incident as the people who are actually present. So you need to remember that when you have a different assessment of the situation than the people at the scene have, their assessment is almost certainly based on more information than yours is. It’s also possible, of course, that the people at the scene are acting pursuant to some sort of bias or other unfairness that is deserving of question. If the public had not questioned the detectives’ initial decision not to charge George Zimmerman but rather had assumed that those detectives must have been acting properly based upon having more facts available to them, the full circumstances of Trayvon Martin’s death might never have been explored. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/77 "2014-06-09T19:01:46Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > That information changes everything. Now the charges make sense. > > Why didn’t the cops release this rather important information yesterday? It would have prevented a lot of needless debate across the internet. I’ve seen arguments in the comment section of several news articles. Gosh, yes. We need more government attention to reducing needless debate in the internet and preventing ill-informed posts in comments sections. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/78 "2014-06-09T19:07:27Z")
I drive a Fiat500L the 4 door, and I was in an accident on Thursday. I was travelling in the far left lane, on a 4 lane stretch one way in the city. The Kenworth that slammed into me made an illegal lane change and pushed my car up onto the grass of an apartment building. The Police said I missed a pole by about a foot. On inpact my tire blew out. And this was just in the City, going the speed limit. This was in broad daylight, a gorgeous day, still my car got screwed. The driver was charged, Police didn’t say with what, most likely illegal lane change or it could have been careless driving. Regardless there were lots of witnesses, and I was sent to hospital by ambulance, checked over and released. I’m okay, no broken bones, incredibly lucky no one was in the passenger seat. It was a bloody tank hitting me, but the car stayed upright and kept me okay. If we were going faster or on a highway the outcome would have been a lot different. It’s not just about being sleepy or impaired, it’s about being alert. My heart goes out to all those in that van and anyone else who was hurt or killed due to carelessness. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/79 "2014-06-09T19:11:26Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > and upwards of 1500hp; I assume you mean lb-ft of torque. The most powerful semi tractor only puts out about 700hp. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272/80 "2014-06-09T19:25:56Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > “death by auto” and “assault by auto” are the standard charges when the driver has been driving drunk or driving quite recklessly, or speeding substantially (20 plus miles over the speed limit…). Some of us feel these make the driver substantially more culpable than driving when a bit drowsy. Don’t you? No, because driving while drowsy can make you every bit as impaired as being full out drunk while driving. If you’re starting to get drowsy or nodding off _pull off the road_. I’ve had several people I care about in my life fall asleep at the wheel. So far the fallout has been a broken neck, traumatic brain injury, fractured wrist, shattered ribs, several concussions and a lot of guilt and second guessing. Thank Og no one was killed but the one with the TBI is never going to be right in the head again so may he’s not that much better off than in the ground, I don’t know. In every instance the result was a car going off the road and flipping over/rolling multiple times. In every instance people had to be cut out of crumpled cars. The driver was “only a little drowsy” but they weren’t little accidents. This attitude that drowsy driving isn’t serious reminds of 1960’s attitudes about people driving around only a little drunk. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tracy-morgan-in-critical-condition-after-an-accident/690272.md?page=5)