# Tree Law, aggressively pruning neighbor **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 30, 2009, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502 "2009-06-30T18:29:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JerseyFrank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bcef8e/32.png) [@JerseyFrank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyFrank)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/1 "2009-06-30T18:29:10Z")
I have a large weeping willow tree in my yard. It is undoubtedly the biggest focal point in the yard. It’s not ancillary. It’s right smack dab in the middle of the rear border of a well landscaped yard. I didn’t plant it. I don’t know if the previous owner did. Based on the size and age of the house, I’d guess that it was there before the house was. This tree is right next to the fence. Its limbs have grown over the fence. My neighbor has indiscriminately lopped off limbs. He’s done it only so far as they have encroached his property line. Despite living there for 5 years, last night was the first time I saw him. He was using a gas line trimmer (weed wacker) to hack the thin weeping branches and leaves off - again, on his side of the property. (Technically, he might have been reaching a bit over the fence, but not by a meaningful amount.) I understand that the tree is a bit of a nuisance. It drops leaves into his pool and mine all the time. I did the neighborly thing and just introduced myself. I casually asked if the tree was dropping as many leaves into his pool as it was mine. We were friendly/neighborly and he said that it was and that he generally hated the tree. I mentioned that I had someone in last year to trim it back. He then told me that he also had someone in a few years ago to prune the limbs that were over his property. So onto the GQ portion of this post… Does he have the right to remove those limbs? What if the trimming causes the tree to be damaged? What constitutes damage? If the tree were to die as a result of his trimming, would he be responsible for the costs of removal and the loss of property value / replacement value of the tree? I’m concerned that his trimming will leave the tree lopsided. That may or may not cause a problem for the health of the tree. If he trims large portions of the tree, I may have to trim my side too so that the tree isn’t damaged or more likely to cause damage to surrounding property. (I don’t actually know if being lopsided affects the tree’s health or safety to surrounding property.) I’m also concerned that the nature of the tree is to have large, sprawling, weeping limbs and that his trimming causes the tree to lose ornamental value. His trimming alone may cause my property to depreciate considerably. Is he responsible for the loss of value? What about roots? Our pools are virtually identical. They are nearly equidistant from the tree. Weeping willows are known for their water absorbing & seeking roots. I had my pool liner replaced and there were many roots that needed to be cut back to install the liner properly. If and when the roots (small or large) make their way under my neighbor’s pool and damage the pool in some way, what responsibility do I bear? In the meantime, I expect that I’ll run into him again “accidentally” and suggest that if the tree needs trimming on his side, perhaps we can split the cost and have it pruned professionally so as to not damage the tree / value. I’d also expect that such an agreement would mitigate his responsibility for damage to the tree/value should something happen due to the trimming. If such an agreement to only trim professionally with costs split existed, would he bear 50% of the liability? Is such an agreement reasonable? ---
**Author:** ![ethelbert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/958977/32.png) [@ethelbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ethelbert)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/2 "2009-06-30T18:47:25Z")
IANAL but I am pretty sure that in New Jersey (where you are unless I miss my guess) he does have the right to trim anything that hangs over his property. In fact, someone on my block went as far as to cut all the roots that came on to his property and everyone on the block seemed to agree that, though it was perhaps not the most neighborly of actions, it was within his rights. If the tree died because of those actions, he was not responsible. Again, this is not something that a lawyer has advised me on. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/3 "2009-06-30T18:47:39Z")
It probably varies by state, but in general, he can trim all branches on his side of the property line so long as it doesn’t kill the tree. He would be responsible for any costs if the tree dies because of the trimming (but I don’t know how easy it would be to prove that). I think the same would apply to the roots. The agreement sounds reasonable to me, but it’s up to him to agree to it. Personally, I’d cut the damn thing down. Had a willow in front of my house, and it was the biggest pain in the ass you could imagine. After a storm, you couldn’t walk across the lawn without getting tangled in willow sticks, which are a nightmare to rake. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/4 "2009-06-30T18:53:44Z")
> [@JerseyFrank](#): > > Is such an agreement reasonable? It certainly seems that way to me. ---
**Author:** ![JerseyFrank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bcef8e/32.png) [@JerseyFrank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyFrank)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/5 "2009-06-30T19:00:48Z")
Yes, **ethelbert** , I’m in New Jersey. Camden County, if it matters. > [@RealityChuck](#): > > Personally, I’d cut the damn thing down. Had a willow in front of my house, and it was the biggest pain in the ass you could imagine. After a storm, you couldn’t walk across the lawn without getting tangled in willow sticks, which are a nightmare to rake. It’s a total pain in the ass. It makes it nigh impossible to get the pool cover off after so many sticks & leaves have landed on it all winter long. But I’m not inclined to get rid of it… _[lebowski]_ That tree really ties the yard together.\* [/dude]\* The truth is that the tree is attractive and adds significant value. To remove and replace it with an equivalent sized willow would be tens of thousands of dollars. If it were to die and that was somehow my neighbor’s financial responsibility, I’d want the money (because of the value), but I’d probably use that money to improve the yard in different, less obtrusive ways. This is NOT a money grab though. Ideally, I’d like to remain neighborly with my neighbors and keep my tree nice for me (and possibly like-minded neighbors) to enjoy. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/6 "2009-06-30T19:05:13Z")
> [@JerseyFrank](#): > > This tree is right next to the fence. Its limbs have grown over the fence. My neighbor has indiscriminately lopped off limbs. He’s done it only so far as they have encroached his property line. Actually, it sounds like he’s lopped off limbs quite discriminately - he’s only trimmed the ones on his side of the line. > [@](#): > > Is such an agreement reasonable? I don’t think so. To you, the tree is both a thing of value (it improves the look of your property) and a nuisance (leaves in pool), so you are willing to spend money on it. To him, it’s just a nuisance. Why should he pay to have the parts over his property trimmed back when he can do it himself at little cost? If I was in his position, I’d give you the opportunity and access to my property to have your own pros come in and trim the tree, but I wouldn’t be willing to pay for it. ---
**Author:** ![Shark\_Sandwich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f04885/32.png) [@Shark\_Sandwich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shark_Sandwich)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/7 "2009-06-30T19:10:57Z")
> [@JerseyFrank](#): > > I’m also concerned that the nature of the tree is to have large, sprawling, weeping limbs and that his trimming causes the tree to lose ornamental value. His trimming alone may cause my property to depreciate considerably. > > Is he responsible for the loss of value? I think you’d also be hard pressed to prove that this tree increases the value of your property. It may increase the sellabilty of your home (and that can be debated as well), but not the value. ---
**Author:** ![JerseyFrank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bcef8e/32.png) [@JerseyFrank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyFrank)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/8 "2009-06-30T19:15:43Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Actually, it sounds like he’s lopped off limbs quite discriminately - he’s only trimmed the ones on his side of the line. Fair enough. He’s trimmed the tree without regard to the health of the tree. > [@](#): > > Why should he pay to have the parts over his property trimmed back when he can do it himself at little cost? He’s already paid someone to trim some of the limbs. The tree is probably 50’ tall. If he wants it trimmed so that it doesn’t cross the property line, he would already have to pay someone. He should pay so that his liability is minimized. Mind you, I’m not convinced one way or the other on him paying. That’s why I asked if it was reasonable. I’m only offering these reasons in response to your question. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/9 "2009-06-30T19:17:34Z")
Weeping willows tend to get into sewer lines and such in their search for water. As for the OP question, in Illinois the property owner does have the right to lop off any branches that cross the property line into his yard. You may wish to get it professionally cut so at least the tree looks good. If you cut it down replace it with a poplar, they great shade trees and grow fast. ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/10 "2009-06-30T19:19:07Z")
You can cut down a willow to an ugly stump and it won’t kill it. It will be ugly, but it won’t die. ---
**Author:** ![JerseyFrank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bcef8e/32.png) [@JerseyFrank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyFrank)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/11 "2009-06-30T19:19:38Z")
> [@Shark\_Sandwich](#): > > I think you’d also be hard pressed to prove that this tree increases the value of your property. It may increase the sellabilty of your home (and that can be debated as well), but not the value. I suspect that I’d be out of luck for compensation strictly for loss of value due to the tree looking “improper” due to him chopping off anything that crosses the fence. But if the tree were to die because of that chopping, I think I’m entitled to the replacement value of the tree… which isn’t strictly related to the property value and could be shown to have an actual cost. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/12 "2009-06-30T19:42:14Z")
> [@Shark\_Sandwich](#): > > I think you’d also be hard pressed to prove that this tree increases the value of your property. It may increase the sellabilty of your home (and that can be debated as well), but not the value. Considering their roots, you could argue it **devalues** the “home” property as well as that of the neighboring property. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/13 "2009-06-30T19:46:37Z")
Here in the U.K., I believe he has the right to trim his side of the property line. How about you ask him to hold off until you get a tree surgeon and then you can both talk to the surgeon to sort out what to do with the tree? ---
**Author:** ![Caffeine.addict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f475e1/32.png) [@Caffeine.addict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caffeine.addict)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/14 "2009-06-30T20:19:28Z")
I googled New Jersey Tree Law and found [this](http://www.njlawblog.com/2007/06/articles/residential-real-estate/rights-of-adjoining-property-owners-overhanging-tree-branches-and-encroaching-tree-roots/). From that blog. > [@](#): > > ``` > In Ackerman v. Ellis, 81 N.J.L. 1, 79 A. 883 (Sup. Ct. 1911) the New Jersey Supreme Court held that tree branches which overhang the premises of another may constitute a nuisance. In such instances, the person over whose land they spread is entitled to an action for damages against the person responsible for their presence there. > > In Wegener v. Sugerman, 104 N.J.L. 26, 138 A. 699 (Sup. Ct. 1927) the New Jersey Supreme Court held that a landowner may lawfully cut overhanging branches of trees or hedges, but may not destroy the tree or hedge on the neighbor’s land. This form of self-help was found to be acceptable to the Court. > > ``` Note that I haven’t read those cases myself and the cases will have more details. According to that, your neighbor has the right to not have the branches on his side. ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/15 "2009-06-30T20:25:54Z")
> [@JerseyFrank](#): > > I suspect that I’d be out of luck for compensation strictly for loss of value due to the tree looking “improper” due to him chopping off anything that crosses the fence. But if the tree were to die because of that chopping, I think I’m entitled to the replacement value of the tree… which isn’t strictly related to the property value and could be shown to have an actual cost. Unfortunately (for you), your underlying assumption, that he is responsible for the damage he causes to the tree in repelling its trespass onto his property, is not correct. Why on earth people insist on making improvements (mural, arboreal, or otherwise) on land that abuts the property line, I’ll never know. But they do, and the common law long ago formulated its response to the ubiquitous question. He is not entitled to cut down your tree, but he is entitled (_generally_) to keep it out of his goddamn backyard (as he undoubtedly puts it). If in the course of doing so your tree dies, so be it. He has no duty of care to your tree. You do have a duty of care to off-property persons who may be adversely affected by your property-line-adjacent improvements, by the by. You may have noticed that I parenthesized and italicized the word generally above. You or your predecessor on the property may be found to have a prescriptive easement (sort of the little brother to adverse possession, a concept that gives every lay lawyer on this board a misbegotten jurisprudential boner) for the tree. The New Jersey Bar has many able practitioners who will be happy to advise you further on this matter of long-settled law. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/16 "2009-06-30T20:28:30Z")
> [@Shark\_Sandwich](#): > > I think you’d also be hard pressed to prove that this tree increases the value of your property. It may increase the sellabilty of your home (and that can be debated as well), but not the value. Agree. I know this is IMHO territory, but it is my opinion that you are encroaching on your neighbor’s freedom and quality of life. While you can obviously keep it from a legal POV, my advice is to be a good neighbor and have the tree removed. ---
**Author:** ![JerseyFrank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bcef8e/32.png) [@JerseyFrank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyFrank)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/17 "2009-06-30T20:31:14Z")
Yikes. It sounds like I should sell this property (kidding). That tree is going to cost me! Thanks everyone for the input & sticking to the answering the questions presented. I feared that this was going to turn into a self-help thread with suggestions on how to talk to the neighbor. So far, I’ve got that covered. Now if I could only convince all of my neighbors to split a fence cost with me… Alas, I live on a cul-de-sac, own the longest 3 sides of the fence, and would have to strike a deal with at least 5 neighbors. ---
**Author:** ![JerseyFrank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bcef8e/32.png) [@JerseyFrank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyFrank)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/18 "2009-06-30T20:35:31Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > You do have a duty of care to off-property persons who may be adversely affected by your property-line-adjacent improvements, by the by. Is this restricted to improvements? I suspect the tree was here before the property was split up and turned into a housing development in the late 80’s. ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/19 "2009-06-30T20:49:14Z")
> [@JerseyFrank](#): > > Is this restricted to improvements? I suspect **the tree was here before the property was split up** and turned into a housing development in the late 80’s. _bolding mine_ CALLING ALL BAR CANDIDATES: Please write a brief memo on implied easements by prior use in New Jersey. > [@Some court somewhere](#): > > Even though an easement is not expressly granted in a conveyance, our courts will find the existence of an easement by implication under certain circumstances. “[A]n ‘easement from prior use’ may be implied ‘to protect the probable expectations of the grantor and grantee that an existing use of part of the land would continue after the transfer.’”. . .We conclude that competent evidence exists in the record to support the trial court’s finding and conclusion that plaintiffs obtained an easement implied by prior use. > > To establish an easement implied by prior use, plaintiffs must prove that: (1) there was a common ownership of the dominant and servient parcels of land and a subsequent transfer separated that ownership, (2) before the transfer, the owner used part of the tract for the benefit of the other part, and that this use was “apparent, continuous and permanent,” and (3) the claimed easement is “necessary” to the use and enjoyment of plaintiffs’ land. _Metts v. Turner_ (N.C. Ct. App., 2002), _available at_ [http://www.aoc.state.nc.us/www/public/coa/opinions/2002/010840-1.htm](http://www.aoc.state.nc.us/www/public/coa/opinions/2002/010840-1.htm) (citations omitted). Hahahaha. I hated property class. ETA: This is not legal advice! Pay an N.J. lawyer! ---
**Author:** ![spinky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502/20 "2009-06-30T20:57:59Z")
Speaking just from a perspective of what’s **neighborly** , what I did in your situation was to basically suck it up and realize that it’s my tree, it doesn’t benefit my neighbor any and if he wants to he can probably be a real pain in the ass about it. So I talked to my neighbor, asked if it would be alright if I came over into his yard from time to time to keep the tree trimmed, he said no problem, and that was that. Sure, it’s more work for me, but it’s the same amount of work I’d have if the entire tree was in my yard. If I wanted to hire someone to trim it (e.g. because it’s huge and I can’t manage it myself), it would be out of my own pocket. ETA: this, of course, doesn’t cover what happens if your neighbor’s idea of what’s “properly trimmed” differs significantly from yours. If he wants the thing pruned “aggressively”, it seems like you might just have to allow him to do it. oh, and this: > [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > (sort of the little brother to adverse possession, a concept that gives every lay lawyer on this board a misbegotten jurisprudential boner) is awesome. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tree-law-aggressively-pruning-neighbor/501502.md?page=2)