# Trump and Harris agree to September 10th ABC debate - Watch Along Starts at Post 431 **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump, kamala-harris\ **Created:** [August 8, 2024, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440 "2024-08-08T20:59:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 70
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1381 "2024-09-11T20:16:48Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > Sorry, it was going to his rally with people leaving early. To be fair, it’s the same thing. People leaving his rally is making the size of the crowd shrink. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1382 "2024-09-11T20:29:51Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > How can you say that Harris is not providing enough policy details when Trump Woah there. I didn’t say Harris didn’t provide enough policy details (although I wish she had provided more). I don’t use the same standard for Trump as I do for Harris, which is probably why my opinion is an unpopular one. I already know who Trump is and what he’s apt to do. We had him as President for four years. He has a track record I can look at, and trust, way better than whatever spews forth from his mouth. I’ve previously written about how I evaluate incumbents versus challengers - it doesn’t carry over 100% because Trump is not the sitting President, but the point is that I see Trump as a known quantity at this point. Did he say anything that lowered my opinion of him more than it already was? No, I don’t think so. Kamala Harris is to me kind of like, who is this person? That’s why I watched this debate. I mean, I know she was Vice President. I know she used to be a Senator. I know, like at a high level, that she did some things. But I don’t know all the things she did while serving in those roles. I don’t know what’s important to her - as reflected by her actions, as opposed to mere words. Her career wasn’t newsworthy, to the point that I would see articles on her, until President Biden dropped out. As a Republican I didn’t follow the 2020 Democratic primary very closely. To me, she’s very much an unknown quantity. So I’m paying attention to her body language and facial expressions and the things she says, with more scrutiny than I do for Trump. I want to know she has the temperament necessary for the job - which means being able to deal with Republicans. Because there is no chance of her getting two branches of Congress. But also, I want to know if a vote for Harris is a vote for a second Biden term, or if she wants to shake things up, or what. I’m not a politico and I haven’t been following the internal politics of the Biden administration. I don’t know what decisions/initiatives were Harris’s doing and what was Biden’s doing. VPs generally get more involved in foreign policy but whatever Harris accomplished, hasn’t filtered down to my ears. Whether it’s because I live in a bubble or bad messaging on her campaign’s part, or just that she hasn’t done much, I couldn’t say. That’s what I wanted to see from her more than anything else: here’s what I accomplished. And she did, to a limited extent, like sharing intelligence with President Zelenskyy and casting the tie-breaking vote for the Inflation Reduction Act. But it’s not clear she did anything other than the formalities. She’s not claiming that, but for her leadership, Ukraine would not be there today. For all I know, she didn’t do anything exceptional in either case. How involved was she in drafting the provisions of the IRA? She didn’t, for example, claim credit for getting those crucial votes from Senators Manchin and Sinema. And of course, there was no bipartisan cooperation in that law so it says nothing about her abilities to lead if we get a Republican controlled Senate. Does she have any cherished laws from her days as a Senator? Not that I recall. The only thing I know she did as a Senator was being at the Capitol on 1/6, which is not nothing, but also not evidence of leadership ability. She touted her experience as a prosecutor, but she’s not running for Attorney General, and she didn’t actually specify how she thinks that experience carries over to the job of President. To be clear I think Ms. Harris had a good performance, it just wasn’t good enough, in my opinion. I live in Florida. Trump has this state in the bag so I’m voting my conscience, rather than strategically. The question for me is whether to vote for Harris or third party. And her debate was not enough to convince me to vote for Harris, which is my standard for ‘winning the debate’. That doesn’t mean I’ve decided to vote third party - I haven’t even looked at candidates yet and will probably end up putting off the decision until the last minute. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1383 "2024-09-11T20:33:02Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > So I’m paying attention to her body language and facial expressions and the things she says, with more scrutiny than I do for Trump. And that’s going to tell you if she’s going to be a better POTUS. 🙄 ^ That emoji needs to be like 10 times bigger. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1384 "2024-09-11T20:36:03Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > And that’s going to tell you if she’s going to be a better POTUS. And what criteria _should_ I use, other than body language, facial expressions, and the things the candidate says? ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1385 "2024-09-11T20:36:40Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > And of course when Trump tried the “I’m speaking” bit on her, he had to oversell it by saying “see what I did there?!?” Yes, because Trump isn’t subtle. He has to gloat. It would have been a great burn, but he ruined it, because he’s that self- involved. He couldn’t allow that to slip by a _few_ people that had to have the joke explained by their friends, he had to highlight it to ensure everybody knew. Someone once said “Explaining a joke always makes it funnier.” Same thing here. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > The one answer I wish she would’ve given differently is on the economy. Something like: While I like your answer for addressing the issue, she used it to twist Donald’s tail with that remark about the Wharton School. Got him to state all those Wharton school professors live him - you know, all the professors he had 50 years ago. I’m sure one or two of them are still alive, though no bets on still active at the school. > [@PhillyGuy](#): > > So I think repeating crucial messages, like the tax breaks, and “we have so much more in common than what separates us,” was important. I’m thinking more about the time she said the taking point and then immediately restated it. It was very clunky. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > My local television station’s Facebook post had a comment that not only was the pet-eating story true, but that there is a restaurant in Disney that serves human remains as food. She admonished us to “do our research”. So the MAGA crowd was untouched. Soylent Green is Real! Or maybe just a theme restaurant having a little fun? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1386 "2024-09-11T20:38:41Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > the things the candidate says? This. This is what matters, yet you’re making it a trivial part of your analysis. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1387 "2024-09-11T20:41:51Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Harris is a competent leader who will preside over a cabinet of distinguished experts. Yeah, I would really have appreciated if she could say here’s a project where we accomplished a lot, and it’s because of the people _I_ put on the project. Right now my internal picture of Kamala Harris is that she is not Trump and that’s pretty much all she has going for her, in my opinion, since I don’t actually seem to agree with her on any policies… ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1388 "2024-09-11T20:42:58Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > This is what matters, yet you’re making it a trivial part of your analysis. Well it would be different if I agreed with her on policy, or even if I thought she could pull off the policies she’s actually proposed. Speaking of which that was one of the points Mr. Trump made that I agreed with. I think it’s mean of her to taunt women with the unrealistic prospect of a federal law protecting abortion rights. I fully understand the analogy to student loans in that respect, as an empty promise. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1389 "2024-09-11T20:47:54Z")
One of the most shocking things, which I don’t see getting much media attention, was Trump’s steadfast refusal to pledge support for Ukraine against Russia. Instead, he kept insisting that he would “end the war”, and it seems obvious to me that what he was proposing was to immediately surrender to Russia once elected. Ronald Regan, he’s not. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1390 "2024-09-11T20:49:37Z")
I understood it to mean he would pressure Ukraine into permanently conceding significant swaths of territory, by threatening to cut off all support entirely. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1391 "2024-09-11T20:50:30Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Woah there. I didn’t say Harris didn’t provide enough policy details (although I wish she had provided more). I’ve been hearing that a lot with respect to Harris, before the debate and after. This comment isn’t specifically adressed to you, Max, but you did remind me of it. In the debate, Harris said she’s in favor of a $6,000 child tax credit, and a $50,000 deduction to start small businesses. Trump says he’ll have tariffs, but I haen’t heard him say how high, on which products, or on which countries. I’d like to hear more specifics from Harris (and I suspect she has them), but I’ve heard none from Trump. > [@Irishman](#): > > Soylent Green is Real! No, just Soylent Calico. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1392 "2024-09-11T20:53:14Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > I may try to do that. The sound of his voice makes me cringe. It’s like he swallowed Shirley Temple. > > ETA: Maybe I could just watch with the volume off. His voice makes me feel sick, almost literally. I followed the debate live right here on SDMB while glancing at the muted TV once in a while. Tonight I’m going to enjoy carefully reading the full transcript of the debate, and then watch all of it muted with subtitles. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1393 "2024-09-11T20:53:39Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > You probably shouldn’t actively lie, but telling the truth can sometimes be a problem. Better to talk about something else entirely. Exactly. That’s why I think her answer to the first question was excellent. She not only avoided the trap set for her right off the bat, but got Trump to start going down his bizarre rants about immigration. Had she she went with some kind of a “things are bad right now, we messed up, but I’ll fix it next time” type answer, I suspect Trump wouldn’t have become unhinged the way he did. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1394 "2024-09-11T20:53:45Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > And what criteria _should_ I use, other than body language, facial expressions, and the things the candidate says? Well in 2024 all you need to know is she’s not Trump. Of course, she has a lot more going for her, but that one thing alone makes it an easy choice. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1395 "2024-09-11T20:55:08Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Trump says he’ll have tariffs, but I haen’t heard him say how high, on which products, or on which countries. Well, Trump is unhinged. But he has those Trump tariffs that were actually in place, if you remember they were on things like steel and washing machines and solar panels. The reason it doesn’t bother me so much when Trump lacks details is because he has the actual record to look at, and when he says he wants to double or quadruple what was there before, I get what he means. I know what he’s selling, so to speak. Mr. Trump made those tariffs unilaterally, meaning without Congressional approval, by exploiting a legally grey loophole on national security grounds. The tax credits &etc. Ms. Harris proposed will require an act of Congress, no small feat. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1396 "2024-09-11T20:56:29Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Well it would be different if I agreed with her on policy, or even if I thought she could pull off the policies she’s actually proposed. See? _That_ is a fair criticism. > [@Max\_S](#): > > I think it’s mean of her to taunt women with the unrealistic prospect of a federal law protecting abortion rights. As opposed to the guy who **literally** engineered to have those rights ripped away? Note that Republicans are pushing for a national ban. This is a fact. And the Congress we have now is not going to be the same as what we will have next year. Who knows how the balance of power will shift. It is not “mean of her” to do everything in her power to undo the tyranny and abuse brought about by Trump and his Republican allies. It’s the opposite. Note that stopping all undocumented immigration is impossible and Trump is taunting people by promising that. Trump is promising a new form of health care, better and cheaper than the ACA, and yet he admitted he has no actual plan. You admitted that you hold Harris to a different standard as Trump, and it’s also clear that the standard is that what’s bad for Harris is fine if Trump does it, even if Trump does it ten times as much. And hey, that’s fair if that’s your opinion I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1397 "2024-09-11T20:56:46Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Well in 2024 all you need to know is she’s not Trump. Of course, she has a lot more going for her, but that one thing alone makes it an easy choice. But even before the debate, I knew I wasn’t voting for Trump. As I wrote, since my state is going to Trump anyways, for me the choice is Harris or third party. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1398 "2024-09-11T20:59:39Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > As I wrote, since my state is going to Trump anyways Not completely in the bag. It is a long shot but not outside of possibility for him to lose there. You vote has much more of a chance to matter than mine does. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1399 "2024-09-11T21:02:27Z")
Well, I’ll keep checking as the election draws nearer. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2024, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440/1400 "2024-09-11T21:05:01Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Well, Trump is unhinged. But he has those Trump tariffs that were actually in place, if you remember they were on things like steel and washing machines and solar panels. The reason it doesn’t bother me so much when Trump lacks details is because he has the actual record to look at, and when he says he wants to double or quadruple what was there before, I get what he means. I know what he’s selling, so to speak. That’s holding Trump and Harris to different standards. Has he said he’d double or quadruple the existing tariffs (and what happened to triple)? Would there be new tariffs on other products or other countries? Where are these hundreds of billions of dollars going to be coming from? (I know, of course, that any tariffs would actually be paid by importers, and passed to consumers.) Again, I don’t direct these questions just to you, but to the many, many people saying “Harris needs to be more specific.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440.md?page=69) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-harris-agree-to-september-10th-abc-debate-watch-along-starts-at-post-431/1005440.md?page=71)