# Trolls R Us redux \[Now the argument clinic\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 27, 2020, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349 "2020-06-27T06:30:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 137
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2728 "2021-02-22T18:53:10Z")
For some odd reason, I don’t think he is nearly as friendly as advertised. Funny how many trolls will try to sell just how “polite” they think they are by decorating their posts/handles with innocuous descriptors… ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2729 "2021-02-22T19:14:56Z")
He doubled or tripled down in the ATMB thread, as if he really believes that Biden did that. If he really does, he’s amazingly stupid. If he doesn’t, he’s a troll and should just be banned – trolling in the Pit is bannable. Does he add anything useful in other sub-forums? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2730 "2021-02-22T19:20:58Z")
Obvious trolling. No one believes that shit. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2731 "2021-02-22T19:26:32Z")
I never really thought about it before, but are there rules on SDMB explicitly about deliberately lying - assuming the “deliberate” part can be established beyond a resonable doubt? Deliberate lying in many instances (including this one) would fall under trolling, but not always - could be clickbait, could be propaganda designed to misinform. In general, I think we’d take the approach of responding to false statements by disputing them and correcting them, and not worry about intent. But what if it’s clear the false statements are deliberate? ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2732 "2021-02-22T19:36:54Z")
I think making deliberate false statements (outside of some situations – for example, let’s say the sky is green…) should be treated as trolling. It gets tricky – you need exceptions for parody, sarcasm, hyperbole, off the top of my head. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2733 "2021-02-22T19:43:26Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > He doubled or tripled down in the ATMB thread, as if he really believes that Biden did that. If he really does, he’s amazingly stupid. > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Obvious trolling. No one believes that shit. Exactly, how does that even work anyway? It would make no grammatical sense. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2734 "2021-02-22T19:44:39Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > I think making deliberate false statements (outside of some situations – for example, let’s say the sky is green…) should be treated as trolling. It gets tricky – you need exceptions for parody, sarcasm, hyperbole, off the top of my head.  The part you are searching for in your definition is that the comment is inflammatory. If a statement is deliberately false, is intended to mislead (i.e. not parody, etc.) and is inflammatory, then it by definition **is** trolling. Trolling is just saying disingenuous things with the purpose of pissing people off. And there’s no other reason to post an obviously inflammatory intentional lie. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2735 "2021-02-22T19:49:38Z")
I’m sure he just accepted whatever shitty “news” sources told him this happened at face value. If my “news” or media sources were constantly lying to me and making me look foolish, I’d try and find new ones. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2736 "2021-02-22T19:58:37Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > I’m sure he just accepted whatever shitty “news” sources told him this happened at face value. If my “news” or media sources were constantly lying to me and making me look foolish, I’d try and find new ones. - Either he didn’t actually watch the video or he was desperate to “hear” what Biden said. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2737 "2021-02-22T20:12:14Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I never really thought about it before, but are there rules on SDMB explicitly about deliberately lying - assuming the “deliberate” part can be established beyond a resonable doubt? Deliberate lying in many instances (including this one) would fall under trolling, but not always - could be clickbait, could be propaganda designed to misinform. In general, I think we’d take the approach of responding to false statements by disputing them and correcting them, and not worry about intent. But what if it’s clear the false statements are deliberate? I’m pretty sure that’s covered by this rule: [We have one guiding principle: Don’t be a jerk.](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/registration-agreement-rules-and-faq/823562) I think it’s hard to argue that deliberately lying is not a violation of Rule #1 of the SDMB. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2738 "2021-02-22T20:23:48Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > I’m sure he just accepted whatever shitty “news” sources told him this happened at face value. If my “news” or media sources were constantly lying to me and making me look foolish, I’d try and find new ones. I looked but didn’t find any “news” sources alleging that Biden used the n-word in that speech. However, the top comment under the video he linked to makes the claim. But about an hour ago a youtube video appeared making that claim, 2 hours after the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2739 "2021-02-22T20:32:35Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I’m pretty sure that’s covered by this rule: > > [We have one guiding principle: Don’t be a jerk.](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/registration-agreement-rules-and-faq/823562) > > I think it’s hard to argue that deliberately lying is not a violation of Rule #1 of the SDMB. In fact, from further down the Registration Agreement: > You agree, through your use of this service, that **you will not use the SDMB to post any material that you know or should know is false** and/or defamatory, inaccurate… [my bold] So deliberately or negligently posting things that are false is explicitly against the Registration Agreement, separately from whether it also constitutes trolling or being a jerk. Good to know. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2740 "2021-02-22T23:07:19Z")
Nice catch @Riemann. 👍 ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2741 "2021-02-22T23:23:45Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > If my “news” or media sources were constantly lying to me and making me look foolish, I’d try and find new ones. But then you’re not trying to have your news sources merely confirm what your personal reality is. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2742 "2021-02-22T23:23:49Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > **you will not use the SDMB to post any material that you know or should know is false** Oh, good, I’m relieved that the mods have this cudgel in their toolbelt to use against liars like this. (I gave him the benefit of the doubt until he made it clear he wasn’t at all interested in what really happened) ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2743 "2021-02-22T23:31:10Z")
🙂 Yeah, that is a problem. I may have my beliefs challenged… ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2744 "2021-02-22T23:55:39Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Does he add anything useful in other sub-forums? Well, in the thread on national drinks, he did correctly remind me that the Caesar is a distinctly Canadian drink. But then he went on to say that he prefers Caesars without alcohol. As all Canadians know, clamato juice is basically an alcohol delivery mechanism employed by the Caesar recipe with vodka as its active ingredient. A Caesar without vodka is beneath contempt. It’s like a hammer with the hammer head missing. The only thing you can really do with it is look at it, or stick it up your ass. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2021, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2745 "2021-02-22T23:58:07Z")
Clamato stuck up my ass sounds unpleasant. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2021, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2746 "2021-02-23T00:06:00Z")
Clamenema. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2021, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349/2747 "2021-02-23T00:14:13Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > Clamato stuck up my ass sounds unpleasant. The idea of Clamato existing sounds unpleasant. When I hear the word, all I can think of is George St. Gieglund shouting, “YOU GOT CLAM JUICE, YOU WHITE TRASH IDIOT!” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349.md?page=136) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trolls-r-us-redux-now-the-argument-clinic/913349.md?page=138)