# Trump Adviser: "Gays can be reformed, like arsonists" **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 20, 2016, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508 "2016-11-20T06:16:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/1 "2016-11-20T06:16:37Z")
I’ll ask the same question I did on the white nationalism thread: are any Trump supporters bothered by someone who believes this being in a position close to the P-elect and overseeing domestic policy? [“Gays can be reformed, just like arsonists, Trump’s new domestic policy adviser has said”](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2016/11/19/gays-can-be-reformed-just-like-arsonists-trumps-new-domestic-policy-adviser-has-said/) > [@](#): > > Ken Blackwell, tapped last week by President-elect Donald Trump to head domestic policy during the businessman’s transition to the White House, has made anti-LGBT statements for years. Among them: Homosexuality is a sin, and gay people, just like petty thieves and fire-setters, can be rehabilitated. > > The Ohio politician has long endorsed a controversial mental health practice known as conversion therapy or reparative therapy. The goal is to cure a person of his or her homosexuality, and in the case of transgender people, to reaffirm the gender into which they were born. > > In the past, treatments have included inducing vomiting and using mild electric shock while patients viewed homoerotic images. Since the 1990s, however, the therapy has been denounced by many medical and scientific societies and even outlawed in a handful of states. In 2015, the Obama administration expressed disapproval of the practice after Leelah Alcorn, a 17-year-old transgender teen, took her life in Ohio after being forced by her parents to undergo conversion counseling… > > And in 2009, on Michelangelo Signorile’s radio show, Blackwell reaffirmed his stance, saying, “People choose to be who they are, as they choose to break civil law and God’s law. … I think you can choose not to be homosexual.” ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/2 "2016-11-20T06:46:59Z")
It’s funny, I can’t imagine any confidently heterosexual guys who would talk so much about homosexuality, its causes and methods to not be homosexual anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/3 "2016-11-20T06:49:15Z")
Oh good lord, Ken Blackwell is back? I haven’t heard that name in ten years. He’s quite nuts. He ran for governor of Ohio in 2006 and was shellacked quite comprehensively. It was the worst showing for the Ohio GOP since 1912. What’s with Trump and all these washed-up has-beens? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/4 "2016-11-20T07:14:56Z")
They’ve just been biding their time, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/5 "2016-11-20T07:30:27Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > Oh good lord, Ken Blackwell is back? I haven’t heard that name in ten years. He’s quite nuts. He ran for governor of Ohio in 2006 and was shellacked quite comprehensively. It was the worst showing for the Ohio GOP since 1912. What’s with Trump and all these washed-up has-beens? He’s rather limited in his options. Anyone who has a future in politics wants to keep a safe distance from Trump. He gets to choose from too old to continue and too crazy to have a future. Also keep in mind Trump is very nostalgic, a nepotist and he’s old himself, he’s going to pick people he’s known from his past. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/6 "2016-11-20T07:35:54Z")
The irony gets thicker and thicker. Tighty righty people bitch all the time about how lefties demonize anything conservative as being homophobic, racist, etc. etc. Its almost as if the Trumpniks studied all that and cobbled together the perfect nightmare. Not just vicious and hateful opinions, but _all_ of them, like a box of vile chocolates, gay gumballs, racist raisinettes, cockroach cluster. I would almost think it a kind of parody, if they had that much self awareness and a sense of humor as well. A dark, cramped, constipated sense of humor, but still… ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/7 "2016-11-20T08:29:25Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > The irony gets thicker and thicker. Tighty righty people bitch all the time about how lefties demonize anything conservative as being homophobic, racist, etc. etc. Its almost as if the Trumpniks studied all that and cobbled together the perfect nightmare. Not just vicious and hateful opinions, but _all_ of them, like a box of vile chocolates, gay gumballs, racist raisinettes, cockroach cluster. > > I would almost think it a kind of parody, if they had that much self awareness and a sense of humor as well. A dark, cramped, constipated sense of humor, but still… Bring your pretty words and bitterness on over for some [Trumpness carols](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=811384), I’m bombing over there! (You ugly word people can come too, as long as you’re sufficiently bitter.) ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/8 "2016-11-20T08:59:25Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I’ll ask the same question I did on the white nationalism thread: are any Trump supporters bothered by someone who believes this being in a position close to the P-elect and overseeing domestic policy? > > [“Gays can be reformed, just like arsonists, Trump’s new domestic policy adviser has said”](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2016/11/19/gays-can-be-reformed-just-like-arsonists-trumps-new-domestic-policy-adviser-has-said/) At least one Trump voter here absolutely agrees, in substance if not specifics. I’m sure there are even more who just don’t care. As long as nobody is being shoved in an oven, what’s the big deal, as long as their taxes go down? But call them bigots, and their feelings are hurt. That’s why they voted for this. Sure showed us, huh? ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/9 "2016-11-20T09:38:45Z")
I just can’t help but think that Ken Blackwell finds gay men . . . smoking HOT! CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/10 "2016-11-20T11:45:34Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > At least one Trump voter here absolutely agrees, in substance if not specifics. I’m sure there are even more who just don’t care. As long as nobody is being shoved in an oven, what’s the big deal, as long as their taxes go down? > > But call them bigots, and their feelings are hurt. That’s why they voted for this. Sure showed us, huh? Or maybe they thought, “May as well be hung for a sheep as for a lamb.” For any not familiar with the saying: “For years I’ve been told I’m a racist for thinking voters should show ID and a homophobe for thinking a photographer shouldn’t have to shoot a gay wedding if he doesn’t want to, so why not?” ---
**Author:** ![cuauhtemoc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecb155/32.png) [@cuauhtemoc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cuauhtemoc)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/11 "2016-11-20T15:14:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > “For years I’ve been told I’m a racist for thinking voters should show ID and a homophobe for thinking a photographer shouldn’t have to shoot a gay wedding if he doesn’t want to, so why not?” “For years I’ve been told I’m a bomb-throwing Leninist for thinking the government has a role to play in promoting social welfare and keeping income inequality in check, so why not?” [starts throwing actual bombs] ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/12 "2016-11-20T15:16:29Z")
Had to sneak that in there, did you, lad? Just couldn’t resist? For the one hundred and umpteenth time, I repeat: there is nothing inherently racist about voter ID, or even wrong. It’s about using that to attain and cement a political advantage, to suppress voters and their votes. You prefer to argue the point you can win rather than the point actually advanced. Its as if I insisted that Christmas has become commercialized, and you respond that, no, you’re wrong, Christmas Day is officially the 25th of December. Undeniably true, but utterly irrelevant. Will you please stop doing that? There’s a good fellow. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/13 "2016-11-20T15:23:07Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Or maybe they thought, “May as well be hung for a sheep as for a lamb.” > > For any not familiar with the saying: “For years I’ve been told I’m a racist for thinking voters should show ID and a homophobe for thinking a photographer shouldn’t have to shoot a gay wedding if he doesn’t want to, so why not?” Two problems here. Firstly: those are the simplified, strawman/nutpick versions of liberal arguments. Voter ID laws are demonstrably racist in effect, if not intent. Attempts to further them may very well be based on racial animus. Pretty easy to turn this into “If you support voter ID laws, you’re racist” if you’re trying to discredit the opposing argument and make it seem like the other side is being unreasonable. Same with the photographer - if you simplify the argument enough, the entirely reasonable argument of “You shouldn’t be allowed to discriminate against homosexual people when offering goods and services” can be turned into… well, what you just said. Secondly: “I’ve been accused of being a little bit of an asshole for quite some time (for reasons that are largely justified but I did not understand), and I’m sick of it, so why not just be as big of an asshole as I can possibly be”. What. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/14 "2016-11-20T15:48:10Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Or maybe they thought, “May as well be hung for a sheep as for a lamb.” > > For any not familiar with the saying: “For years I’ve been told I’m a racist for thinking voters should show ID and a homophobe for thinking a photographer shouldn’t have to shoot a gay wedding if he doesn’t want to, so why not?” This is more accurate: _“For years, you’ve been accusing me of being a racist, a sexist, and a homophobe. I guess now I can admit you were right all along and those accusations have all been true.”_ People didn’t become racist because they’re accused of racism. They get accused of racism because they’re already racist. This is just another example of conservatives finally admitting that what the liberals have been saying for years is true. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/15 "2016-11-20T15:48:57Z")
What about _gay_ arsonists? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/16 "2016-11-20T15:53:17Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > For the one hundred and umpteenth time, I repeat: there is nothing inherently racist about voter ID, or even wrong. There’s nothing inherently racist about slavery either. But in the real world, both were applied on the basis of race. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/17 "2016-11-20T15:54:20Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > What about _gay_ arsonists? Flaming in every sense of the word. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/18 "2016-11-20T15:58:54Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Had to sneak that in there, did you, lad? Just couldn’t resist? For the one hundred and umpteenth time, I repeat: there is nothing inherently racist about voter ID, or even wrong. It’s about using that to attain and cement a political advantage, to suppress voters and their votes. You prefer to argue the point you can win rather than the point actually advanced. > > Its as if I insisted that Christmas has become commercialized, and you respond that, no, you’re wrong, Christmas Day is officially the 25th of December. Undeniably true, but utterly irrelevant. > > Will you please stop doing that? There’s a good fellow. Perhaps **Bricker** was not speaking about you, specifically. He probably wasn’t even speaking about himself, considering the post he was responding to. He can correct me if I’m wrong, but I read his post as reflective of what lots of Americans are thinking when they are broad-brushed called racists for supporting a particular policy that is not, as you yourself say, inherently racist. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/19 "2016-11-20T16:01:18Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > What about _gay_ arsonists? I always thought flaming homosexuals meant like Village People gay. Apparently I was ill informed. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2016, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508/20 "2016-11-20T16:02:41Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > At least one Trump voter here absolutely agrees, in substance if not specifics. Sorry, not clear to me which position you are agreeing with. Please clarify. > [@](#): > > I’m sure there are even more who just don’t care. As long as nobody is being shoved in an oven, what’s the big deal, as long as their taxes go down? > > But call them bigots, and their feelings are hurt. That’s why they voted for this. Sure showed us, huh? I’ll amend that to “as long as nobody **they know and/or love** is being shoved into an oven.” Trouble is, the oven shovers trend to cast their nets wider as time goes on. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-adviser-gays-can-be-reformed-like-arsonists/772508.md?page=2)