# Translating the language of comics **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** comic-strips\ **Created:** [March 28, 2022, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864 "2022-03-28T23:34:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/21 "2022-03-29T07:59:07Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > There were some good ones in _ **Asterix and Cleopatra** _ , like: _Asterix In Switzerland_ , in the English at least, begins with two pages set in the Gaulish village with an unusually high density of puns. I’ve wondered how this all plays in the original French, and other languages. [![](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-O7Ma_0f33X4/WVTFCBNvlZI/AAAAAAAET-g/Au-uFWk7B04cexqx6-Y2Ym8QlfEWIX0cgCLcBGAs/s1600/016_001.jpg) ](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-O7Ma_0f33X4/WVTFCBNvlZI/AAAAAAAET-g/Au-uFWk7B04cexqx6-Y2Ym8QlfEWIX0cgCLcBGAs/s1600/016_001.jpg) [![](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-61HemVHKdKU/WVTFCNKWTVI/AAAAAAAET-k/GAXd3Ug07nkXlgiU3OsYLZA3BKY8RG7UQCLcBGAs/s1600/016_002.jpg) ](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-61HemVHKdKU/WVTFCNKWTVI/AAAAAAAET-k/GAXd3Ug07nkXlgiU3OsYLZA3BKY8RG7UQCLcBGAs/s1600/016_002.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/22 "2022-03-29T08:57:19Z")
[![](http://www.otakia.com/wp-content/uploads/V_1/nom_9/84/667.jpg) ](http://www.otakia.com/wp-content/uploads/V_1/nom_9/84/667.jpg) [![](http://www.otakia.com/wp-content/uploads/V_1/nom_9/84/668.jpg) ](http://www.otakia.com/wp-content/uploads/V_1/nom_9/84/668.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/23 "2022-03-29T09:16:36Z")
If I understand correctly, a small cup of black coffee (very French) became a half pint of beer (very British). I’m reminded of a joke from _ **The Honeymooners** _: Ralph has just finished a meal in a very posh restaurant. **WAITER:** Would you like a demitasse, sir? **RALPH:** No thanks. I’ll just have a small cup of black coffee. (No real connection to comics, I just think it’s funny!) ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/24 "2022-03-29T09:32:58Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > If I understand correctly, a small cup of black coffee (very French) became a half pint of beer (very British). Not sure where you are getting that. Obelix is serving a “demi” (= a half-pint of beer). [Beer is drunk in France, too 🙂] ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/25 "2022-03-29T09:37:00Z")
In English, yes. I don’t know if the French even have half-pints. The metric system, you know… To my mind, “demi” is a demitasse of coffee. But I admit my knowledge of French is not great. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/26 "2022-03-29T09:48:13Z")
I’ll leave a definitive answer up to the French participants, but I am not aware that “un demi” [note the gender btw] can refer to coffee, and if you ask for one in a pub you will definitely receive a glass of beer. ETA a modern “demi” would be 25 cl thanks to the metric system ETA2 assuming I am correct, they did a fine job translating that one, keeping things beer-related ---
**Author:** ![its\_the\_daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/bb73d2/32.png) [@its\_the\_daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/its_the_daddy)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 10:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/27 "2022-03-29T10:15:32Z")
Or a half-litre of wine at the table (usually served in _un pichet_ - a jug or pitcher). ---
**Author:** ![Themenin0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@Themenin0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Themenin0)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/28 "2022-03-29T10:16:00Z")
You got it right. Demi is a beer, not a coffee. France is 99% metric, bur there’s still a few holdovers, mostly with food. We still have “livres” (500g, about a pound), and “pintes”, though primarily in the form of a “demi”, which is the standard size for a beer in France (25 cl). The rest of the puns on those two pages are similar to the English versions - no “mild and bitter” however. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/29 "2022-03-29T10:28:11Z")
> [@its\_the\_daddy](#): > > Or a half-litre of wine at the table (usually served in _un pichet_ - a jug or pitcher). > [@its\_the\_daddy](#): > > Or a half-litre of wine at the table (usually served in _un pichet_ - a jug or pitcher). I also remember a “pot” in this sense ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/30 "2022-03-29T12:31:32Z")
In the 1980s when I was a grad student, there was a Chinese student I knew. He spoke English reasonably well (and could read it probably very well) - but humor was difficult. A couple of times, we’d look at Mad magazine, and I’d try to explain the cartoons. That took some effort. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/31 "2022-03-29T12:46:53Z")
I’m a big fan of the Asterix books, and I’ve been fascinated with the way the english translators managed to invent new puns and gags to get around the fact that they don’t generally translate well (although they’re translating into British English, not American English, so sometimes the puns don’t work as well for me _Asterix and the Cheiftain’s Shield_ Obelix: Why did he slam that door? Gaul: We’re big fans of bangers It was years before I learned that “bangers” was a term for British sausage, which the Gaul was eating at the time. ) One of the puns that would certainly have translated baffles me, because _it’s not in the original French_! In _Asterix in Britain_ asterix and Obelix are trying to recover a barrel of Getafix/Panoramix’ Magiv Potion that has become mixed in with a bunch of barrels of wine. The Romans find out about it and are also looking for it. A company of Roman soldiers has been tasked with finding the barrel of potion by tasting the contents of each barrel. Naturally, they end up drunk, and this is indicated, in comic book fashion, by a series of hiccups emanating from all mouths “hic” :hic" “hic” “hic” If there’s one thing the Asterix books are known for it’s their references to and puns on Roman culture and in particular on Latin (All those British children had to study Latin in school – which explains that incredible “Romans Go Home!” gag in _Monty Python’s Life of Brian_.) If you’ve studied Latin, it’s impossible to read that line of "hic"s and not be irresistably reminded of the conjugation of the Latin word “hic” _hic haec hoc_ _huius huius huius_ So in the translated edition, of course, after several "hic"s, the soldiers go “haec” and “hoc” (although they never get to “huius”). But not in the original French edition. Evidently in French they transliterate a hiccup as “hips” [https://twitter.com/mayawilson247](https://twitter.com/mayawilson247) (scroll down) ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/32 "2022-03-29T13:46:23Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > Translating puns is one thing. Do all those translations have footnotes explaining, say, regional stereotypes, Marcel Pagnol movies, Victor Hugo poems, and other cultural references we would not expect a foreigner to be familiar with? Manga reasonably often has things like this, both professionally translated official versions and fan translations. It can be crammed into white space on the page if available, at the end of the chapter, or at the end of the volume. Dark Horse and Yen Press are expecially good at providing extensive notes. These are some examples chosen because they happened to be sitting in my phone at this moment: [[Album] imgur.com ![](https://i.imgur.com/Bz5j9TP.jpeg?fb "imgur.com") ](https://imgur.com/a/GPdjkp3) ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/33 "2022-03-29T13:49:26Z")
And here is a post that I made in that FQ thread: The classic 1970s manga _Urusei Yatsura_ was published in the US a number of years ago, but it is currently near the end of the series being published again with cleaner scans and a new English translation. I have been compairing the translations of the first few chapters side-by-side. Some of the changes are minimal, but there are places where great liberty is taken with what was presumably the original Japanese. For instance, in the first chapter, the series protagonist arrives at home to discover a strange visitor. In the first translation he throws candy at him because he thinks it is a Halloween costume. But in the second translation, he yells “ogres begone” and throws what is in context (but not in text) soybeans in a [Setsubun](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Setsubun) reference. So the first goes for a familiar American reference, the second for the correct ritual at the risk of the audience not getting it. The chaper continues in the first translation to _not_ use the term “ogre” (or the actual Japanese word _oni_) but the second translation restores it. (Neither translation provides insight into _why_ the fate of the Earth is being determined with a game of tag, but in Japan’s equivalent, the person who is “it” is called the oni, so it isn’t as random as it seems.) In another instance, a character introduces himself with a pun. In the old translation the panel is significantly redrawn to fit in an elaborate English joke. In the new translation, there is simply a note explaining _why_ what he said is a pun. Other panels have other Japanese cultural references including mention of funeral practices and sutra chanting replaced with completely unrelated text in the first translation but the orininal culture elements retained in the second translation. (First translation on the left and read left to right, second translation on the right and read right to left.) [[Album] imgur.com ![](https://i.imgur.com/iIhCcyz.jpeg?fb "imgur.com") ](https://imgur.com/a/TUmcrxK) ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/34 "2022-03-29T14:41:39Z")
Wow, I get up today and find a ton of replies. I remember in high school translating Wizard of Id comics into Spanish and realizing sometimes I’d have to change things. In one, a guy runs into the throne room and tells the king “the peasants are revolting!” and the king thinks “They certainly are” I don’t remember what I did about that. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/35 "2022-03-29T17:07:55Z")
I have a set of French versions of Calvin & Hobbes books I picked up on trips to Montreal. Very fun to see how it’s translated. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/36 "2022-03-29T17:29:45Z")
> [@Themenin0](#): > > France is 99% metric, bur there’s still a few holdovers, mostly with food. We still have “livres” (500g, about a pound), and “pintes”, though primarily in the form of a “demi”, which is the standard size for a beer in France (25 cl). So how would I order a demitasse of coffee then? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/37 "2022-03-29T17:31:27Z")
I collect _Love & Rockets_ comics, which primarily chronicles characters of Mexican descent. In one scene, two girls are talking in Spanish translated to English, indicated by pointy brackets. One of the girls is a maid for an eccentric LA woman who’s throwing a big party, and the two girls are invited. One girl is telling the other about it, and she replies, “Oh yeah, your Hollyweird party.” I always wondered if saying “Hollyweird” is understood in Spanish, since it’s an English play on words? ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/38 "2022-03-29T17:51:56Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > So how would I order a demitasse of coffee then? According to Wiktionary, a time machine would help 😃 > - _De même, l’autre jour, à la fin d’un repas au restaurant, on me proposait une « **demi-tasse** ». Je cherchai en vain ce que cela pouvait bien être. Je renonce à décrire la stupeur de mes compagnons en voyant qu’un Français ignorait ce qu’était une « **demi-tasse** ». (C’est une tasse de café noir – ceci soit dit pour les Français trop jeunes pour connaître cette expression tombée en désuétude)._ — (Hugues Panassié, _Cinq mois à New-York_ , Éditions Corrêa, 1947, pages 55-56) I guess the idea is, just order a (short or long) coffee… NB CNRTL has > **Demi-tasse** , subst. fém.,vieilli. Tasse plus petite qu’une tasse ordinaire et dans laquelle se sert ordinairement le café à l’eau. _L’officier avait devant lui sa demi-tasse, son carafon de cognac_ (Pourrat, _Gaspard_ , 1931, p. 48). with booze in it ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/39 "2022-03-29T17:54:42Z")
As an aside, in the field of simultaneous interpretation jokes are feared, as they often don’t translate (and are not as funny as the speaker thinks!). US-speakers in particular are convinced that you must start a speech with a joke (spoiler: you really don’t!). When everything else fails and you are at your wits’ end it has been known to be very helpful if you simply say the truth: “The speaker is making a joke that does not translate at all, so if you would please laugh now, it would be most appropiate”. It works, but you better not overuse it. > [@terentii](#): > > So how would I order a demitasse of coffee then? I don’t think there is such a thing as a demitasse of coffee in Europe in general and in France in particular. There is _un petit café_, i.e. an espresso. There is _un café normal_, also sometimes called an _americano_. And nowadays there are lots of coffees that are way too big and have too much water, usually served at Starbucks. What is a demitasse for you? > [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > I always wondered if saying “Hollyweird” is understood in Spanish, since it’s an English play on words? I, for one, do not get it. Does it by chance refer to Hollywood? Is it funny? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2022, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864/40 "2022-03-29T18:15:13Z")
> [@Pardel-Lux](#): > > What is a demitasse for you? A small cup of strong black coffee, probably espresso, often served to round out a large dinner. I occasionally add a drop of cognac to the coffee to liven it up. Is this really dated in France? When it comes to simultaneous translation, there was a time in the '70s when Brezhnev visited the US and was preparing to go home. What he said was (in Russian) “I shall not say ‘good-bye’ but ‘until we meet again.’” His interpreter said (in English) “I shall not say ‘good-bye’ but ‘good-bye.’” The Americans present were taken aback for a moment and then laughed politely. Brezhnev, who already had one foot in the grave, just smiled and nodded. He had no idea what wad going on. I hadn’t been learning Russian for very long, but I already knew there are two ways of saying farewell in Russian: _proshchayte_ (which you say when you’re probably never going to see each other again) and _do svidaniya_ (the equivalent of _au revoir_). The interpreter was obviously at a loss when it came to rendering this in English. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/translating-the-language-of-comics/961864.md?page=3)