# Transgender activists pressure Always to Womens symbol of feminine hygiene products **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 21, 2019, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069 "2019-10-21T03:06:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/101 "2019-10-25T14:15:34Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > And not all of those who have a uterus are women. ! And not all women still have a uterus. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/102 "2019-10-25T22:08:05Z")
Just found this post shared from a transmasc facebook page by a friend of mine > [@](#): > > Cis women who think that the ♀ symbol being removed from menstrual products is “taking away your womanhood”: > > No one can take your womanhood from you so long as you identify with it. Your connection to femininity transcends your ability to menstruate or breastfeed or give birth, because, let’s face it, there are a lot of cis women who cannot do those things. No corporation can take your identity from you if just so long as you believe in your own womanhood. > > Just like trans women. And trans men who, despite being able to do those things, do not identify with their femininity. Or intersex people who transition, or don’t, yet still identify with a binary gender. Or non-binary people, who don’t feel connected to the gender they were assigned at birth. > > What trans and non-binary people are trying to show you is freedom, true freedom, the freedom to live your life in a self-expression and social role that’s comfortable to you. You feel like a woman and want to be proud of that fact? Hell yeah, you do you! Don’t feel particularly comfortable as a woman? You don’t have to! Reactionaries want to paint gender issues as restrictive and “fascist,” when it’s exactly the opposite – almost like they’re projecting or something. > > The only person you have to spend the rest of your life with is yourself. If you aren’t happy with the arbitrary role that you’ve been forced into, you don’t have to stay in it. That is feminism. That is freedom. (E: my friend shared it, not wrote it) ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/103 "2019-10-26T02:02:15Z")
Actually, not having to menstruate is one area where transwomen are at an advantage. You’re not missing out on anything. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/104 "2019-10-26T04:33:18Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Actually, not having to menstruate is one area where transwomen are at an advantage. You’re not missing out on anything. I’ve read reports of symptoms similar to PMS in transgender women who have undergone hormone therapy. And the “Ben” mentioned in the original post is ostensibly a transgender man who still menstruates and thus must endure the shame and stress of buying feminine hygiene products with the female symbol on them. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/105 "2019-10-26T04:39:11Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > I’ve read reports of symptoms similar to PMS in transgender women who have undergone hormone therapy. And the “Ben” mentioned in the original post is ostensibly a transgender man who still menstruates and thus must endure the shame and stress of buying feminine hygiene products with the female symbol on them. > > ~Max Whatever those symptoms of PMS transgender women are experiencing, they won’t require the use of pads and tampons. The plumbing just isn’t there. I admit I have a hard time relating to why “Ben” has to “endure” shame and stress buying feminine hygiene products? CIS men buy them all the time. The clerk at Walgreens really couldn’t care less what you are buying and why. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/106 "2019-10-26T04:41:23Z")
> [@Dorjan](#): > > Whatever those symptoms of PMS transgender women are experiencing, they won’t require the use of pads and tampons. The plumbing just isn’t there. Right, but I’m sure it still sucks. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/107 "2019-10-26T04:57:37Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Okay, now try to come up with a neutral example. Because in your example, women are being insulted. (although not by being called less-than-people, admittedly.) > > Maybe I’m just touchy, but I felt insulted, and I seem not to have been alone in feeling insulted. I think urbanredneck doesn’t think women are quite exactly full people, and he expressed it accidentally in that statement. A pregnant lady speaks to a room of couples who have had children, “Giving birth sounds so painful, I don’t know how you people do it!” “Only women can give birth. Not all of “us people”.” “Yeah, my husband doesn’t have the balls to go through childbirth.” ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Ronald\_Raygun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c67d28/32.png) [@Ronald\_Raygun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ronald_Raygun)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/108 "2019-10-26T06:09:29Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Right, but I’m sure it still sucks. > > ~Max I’m skeptical that it exists. Trans women (typically) don’t cycle their hormones to emulate a menstrual cycle. ---
**Author:** ![WolfpackJeep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpackjeep/32/2921_2.png) [@WolfpackJeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WolfpackJeep)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/109 "2019-10-26T09:17:09Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > “Always… made for people who possess an active uterus.” > > Well, it would be better than the “Have a happy period!” bullshit from a few years ago. Seriously, who thought _that_ was a good idea? “Enjoy your crotch-bleeding and cramps!” THIS!! If I recall correctly, didn’t P&G trot out some spokesman who insisted that women who use pads are more likely to view their periods as “natural”? :rolleyes: So this wad of absorbent material is really going to make me happy about having an organ that tries to tear itself out of my body once per month while spewing fluids and clumps of tissue? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/110 "2019-10-26T10:00:09Z")
> [@WolfpackJeep](#): > > THIS!! > > If I recall correctly, didn’t P&G trot out some spokesman who insisted that women who use pads are more likely to view their periods as “natural”? :rolleyes: So this wad of absorbent material is really going to make me happy about having an organ that tries to tear itself out of my body once per month while spewing fluids and clumps of tissue? But at the same time how entitled of you ! We used to cloister you frightening bleeding monsters in the menstrual hut for a fornite. Can’t you just be happy and grateful that soulless marketroids are now celebrating this beautiful Gaia Goddess moment of yours because they totally understand and care ? And also there’s a buck in it and the people doling out the bucks are also men ? I swear, you bitches are always in a mood… (😉 obviously) ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/111 "2019-10-26T10:32:41Z")
> [@Ronald\_Raygun](#): > > I’m skeptical that it exists. Trans women (typically) don’t cycle their hormones to emulate a menstrual cycle. I’m slightly skeptical too, but the studies done that showed this behavior was for HRT on post-menopausal women who are otherwise on the same non-cycling estradiol dosages that trans women are so… _shrug_. E: Though sublingual vs injection also makes a difference here. Sublingual is daily, injection will have peaks at the time of dosage and troughs right before redosage since it’s typically weekly or fortnightly. Still not exactly the same as a cis hormonal cycle, but absolutely can cause all sorts of weird effects near the time the dose is up. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/112 "2019-10-26T10:42:50Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > I’m slightly skeptical too, but the studies done that showed this behavior was for HRT on post-menopausal women who are otherwise on the same non-cycling estradiol dosages that trans women are so… _shrug_. TBC, as I understand it the study was not on the regiments that add progesterone for 10-14 days a month, but rather have a constant dose (which explicitly prevents bleeding) so… again, _shrug_. The only difference (other than the obvious ovulation and uterine shedding) noted was that the cycle was about 5 weeks long instead of 4. I’m willing to believe that the study wasn’t done well, or there’s some other element of cis women’s biology that confounds this and makes it different, but what that is is not immediately obvious and I’ve seen plenty of corroborating anecdotal evidence. I’ll also say I can’t find the study on a quick google but I’m 100% sure I’ve seen a cite before, I’ll link back if I can find it. Either way, it’s somewhat outside the actual topic of the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/113 "2019-10-26T11:10:40Z")
[End of hijack for now on my end: I’m starting to think the study was actually on estrogen-only HRT given to cis women with **hysterectomies** i.e. surgical POI. I recalled it being in the context of post-menopausal women who were also taking small but consistent progesterone doses, which some trans women also do. The hysterectomy case would be closer, regardless.] ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/114 "2019-10-26T11:39:17Z")
Alright, I can’t find the study I’m looking for and I’m fairly certain it doesn’t quite exist. At least not the 5 week number my friend (who, for reference, had a hysterectomy, not a trans woman in this case) cited a medical professional telling her that I thought she sent me a study for. I think what’s being reported is that unopposed estrogen HRT in women with surgical POI is known to cause periodic/recurring symptoms that resemble PMS ones, not a study but for an easy source see [here](https://www.webmd.com/menopause/guide/surgical-menopause-estrogen-after-hysterectomy#3) > [@](#): > > **You’re concerned about the side effects**. HRT can also cause symptoms of its own. Many resemble the symptoms of premenstrual syndrome – swollen and painful breasts, headaches, and nausea. This pans out to what many people I’ve known (both post-hysterectomy women on estrogen-only HRT and trans women) reporting, along with similar symptoms that are more in line with the “period” itself like abdominal cramping, on a semi-predictable cycle. It is, of course, not a period in any strict sense. Hell, even post-menopausal women taking HRT, or people on hormonal birth control who actually bleed sometimes don’t get a “period” in a strict sense (it’s breakthrough bleeding), but calling this cluster of things a “period” is somewhat easier for most because it communicates the general idea, structure, and symptoms experienced. That said, if you want to reduce it to just saying “PMS-like symptoms” without making any claims of it being on a regular cyclic pattern, it is a known side effect of estrogen-only HRT (at least in cis women with hysterectomies). Also, there is one case where trans women have to buy menstrual pads Bottom surgery. No I’m not claiming trans women suddenly have a real period. The plumbing ain’t there. I mean it is literally a surgical site that bleeds for months. Most doctors recommend stocking up on hundreds of pads for that period of recovery. Though this is all kind of a distraction from the point (… that I participated in) that trans women aren’t particularly relevant here, and TBH I feel it’s kind of weird to rope trans women… into this? This is mostly about trans men and AFAB non-binary or third gender people that need to use these things and would prefer the acts were not associated with a gender but rather be treated as a general medical concern that is associated with a specific set of organs, not a gender. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/115 "2019-10-26T13:49:21Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > I’ve read reports of symptoms similar to PMS in transgender women who have undergone hormone therapy. And the “Ben” mentioned in the original post is ostensibly a transgender man who still menstruates and thus must endure the shame and stress of buying feminine hygiene products with the female symbol on them. > > ~Max No one has to buy products with a female symbol on them. There are a myriad of products that don’t have any symbols. So that shame and stress is entirely self-imposed, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/116 "2019-10-26T13:56:33Z")
> [@WolfpackJeep](#): > > THIS!! > > If I recall correctly, didn’t P&G trot out some spokesman who insisted that women who use pads are more likely to view their periods as “natural”? :rolleyes: So this wad of absorbent material is really going to make me happy about having an organ that tries to tear itself out of my body once per month while spewing fluids and clumps of tissue? I actually saw an ad in Seventeen for tampons where the copy said Roses are red so is your period WTF? lol ---
**Author:** ![saucywench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/85e7bf/32.png) [@saucywench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saucywench)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/117 "2019-10-26T16:24:07Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > And the “Ben” mentioned in the original post is ostensibly a transgender man who still menstruates and thus must endure the shame and stress of buying feminine hygiene products with the female symbol on them. > > ~Max Someone has a problem with a product for women having a symbol representing women on it. Spare me! And Ben, “…must endure the shame and stress of buying feminine hygiene products with the female symbol on them.” Maybe he should get his mommy to buy them for him. How about Amazon? He could avoid the shame and stress and have those products delivered right to his front door. When his products arrive, I suggest instead of sticking them in the recommended place, that Ben stick them up his ass. It’s like my favorite philosopher L. van Pelt once said, “I love humanity, it’s people I can’t stand.” ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/118 "2019-10-26T19:07:19Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > And the “Ben” mentioned in the original post is ostensibly a transgender man who still menstruates and thus must endure the shame and stress of buying feminine hygiene products with the female symbol on them. > > ~Max You’re getting piled on because you’re doing what alluded to earlier: implying men lose dignity when “enduring” anything deemed feminine. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/119 "2019-10-26T19:33:16Z")
> [@saucywench](#): > > Someone has a problem with a product for women _bzzzzzzzt_ ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2019, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069/120 "2019-10-26T19:53:14Z")
> [@SuntanLotion](#): > > I actually saw an ad in Seventeen for tampons where the copy said Roses are red so is your period > WTF? lol Now I want to know what they rhymed with “period!” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-activists-pressure-always-to-womens-symbol-of-feminine-hygiene-products/842069.md?page=7)