# Trading Spaces 6/14, Or the Real Hildi Returns **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 15, 2003, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945 "2003-06-15T02:05:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![BiblioCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@BiblioCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BiblioCat)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/61 "2003-06-17T16:56:28Z")
Oh, yeah, part of it is scripted, but I don’t think TPTB knew Crying Pam was going to react the way she did. My God, it was just a wooden surround… and it wasn’t even attached, was it? IIRC, it was just standing in front of the fireplace. She was just a bitch. Same with Jackass Jessie. Laurie showed up with brown paint (taupe or tan, really) but the neighbors went along with it, saying she didn’t like brown after they started painting. Since it hadn’t been on her application that she hated brown, she was shit-outta-luck. There was one from a couple weeks ago when Vern wanted to paint the furniture black, but the HO had said, “Anything but painting my furniture black”, and the neighbors did step in and say no, so Vern was quite willing to change his plan. None of the other designers would have changed their minds as willingly as Vern did. Amazingly, he had extra paint in another color. ---
**Author:** ![Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linus_Van_Pelt)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/62 "2003-06-17T17:19:01Z")
I would love to find out how the show is presented to the home owners. If the producers tell them simply that they may not like the designs but that the designers are doing their best for them even though they are on record as stating that they want one dissapointment in ten results, then they are, IMHO, not negotiating in good faith and _should_ be liable. If, on the other hand, the producers’ intentions are spelled out to the home owners ahead of time but the desire to be on TV overrides all other concerns, than any sympathy that I have for them goes right out the window. Oh, and I tried to click on your Television Without Pity link **BiblioCat** , but I’m afraid you misspelled the url. For anyone else who’s trying to go there, [try this link instead.](http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com) ---
**Author:** ![BiblioCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@BiblioCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BiblioCat)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/63 "2003-06-17T17:26:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Linus Van Pelt \* > \*\*Oh, and I tried to click on your Television Without Pity link **BiblioCat** , but I’m afraid you misspelled the url. For anyone else who’s trying to go there, [try this link instead.](http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com) \*\* :smack: Sorry. I do know how to spell, just not today, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linus_Van_Pelt)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/64 "2003-06-17T17:46:49Z")
Happy to be of service. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/65 "2003-06-17T18:07:15Z")
> [@](#): > > If the producers tell them simply that they may not like the designs but that the designers are doing their best for them even though they are on record as stating that they want one dissapointment in ten results, then they are, IMHO, not negotiating in good faith and should be liable. > > If, on the other hand, the producers’ intentions are spelled out to the home owners ahead of time but the desire to be on TV overrides all other concerns, than any sympathy that I have for them goes right out the window. Agreed the show and the HO should both bargain in good faith, but I don’t know how much more clear than “you have no say over what goes on in your own house” the producers would need to be. Especially now that the show is in what, its third season, and the HOs are all self-referential to the point of starting to interfere with my enjoyment of the show. ---
**Author:** ![Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linus_Van_Pelt)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/66 "2003-06-17T18:23:30Z")
Yes, but there’s a big difference between “you have no say but we’ll try to do our best” and “you have no say and, BTW, our goal is to really screw one in ten of you because we think it’ll make good television.” I was one of the people who, naivlely, assumed that the designers, though occasionally arrogant, or idiots, or both, still were doing their best for the home owners. ---
**Author:** ![SeGate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ac8455/32.png) [@SeGate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeGate)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/67 "2003-06-17T20:31:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BiblioCat \* > \*\*Oh, yeah, part of it is scripted, but I don’t think TPTB knew Crying Pam was going to react the way she did. My God, it was just a wooden surround… and it wasn’t even attached, was it? IIRC, it was just standing in front of the fireplace. She was just a bitch. > > \*\* [Check here for some details about that particular incident…](http://www.wingfieldfans.org/douglas_wilson/article.asp?pubid=68) It seems that there was more going on than met the eye. I’m sorry I can’t find the link, but I read somewhere else that the wooden surround also covered the gas shut off (a big no-no). I thought she overreacted a bit, but after reading how it all went down, I don’t really blame her. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/68 "2003-06-17T20:46:51Z")
She did a room sort of Victorian-with red chintz-and the linens and walls were the same. VERY 19th century. Very elegant. BTW-did they get their bathroom wall fixed? I’d have killed her! ---
**Author:** ![Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linus_Van_Pelt)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/69 "2003-06-17T21:20:54Z")
From the article linked by **SeGate** : > [@](#): > > “The designers get the specs and pictures for the room, and they come up with a design plan and a vision for the room,” said Denise Cramsey, the show’s executive producer. “Doug has a modern and cosmopolitan taste. His vision did not include a fireplace with pink brick. He wanted to paint it white. I said, ‘You cannot. It’s protected.’ He got a little bit upset about that.” Later in the same article: > [@](#): > > “Now I want to paint the fireplace,” Wilson tells the Jobes. > > “No way,” counters Laureen. > > He persists. > > She insists. It would all be great anyway, she tells him. > > “I’m not happy,” he says. > [@](#): > > The Puyallup couples felt Wilson set them up to create tension. Cramsey said that wasn’t the intention. > > “Doug being Doug and the character that he is, he could not let that go without making a scene,” she said. “Then, once the idea of the fireplace was introduced, from a storytelling vantage, we had to find a way to have Doug change his mind on camera.” Let’s see if I have this straight: [ul] [li]They agree before they start that the fireplace was protected.[/li][li]Doug tries to talk the couple into painting the fireplace anyway, even though he knows it’s off limits (I wonder what he would have done if they had agreed).[/li][li]Having “introduced” the fireplace, they had to resolve it for “storytelling” reasons.[/ul][/li]So Doug introduces something he knows they can’t do so that he can show how upset he is then “fix” the problem. Tell me again how this isn’t a set-up? ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/70 "2003-06-17T21:29:05Z")
See, Doug could have handled that better…“I know the HO’s don’t want the fireplace painted, so we’re going to do something else.” No agnst, no stress. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/71 "2003-06-17T22:20:23Z")
Also, painting brick-according to my father, once you paint brick, that’s it-you have to keep it that way. YOu can’t change your mind, and it requires a lot of touch ups over the years. It seems according to the article linked, Dough did it on purpose to be a jackass, and at one point, the way the fireplace was done, it came close to combusting. You know, maybe she overreacted, but didn’t she also just find out a family member was terminally ill that day? Then there was Hildi, doing a totally inappropriate room for CHILDREN! ---
**Author:** ![jacquilynne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/67e7ee/32.png) [@jacquilynne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jacquilynne)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/72 "2003-06-17T22:34:07Z")
> [@](#): > > It seems that there was more going on than met the eye. I’m sorry I can’t find the link, but I read somewhere else that the wooden surround also covered the gas shut off (a big no-no). I thought she overreacted a bit, but after reading how it all went down, I don’t really blame her. \*\* All of the things that people use as mitigating factors, though, are stuff she could not possibly have noticed during the reveal. Covered gas shut offs, the sawdust behind the surround, the Doug/friend fight over painting, etc are all technical details that she didn’t know about at the time. And honestly, I don’t fault her for crying over it, I’m sure it was an emotionally charged moment. But the nastiness in the way she treated her friend during the other reveal was just too much. There must be a significant amount of time between the two reveals, and anything more than 5 or 10 minutes should have been enough to either a) pull herself together well enough to treat her friend civilly or b) decline to participate in the second reveal. ---
**Author:** ![BiblioCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@BiblioCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BiblioCat)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2003, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/73 "2003-06-17T22:47:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Guinastasia \* > \*\*Also, painting brick-according to my father, once you paint brick, that’s it-you have to keep it that way. YOu can’t change your mind, and it requires a lot of touch ups over the years. > \*\* No, you can remove paint from brick. My neighbor’s house had been painted white (exterior brick) and they had the paint removed, no harm done. It was pretty expensive, though, but that was a whole house. Also, the house I grew up in had a painted fireplace surround when we moved in, many layers of paint, and my parents had the paint removed when I was about 12 or 13. They had a professional painter do it, and I remember it was a really stinky process. It was really pretty dark red brick underneath. ---
**Author:** ![js\_africanus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@js\_africanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/js_africanus)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2003, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/74 "2003-06-18T02:20:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BiblioCat \* > \*\*No, you can remove paint from brick. \*\* On the other hand, in every episode of TS where they have painted brick one of three looks have obtained: Prison Chique, Elementary School Dungeon, or Dorm Room Shit Hole. I don’t know why they insist on painting brick. ---
**Author:** ![jacquilynne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/67e7ee/32.png) [@jacquilynne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jacquilynne)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2003, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/75 "2003-06-18T12:57:01Z")
Because almost all of those are more attractive than brick? Brick, especially Brick that hasn’t been well maintained and cleaned, is dominating and hideous. It looks fine on the outside of houses, but inside a house it’s overpowering. So if your ugly brick fireplace becomes an ugly white brick fireplace, at least it fades into the walls a bit. ---
**Author:** ![BiblioCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@BiblioCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BiblioCat)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2003, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945/76 "2003-06-18T13:02:53Z")
I think that’s matter of personal taste. I’d prefer unpainted brick if it’s regular red brick. I didn’t care for Crying Pam’s pink brick. That would have looked better painted. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trading-spaces-6-14-or-the-real-hildi-returns/181945.md?page=3)