# Translating non-English titles of creative works **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [July 22, 2011, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047 "2011-07-22T23:21:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/1 "2011-07-22T23:21:35Z")
RE: [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14048560&postcount=17) post in [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14053631#post14053631) thread. If the [_Must I post in English?_ FAQ](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7697021&postcount=8) states, in part, that “Exceptions include requests for help with translation, explanation of foreign language words or expressions, foreign words or phrases that have come into English, etc.”, does that mean that the non-English titles of well-known works of art must be translated? What about lesser-known works of art. Or, does the clause stating, “foreign words or phrases that have come into English” cover these works? For example, _Mein Kampff_, _Un Ballo in Maschera_, _A la recherche du temps perdu_, _El Cid_? What about “old/middle English” titles, such as, _Auld Lang Syne_? ETA: Whoooops! _Auld Lang Syne_ is Scottish. My apologies! (But you get my drift.) Many thanks and regards, ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/2 "2011-07-23T00:13:49Z")
> [@Toucanna](#): > > does that mean that the non-English titles of well-known works of art must be translated? No, of course not. I don’t think works like the ones you cited need translation. > [@](#): > > What about lesser-known works of art. Or, does the clause stating, “foreign words or phrases that have come into English” cover these works? It would be a courtesy to provide a translation of lesser known works, but if they are just titles even that is not strictly necessary. I think you misinterpret the rule somewhat, which as stated is: > [@](#): > > The Straight Dope Message Board is owned by a publication based in the USA. The common language of all the moderators of this message board is English. For that reason we ask that **all posts** on this message board be made in English. The staff members need to be able to read and understand\*\* posts\*\* made at the message board. Bolding mine. Note that the rule refers to _posts_, not individual words or phrases. As long as the use of foreign words or phrases doesn’t interfere with the ability of moderators to understand your post, then there shouldn’t be a problem. We want to avoid posters conversing extensively in a foreign language, since we may not be able to detect rule violations or other problems; or using foreign words to surreptitiously insult other posters, etc. But the occasional mention of a title in a foreign language is not apt to be a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/3 "2011-07-23T00:46:54Z")
Ignorance fought! Much obliged. Thanks, and regards, 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/4 "2011-07-23T01:31:53Z")
You’re welcome. I might note my username is non-English. I’d hate to have to translate it in every post!😉 ---
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/5 "2011-07-23T03:55:50Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > {snip}I’d hate to have to translate [my username] in every post!😉 You think you’d have it rough? What about “ **Le Ministre de l’au-delà** ”? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/6 "2011-07-24T01:43:05Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > … using foreign words to surreptitiously insult other posters, Can we use foreign insults in the pit? Do we need to translate them? Just curious, I don’t plan on doing so, but it would be nice to know the rule just in case the opportunity arises. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/7 "2011-07-24T01:59:00Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > Can we use foreign insults in the pit? Do we need to translate them? Just curious, I don’t plan on doing so, but it would be nice to know the rule just in case the opportunity arises. 😉 Yes, provided they aren’t direct translations of any phrases that are forbidden in English. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/8 "2011-07-24T02:45:41Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > Can we use foreign insults in the pit? Do we need to translate them? Just curious, I don’t plan on doing so, but it would be nice to know the rule just in case the opportunity arises. 😉 As **Miller** indicates, anything that is against the rules in English is against the rules in a foreign language, regardless of forum. ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/9 "2011-07-24T03:58:57Z")
Somewhere, someone with the username **Schadenfreude** is breathing a sigh of relief. ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/10 "2011-07-24T04:36:06Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > As **Miller** indicates, anything that is against the rules in English is against the rules in a foreign language, regardless of forum. OK, we can use them, provided they are acceptable in meaning, but do we also have to translate them? _ **I** _ know what “puta fea” means, do I also have to tell the “english-only” crowd that it means “ugly whore” to be within the rules? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/11 "2011-07-24T04:42:01Z")
> [@Gukumatz](#): > > Somewhere, someone with the username **Schadenfreude** is breathing a sigh of relief. Which is a pity, because I really would have enjoyed it if something bad had happened to him. ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/12 "2011-07-24T05:03:28Z")
Missed the edit window… I was about to say: I once said to a co-worker “Es muy frio”. After I left the room, I suddenly realized that she had NO FUCKING IDEA what I had just said, since it wasn’t English. I went back and translated for her (and the rest of the office staff, who were already used to me saying things in Spanish, or French, or something else). Do I need to do that in the pit, should I spout non-English insults? ---
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/13 "2011-07-24T05:39:39Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > Do I need to do that in the pit, should I spout non-English insults? I think you should. Not only out of common courtesy, but also to avoid misunderstandings. You wouldn’t want someone to Google-translate the “Mámame el bicho” in your post only to have them come up with, “Mummy me the insect.” They would wonder what your interest in dessicated entomological specimens had to do with the matter at hand. Translation (NSFW): Puerto Rican Spanish slang, “suck my cock” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/14 "2011-07-24T06:02:05Z")
> [@Toucanna](#): > > Translation (NSFW): Puerto Rican Spanish slang, “suck my cock” LOL… All the Puerto Ricans I’ve ever heard that from said: Chupe me bicho (My spelling may be off, I can’t write in spanish, I only sort of speak it.) I’ll have to remember that one, for use in the future! ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/15 "2011-07-24T19:52:55Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > Do I need to do that in the pit, should I spout non-English insults? To be on the safe side, I would say yes. However, this is a pretty hypothetical question, since you say you don’t intend to do it; and I don’t recall anyone else doing so either. I mean, what would be the point? An insult isn’t going to be very effective if it’s in a someone in a language the target (and much of the audience) doesn’t understand. ---
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/16 "2011-07-24T20:16:33Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > {snip}An insult isn’t going to be very effective if it’s in a [something] in a language the target (and much of the audience) doesn’t understand. But it’s so-o-o-o-o satisfying in a gloatingly passive-aggressive manner, you _pendejo_. 😃 Translation:[spoiler]of _course_ I mean the secondary usage of the term: “2 Pelo que sale en el pubis y en las ingles.” [a hair that sprouts from the pubic area and the groin]. 😉 Source: [Pendejo[/spoiler] - significado de pendejo[/spoiler] diccionario](http://es.thefreedictionary.com/pendejo%5B/spoiler%5D) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/17 "2011-07-24T20:52:12Z")
> [@Toucanna](#): > > But it’s so-o-o-o-o satisfying in a gloatingly passive-aggressive manner, you _pendejo_. 😃 I don’t think the original meaning is particularly flattering either (especially since it’s the source of the insulting meaning). And of course we know that [pendejo means “friend.”](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UddFQUIREaE) ---
**Author:** ![Toucanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Toucanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toucanna)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/18 "2011-07-24T21:31:22Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > And of course we know that pendejo means “friend.” Once, when I was a teen, the family was driving from Point A to Point B and some hotrodder cut my dad off. My brother rolled down the window and yelled at the other driver, “¡Pelo púbico!” My dad and mom laughed and laughed. 🙂 Good times… ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/19 "2011-07-24T22:57:41Z")
> [@Toucanna](#): > > But it’s so-o-o-o-o satisfying in a gloatingly passive-aggressive manner, you _pendejo_. 😃 > Translation:[spoiler]of _course_ I mean the secondary usage of the term: “2 Pelo que sale en el pubis y en las ingles.” [a hair that sprouts from the pubic area and the groin]. 😉 Source: [Pendejo[/spoiler] - significado de pendejo[/spoiler] diccionario](http://es.thefreedictionary.com/pendejo%5B/spoiler%5D) Maybe, but we all know that it’s essentially equivalent to “Asshole”. Which _is_ “Pit Approved”. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-non-english-titles-of-creative-works/590047/20 "2011-07-25T00:42:16Z")
The bottom line is that our concern is that the moderators (and most readers) be able to understand what you’ve written. The goal of our message boards is the exchange of thoughts and ideas, and that is thwarted if most readers can’t understand what’s being said. Common foreign expressions, sure, that’s fine. We don’t want hair-splitting over this (or any other) rule. (I can imagine someone asking whether it’s OK to use $#\*@ since that’s not English.)