# Traditional Values Coalition tries to stop AIDS research **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 3, 2003, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192 "2003-11-03T18:10:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![musicguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ba0ec/32.png) [@musicguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/musicguy)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/1 "2003-11-03T18:10:10Z")
From the Washington Post: > [@](#): > > A coalition of conservative church groups said yesterday that it will ask the Justice Department to investigate how scores of research studies relating to health and sexuality gained federal funding through the National Institutes of Health. > > An NIH official said the studies, including several aimed at documenting the behaviors of prostitutes, intravenous drug users and others at high risk of spreading sexually transmitted diseases, are an important part of an effort to devise better public health and education strategies. But the coalition called them “smarmy projects” representing at least $100 million in wasted federal money. It isn’t bad enough that these people want to dictate to people how they should live their lives. Now they want all research that they deem unworthy (basically AIDS researchand anything related to sexuality) to be stopped. Are they that afraid that science might discover a cure to this disease? Are they that afraid that science might someday determine that a person doesn’t choose to be gay? Can’t these people just mind their own business and not try to dictate how scientific research should be conducted or what should be studied? What are their scientific credentials? Well, lets see what the director of this group has to say about their credentials" > [@](#): > > Andrea Lafferty is the executive director of the Traditional Values Coalition, which she says represents more than 43,000 churches. > > “What makes us unique among all the conservative groups,” she said, “is that I believe we truly represent the body of Christ.” Ah, so you have the truth and nobody else does. How arrogant can you be. She goes on to explain the reasoning behind this campaign… > [@](#): > > “We never said any grant on there was bad,” said Ms. Lafferty. But she said she wanted to know why the grants were being funded, and why so many had to do with H.I.V. and AIDS. > > Ms. Lafferty acknowledged that her group has a problem with homosexuality. “We’re concerned that it’s a behavior-based lifestyle, that you’re not born that way,” she said. > > She insisted that the coalition does not oppose research on H.I.V. and AIDS, but added, “How many times do you have to study something to find out how to stop the spread of AIDS?” Uh, how’s about we try to find a cure. Wouldn’t that be just a little more effective than telling people not to fuck anymore. > [@](#): > > Alan Leshner, chief executive officer of the American Association for the Advancement of Science, the nation’s largest general science organization, warned that society would suffer if religious values were to influence federal health priorities. “We can’t have moralizing and ideology trump science when it comes to protecting the public health,” Leshner said. “It’s vitally important that we understand the processes by which public health problems spread if we’re ever going to get a handle on issues as important as HIV/AIDS and drug abuse.” ---
**Author:** ![Rashak\_Mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@Rashak\_Mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rashak_Mani)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/2 "2003-11-03T18:31:24Z")
We should stop researching cures for old age ailments too… after all grandpa and grandma will die anyway won’t they ? Genetic defects ? God’s will. Leukemia ? Fate… Divorce ? Devil’s work. I agree totally with the OP. These people want everyone acting in the same morality they practice. Never mind endangered young teens who don’t get adequate sex-ed because it offends religious sensibilities to teach that in school. ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/3 "2003-11-03T18:41:51Z")
> [@](#): > > What makes us unique among all the conservative groups," she said, “is that I believe we truly represent the body of Christ.” yes, but too bad they don’t represent the brain of Christ, otherwise they’d realize he’s about love, not hate. Not that i think there is a whole brain among all the members of that group combined. ---
**Author:** ![Taran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Taran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Taran)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/4 "2003-11-03T18:50:21Z")
> [@](#): > > “What makes us unique among all the conservative groups,” she said, “is that I believe we truly represent the body of Christ.” This is just silly. _Lots_ of people believe that they truly represent the body of Christ. There’s nothing unique about it. ---
**Author:** ![carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrot)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/5 "2003-11-03T19:04:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Taran \* > \*\*This is just silly. _Lots_ of people believe that they truly represent the body of Christ. There’s nothing unique about it. \*\* Yes, but what makes _them_ unique is that _she_ believes they represent the body of Christ. Hers is a very important opinion, you know. ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/6 "2003-11-03T19:34:17Z")
The political reality to this thing is pretty simple and pretty stark. At present the national government is in the hands of a possibly temporary coalition of fiscal conservatives (Country Club Republicans) and social conservatives (Evangelical Republicans). Neither can gain their ends without the support of the other. Some might suggest that all the social conservatives are going to gain is lip service, a bully pulpit and the few crumbs that the coalition can throw them without infuriating the Country Club types. The Country Club Republicans are perfectly happy for their daughters to abort unwanted children, to play an occasional game of Black Jack at a licensed casino, and to watch the occasional dirty movie. Thus it serves the Country Club types’s interests to tolerate some bitching and moaning about AIDS research, prohibit the occasional and not terribly important abortion procedure, decry the lack of mandatory worship services in public schools and generally point with dismay at the general decline in public morals and the spread of tolerance of what was once generally regarded as deviant behavior. Without the Evangelical Republicans the Country Club Republicans can not get the tax reductions, weakened regulation of business and industry, crippled government and autocratic police powers they want. The real question is how long the Country Club Republicans will put up with the sometimes goofy social agenda of the Evangelicals and how long will it take the Evangelicals to figure out that they are not making significant progress toward their social goals. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/7 "2003-11-03T19:41:19Z")
you’re acting as if this is an unusual stance. This is just part of the ‘you made your bed now lie in it’ continuum, that has other strands as well, such as: 1. Organ transplants should include some level of ‘why do they need an organ’, so that the liver goes to some one who didn’t choose to burn out their own due to decades of abuse (don’t think it doesn’t happen? I recall lots of editorializing about David Crosby, Larry Hagman etc. when they were on the transplant lists). 2. Anything over ‘three hots and a cot’ treatment for prisoners. 3. Persons recieving public assistance buying things the observer thinks they don’t need. etc ---
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/8 "2003-11-03T20:20:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tars Tarkas \* > \*\*yes, but too bad they don’t represent the brain of Christ, otherwise they’d realize he’s about love, not hate. Not that i think there is a whole brain among all the members of that group combined. \*\* That is sooo good. (I may be quoting you in the future on that one 😉 ) ---
**Author:** ![musicguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ba0ec/32.png) [@musicguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/musicguy)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/9 "2003-11-03T20:36:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wring \* > \*\*you’re acting as if this is an unusual stance. \*\* No, not unusual, just repulsive. If these people had their way, we wouldn’t have any need for scientists, with all of their silly stem cell and AIDS research and such. Who needs cures, especially when you are just trying to cure people who wouldn’t be in their current situation if they had only read the bible more. There is nothing science can do that faith can’t do better. Well, unless you are talking about removing feeding tubes for someone who is pretty much dead anyway. You can’t remove that science, that would be a sin. Isn’t it interesting how they pick and choose. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/10 "2003-11-03T20:46:45Z")
**music** - I submit to you that there is an alarming consistency. It’s ok to explore AIDS research for cure, since there are some “Innocents” who’ve gotten it. It’s not OK to research AIDS spreading 'cause one has a choice about sex, IV drug use (and if those pesky drug users and fornicators would simply stop having sex/giving blood/giving birth to innocents, then by golly, we’d be able to contain the disease to those whose lifestyles made them suseptical) the woman in FL, the parents (IIRC) are claiming that she fell into the coma either 'cause her bad bad husband tried to kill her by choking her, or bad luck heart attack. They’ve (IIRC) rejected the possability that her heart attack was caused by an eating disorder 'cause that would make her be a party to her state\*\* \*\*(I am not claiming that this is the parents position, that an eating disorder is her own fault, but that it would be a consistent position for those who seem to believe that drug addiction is a person’s fault, and the resulting problems therefore are as well). I agree that it’s an abhorant position, but take note, that there’s a lot of room on that whole “make your bed and lie in it” place. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/11 "2003-11-04T05:19:29Z")
Where has all the love gone in Christianity? All the compassion? Wasn’t Mary Magdalene a woman with a shady reputation? Christians who are anti-everybody else just seem to be going a little bit beserk lately and growing in their numbers. And some of them are treating other Christians as if they were unclean. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/12 "2003-11-04T05:26:51Z")
I don’t suppose any of you went to the TVC website to have a look at the particular studies that they are questioning, did you? ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/13 "2003-11-04T05:47:38Z")
Did you? What did you see? ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/14 "2003-11-04T05:52:31Z")
> [@](#): > > I don’t suppose any of you went to the TVC website to have a look at the particular studies that they are questioning, did you? Yes, I did. [http://traditionalvalues.org/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=3&page=2](http://traditionalvalues.org/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=3&page=2) They’re not questioning the studies themselves. The TVC’s quibble is not with the studies’ results, and not that the studies were done, but that the studies were done [air quotes] “with taxpayers money!!” The TVC’s **whole entire agenda** is one thing–they’re sex-obsessed, and adamantly anti-gay. Which is why they’re so horrified at the thought of federal funds being spent on studies of smarmy sex stuff. Specially _gay_ sex stuff. And I’m still trying to figure out the ad link for [http://www.shofartallit.com/](http://www.shofartallit.com/) > [@](#): > > In the true spirit of the Tanakh and the Apostolic Scriptures, we at Holy Land Gifts view ourselves as your servants to those who are searching for the Hebraic roots of their faith. We provide gifts and artifacts that reconnect Christians with biblical foundations confirmed by Jesus and the apostles. At the same time, through books of my friend Dr. John Garr, we offer you theologically sound, biblically balanced understanding of the Jewish roots that make the gifts and artifacts teaching tools through which you can enrich your home and family, as you understand God’s blessing for you. Because our gifts are made in Israel, you help support this nation in a time of great need when you buy from Holy Land Gifts. …I need to reconnect to my “Jewish roots” by buying a Yemenite shofar bag? ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/15 "2003-11-04T05:53:54Z")
See any of this? > [@](#): > > Study proposes development of website ([myStudentbody.com](http://myStudentbody.com)) for purposes of STD/HIV intervention, and to “increase practice of preventative behaviors”, as funded. Yet a casual look at website shows that it is apparently being used for alcohol related info. only at this time. (Why disparity?) Study emphasizes “commercial potential of such a program.” $680,381 > [@](#): > > To better understand the meaning and implications of cohabitation. “Cohabitation is recognized as an important feature of family formation and children’s well-being.” $136,200 > [@](#): > > To investigate how population policy affects child well-being using data from the People’s Republic of China. Abstract reads, “[in China]…Population policy is an important constraint on reproductive behavior.” To evaluate effects of population policy on contraceptive use and child well-being, including nutrition, school arrangements, and child care. $256,940 ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/16 "2003-11-04T06:02:50Z")
Yep. Assuming that the excerpts provided at [http://www.traditionalvalues.org](http://www.traditionalvalues.org) are actual studies being funded by the NIH, I think they have a valid point on this one. The sexual habits of truckers and gay Mexican immigrants doesn’t strike me as a matter of national importance. The other ‘studies’ listed seem equally pointless. These may (or may not) be interesting things to study from an academic point of view, but don’t seem to be matters that public funds should be used to research. After all, I would love to be the researcher working on, “_Study of genital arousal of lesbian, bisexual, heterosexual women as they view pornographic videos_”, but getting the gov’t to pay for that study? Ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/17 "2003-11-04T06:05:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Brutus \* > **The other ‘studies’ listed seem equally pointless.** _Some of_ the other ‘studies’ listed seem equally pointless… ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/18 "2003-11-04T06:21:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Brutus \* > \*\*Yep. > > Assuming that the excerpts provided at [http://www.traditionalvalues.org](http://www.traditionalvalues.org) are actual studies being funded by the NIH, I think they have a valid point on this one. > \ > After all, I would love to be the researcher working on, “_Study of genital arousal of lesbian, bisexual, heterosexual women as they view pornographic videos_”, but getting the gov’t to pay for that study? Ridiculous. \*\* It is an actual study, but that’s not its title. That’s just how the TVC has characterised it. The actual study is intended to assist in determining the genetic basis (if any) of homosexuality. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Brutus \* > **_Some_ of the other ‘studies’ listed seem equally pointless…** Most of it falls into two simple categories: a) basic research into real health issues involving sex or drugs b) educational programs related to sex or drugs. The TVC has a fundamental problem with reality. Sex exists, and people engage in it. Drugs exist, and people take them. Health issues arise during these activities. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/19 "2003-11-04T06:33:05Z")
> [@](#): > > The sexual habits of truckers and gay Mexican immigrants doesn’t strike me as a matter of national importance. You don’t think so? The truckers are, from what I’ve read, notorious disease vectors. The gay Mexicans have a cultural bias to contend with. They are extremely reluctant to admit to being gay, and equally reluctant to take steps to reduce HIV transmission. In my opinion, yes, both issues have national importance. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2003, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192/20 "2003-11-04T06:40:08Z")
Here we go: [Study suggests difference between female and male sexuality](http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2003-06/nu-ssd061203.php) > [@](#): > > Public release date: 12-Jun-2003 > > Three decades of research on men’s sexual arousal show patterns that clearly track sexual orientation – gay men overwhelmingly become sexually aroused by images of men and heterosexual men by images of women. In other words, men’s sexual arousal patterns seem obvious. > But a new Northwestern University study boosts the relatively limited research on women’s sexuality with a surprisingly different finding regarding women’s sexual arousal. > > In contrast to men, both heterosexual and lesbian women tend to become sexually aroused by both male and female erotica, and, thus, have a bisexual arousal pattern. > > “These findings likely represent a fundamental difference between men’s and women’s brains and have important implications for understanding how sexual orientation development differs between men and women,” said J. Michael Bailey, professor and chair of psychology at Northwestern and senior researcher of the study “ **A Sex Difference in the Specificity of Sexual Arousal.** ” The study is forthcoming in the journal Psychological Science. > > Bailey’s main research focus has been on the genetics and environment of sexual orientation, and he is one of the principal investigators of a widely cited study that concludes that genes influence male homosexuality. > > As in many areas of sexuality, research on women’s sexual arousal patterns has lagged far behind men’s, but the scant research on the subject does hint that, compared with men, women’s sexual arousal patterns may be less tightly connected to their sexual orientation. See the title? “A Sex Difference in the Specificity of Sexual Arousal”. Sounds a bit different when you call it “Study of genital arousal of lesbian, bisexual, heterosexual women as they view pornographic videos”, and omit any background information. Your government funds all sorts of stuff you probably wouldn’t understand simply from the titles, and probably wouldn’t see any use for without having it explained. They spend shitloads studying the sexual behaviour of insects, for example. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/traditional-values-coalition-tries-to-stop-aids-research/211192.md?page=2)