# Transgender and public bathrooms **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 14, 2016, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190 "2016-04-14T16:27:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/41 "2016-04-15T04:28:54Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > As for the women, I can see that there might be some concern about being in an enclosed place with no security visible, no security cameras (obviously) but with just you and someone who obviously has a male body. I’m somewhat surprised to find that other women are looking at strangers in women’s rooms closely enough to be able to tell that they “have a male body” even when they’re presenting as women. If somebody comes into the women’s room wearing typically female clothing, carrying a purse, etc., I doubt it would ever cross my mind to notice if they have a prominent Adam’s apple or large hands or any other of the characteristics that allegedly distinguish transwomen. If a buff hairy guy with a full beard or a bald guy in a suit and tie or some other distinctly male-looking person walks into the women’s room, I might ask them if they were accidentally in the wrong restroom. But except perhaps in North Carolina, I can’t see why a male-presenting person would be inclined to use a women’s restroom, whether they’ve got a vagina or not. In all my years I’m sure I’ve unwittingly seen a number of transwomen in women’s restrooms, but I’ve never seen any male-presenting person in one. Nor have I ever seen a female-presenting person in a women’s restroom doing anything obscene or “pervy”-looking. I concur with the skeptics who remain unconvinced by the claims that banning transgender people from their preferred restrooms is somehow necessary to prevent hordes of crossdressed Peeping Toms from infesting the ladies’ room. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/42 "2016-04-15T04:29:32Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > If the person with an obvious male body identifies as female, then the woman is a bigot for feeling unsafe. > > If the person with an obvious male body identifies as male, then the woman is well within her rights to be afraid. > > See? Easy! Define “obvious.” ---
**Author:** ![Stately\_Greek\_Automaton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Stately\_Greek\_Automaton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stately_Greek_Automaton)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/43 "2016-04-15T07:03:50Z")
> [@bizerta](#): > > As I understand the North Caroline issue, LGBT want to be able to choose their own bathrooms but NC prohibits this. Personally, I would feel a bit uncomfortable if someone with a vagina came into a bathroom while I was peeing. Hell, I even have trouble with the troughs that are in men’s rooms at Fenway Park. > > But my question (and this may be a GQ) is … What provisions are made for perverts. If transgenders can use any bathroom why couldn’t some pervert just declare himself to be gay and hang out in the ladies’ bathroom? To answer your question, they wouldn’t do that because gay men aren’t particularly interested in watching women use the bathroom. The slightly more serious answer is that anyone caught peaking under the stall will generally be treated the same. Lesbians have used women’s washrooms for some time without it being much of an issue. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/44 "2016-04-15T07:38:35Z")
So how is she to know what this apparent man, ‘identifies as’ ? Should she assume they must have been born with a vagina as they’re now in the ladies room? Ask them, “Hey, you got a vagina in those pants?” Will she then just take their word for it? Or should she demand proof? Wondering why no one who supports this law seems to want to answer any of these questions. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/45 "2016-04-15T07:44:02Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > To be fair, my wife pointed out that when she was working at Dayton-Hudson about 20 years ago, they were notified that there were several transgender women on their floor, and it was pretty obvious when the person in the next stall walked in and peed standing up, no “peeking under the stalls” was required. > > Obviously, immediately fixable by the women (sit down), but still. Or by having the kind of stalls where you don’t see the feet, which are what I’m used to. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/46 "2016-04-15T09:38:24Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > To be fair, my wife pointed out that when she was working at Dayton-Hudson about 20 years ago, they were notified that there were several transgender women on their floor, and it was pretty obvious when the person in the next stall walked in and peed standing up, no “peeking under the stalls” was required. > > Obviously, immediately fixable by the women (sit down), but still. I’m surprised the NC law doesn’t mention people not wearing gender-appropriate shoes. And the obvious solution for the OP is to pee at home. Then, when going out, wear a catheter. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/47 "2016-04-15T09:57:54Z")
I cannot help but think that the supporters of these laws believe that trans people are somehow perverse and so “our” “normal” women need to be protected from them. Either that or they think life is just like an 80s teen sex comedy. ---
**Author:** ![Emiliana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@Emiliana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emiliana)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/48 "2016-04-15T10:34:10Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > I cannot help but think that the supporters of these laws believe that trans people are somehow perverse and so “our” “normal” women need to be protected from them. Either that or they think life is just like an 80s teen sex comedy. Absolutely to the first. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/49 "2016-04-15T10:51:39Z")
It’s gotta be the first choice - notice how they seem completely unconcerned about transmen in the men’s room? It’s all about protecting the [del]chattel[/del] [del]walking wombs[/del] the women. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/50 "2016-04-15T10:55:33Z")
Who are too stupid to protect themselves or to see the difference between someone needing to pee and a pig (with my apologies to pigs). And who also instantly turn from their normal selves into sexy sluts who walk around in nothing but their lace bras when they are out of sight of their protectors… We said it in the other thread and I say it again, what the fuck do those guys think goes on in the women’s? Plumber porn? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/51 "2016-04-15T12:32:44Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Define “obvious.” Wasn’t my word, I was using it from another poster. Ask him. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/52 "2016-04-15T13:07:12Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > We said it in the other thread and I say it again, what the fuck do those guys think goes on in the women’s? Plumber porn? I’m fully convinced the men who come up with this sort of thing are absolutely certain the world centers around their sex drives. _Of course_ women’s rest rooms and locker rooms are full of nubile naked vixens and jiggling titties because that’s what makes the men happy. The reality is far more likely to contain things like used tampons, farts, ratty underwear, stretch marks, the sound of asses being scratched, and various saggy bits. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/53 "2016-04-15T13:23:41Z")
What bathrooms are you using?😃 ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/54 "2016-04-15T14:14:13Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Wasn’t my word, I was using it from another poster. Ask him. I know, sorry, didn’t mean to suggest it was. Just saying that’s the problem with the “obvious male” standard. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/55 "2016-04-15T15:53:58Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > What bathrooms are you using?😃 Public ones. I work in a retail store. The customer and employee bathrooms are one and the same. Trust me, nothing sexy going on in the Ladies where I work, and a lot that’s UNsexy. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/56 "2016-04-15T17:37:22Z")
I couldn’t care less who uses whatever washroom I use - whether I’m using a urinal or stall. Of course, I’m a tall adult male. How about all bathrooms are unisex, with stools and stalls to the floor for everyone? Require a minimal number of washrooms for whomever wishes additional privacy - whether young children, trans folk in transition, or even someone subject to “stagefright.” Sure, there might be an increased wait for those facilities, but folk who want it can use it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/57 "2016-04-15T18:10:29Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > I couldn’t care less who uses whatever washroom I use - whether I’m using a urinal or stall. Of course, I’m a tall adult male. > > How about all bathrooms are unisex, with stools and stalls to the floor for everyone? Require a minimal number of washrooms for whomever wishes additional privacy - whether young children, trans folk in transition, or even someone subject to “stagefright.” Sure, there might be an increased wait for those facilities, but folk who want it can use it. I like it, but then we need some urinals, so as to cut back on water waste. Maybe public ones? Yeah, they already have companion restrooms, so the last could work. I am a\* little\* concerned about changing rooms & showers, however. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/58 "2016-04-15T18:15:08Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > I like it, but then we need some urinals, so as to cut back on water waste. Maybe public ones? > > Yeah, they already have companion restrooms, so the last could work. > > I am a\* little\* concerned about changing rooms & showers, however. Changing rooms are usually one to a customer, and what showers are you concerned about? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/59 "2016-04-15T18:15:52Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > 2.5. The actual number of transgender people arrested for perving in bathrooms compared to “family value” conservatives? The numbers may (not) shock you: > [http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/04/13/gop-congressmen-get-kinky-bathrooms-transgender-folk/](http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/04/13/gop-congressmen-get-kinky-bathrooms-transgender-folk/) > ] The actual number of transgender people compared to “family value” conservatives? I mean, it’s like 0.3%, right? While conservatives are what, 40%? 30%? Let us be frank. Trans-people are first and foremost- _people._ Some small % of _people_ are pervos. Thus, some small % of Trans-people are pervos. Pretty tiny number, I should imagine. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190/60 "2016-04-15T18:16:58Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Changing rooms are usually one to a customer, and what showers are you concerned about? At gyms, beaches, etc where the bathrooms and showers are in one room. Same with changing/locker rooms. I think the risk is slight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/transgender-and-public-bathrooms/752190.md?page=4)