# Trump and his "Cat License" **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 5, 2019, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713 "2019-09-05T00:17:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/61 "2019-09-06T01:43:15Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > And, AGAIN, the NHC forecast which he “projected” on was THREE DAYS OLD (issued on August 29) when he made his tweets on Sunday (September 1). By that time, the storm had moved, conditions had changed, and the NHC had repeatedly updated the forecast. As has been shown in several links in this thread, by Sunday morning, the NHC’s forecast storm track went nowhere near Alabama. And it also bears mentioning that Trump’s Sunday tweet wasn’t just a prudent assertion of the “need to be prepared”. He went **way** overboard with the alarmist rhetoric: > [@](#): > > In addition to Florida - South Carolina, North Carolina, Georgia, and Alabama, will most likely be hit (much) harder than anticipated. That statement at the time he made it was FALSE. As of Sunday, it was not “most likely”, or even likely, or even remotely possible, that Alabama would be “hit (much) harder than anticipated”. Which was why it was possible for the National Weather Service in Birmingham to contradict Trump’s lie so strongly a bare 20 minutes after he tweeted it: > [@](#): > > Alabama will NOT see any impacts from #Dorian. We repeat, no impacts from Hurricane #Dorian will be felt across Alabama. The system will remain too far east. #alwx Face it, **Magiver** , President Trump on Sunday made a stupid and ignorant alarmist misstatement that was inconsistent with known data at the time, and caused a lot of unnecessary and unjustified concern among the people naive enough to trust his claims. That is not defensible behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/62 "2019-09-06T01:43:23Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > I’m really concerned about the tendency of some Trump supporters–and **Magiver** is clearly one–to dismiss yet another indication that Trump is suffering from some kind of cognitive decline. They also appear to consider him an expert in everything. The generals don’t know anything (but he’s got the best generals. But they don’t know anything). The weather people can’t even figure out which side of a Sharpie you draw with. He’s got the best people, the best people, believe me, but they can’t do anything without him but he never knew the guy. The majority of two-year-olds are better at staying on track than he is. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/63 "2019-09-06T02:38:45Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > The majority of two-year-olds are better at staying on track than he is. The majority of two-year-olds are better at lying than He is. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/64 "2019-09-06T02:42:51Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > As there were a number of models showing it moving through Alabama and Georgia and they were all wrong then where is the lie in the prediction? Seriously. Where is the lie? It’s a prediction. He actually mentioned that. He said that on the map with many lines, each line representing a model, and in all cases Alabama was hit. Can you find the map that shows every model of the hurricane’s predicted path hitting Alabama? Because I can find him saying that he had a map showing that. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/65 "2019-09-06T03:16:41Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Again, he projected one of many forecasts a fraction further in the same direction which is just a common sense way of looking at it. > > It’s standard practice for leaders to stress the need to be prepared. this s a mountain out of a no-hill driven by a need to demonize the President. > > Anybody with common sense could look at the projection and see a need for people in Alabama to be concerned. What about Louisiana and Mississippi? Shouldn’t they have been concerned too? Why didn’t Trump include them in his warning? Maybe you think that’s going too far? But the NHC map didn’t go far enough? So Trump’s Sharpie doodle got it just right? This is Through the Rabbit Hole shit, man. Donny Jay could be the greatest statesman and president who ever lived and he still would have no business overruling qualified meteorologists. Who would even do that? And why? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/66 "2019-09-06T03:39:06Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > It’s standard practice for leaders to stress the need to be prepared. this s a mountain out of a no-hill driven by a need to demonize the President. That logic goes both ways. If this is such a no-hill, why are Trump, and you, spending any effort trying to prove that he was right? If you think other people need to demonize the President, why do you have such a need to defend him even when he’s demonstrably wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/67 "2019-09-06T03:55:26Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > If this is such a no-hill, why are Trump, and you, spending any effort trying to prove that he was right? This. If Trump had made a misstatement about the danger to Alabama, and when the National Weather Service corrected him had said “Sorry Alabama, my bad”, then I’d agree that people shouldn’t still be squawking about _OMG Trump fucked up the hurricane forecast, how terrible_. But Trump **didn’t** apologize or admit his error: on the contrary, he’s been the one incessantly doubling down on this stupid and fundamentally trivial situation. (Probably in order to distract attention from some worse shit in his administration, or to rile up his base because he’d rather look flat-out stupid than conscious of his fallibility.) It’s one thing to make a dumb mistake, but it’s not cool to continue stubbornly and outrageously bullshitting the public you’re supposed to be serving. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/68 "2019-09-06T05:57:20Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Again, he projected one of many forecasts a fraction further in the same direction which is just a common sense way of looking at it. No, I’m sorry… no. It’s not “common sense” to alter a forecast map that has been prepared by trained meteorologists who use actual data to come up with the map. No. It’s not “common sense” to take a map made by scientists for the purpose of informing the public of a major weather event, and scribble on it with a sharpie to show you were right, and all the scientists who made the map were wrong. This is bordering on fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/69 "2019-09-06T09:52:56Z")
I remember watching [Baghdad Bob](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Saeed_al-Sahhaf) comically assert stuff that was clearly false, and thinking in some sort of superior fashion that I was happy to live in a culture where such things were utterly impossible. I apologize for being so incredibly naive. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/70 "2019-09-06T11:49:25Z")
[https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-bubble-hurricane-dorian-map-alabama](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-bubble-hurricane-dorian-map-alabama) “White House Official Says Trump Personally Drew Sharpie Bubble On Map” ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/71 "2019-09-06T11:49:41Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Also, fun fact: [this is illegal](https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2019/09/04/president-trump-shows-doctored-hurricane-chart-was-it-cover-up-alabama-twitter-flub/). I have been on the fence about POTUS impeachment due to weak claims, but after this stunt, I say, impeach the MFer now! ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/72 "2019-09-06T12:06:53Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Anybody with common sense could look at the projection and see a need for people in Alabama to be concerned. Sure, anybody with common sense who doesn’t have a degree/experience in meteorology, or experience with the general tendency of gulf-/atlantic-coast storms to hook toward the northeast at some point during their life cycle. Why do you suppose the NHC (you know, the people who are qualified to make hurricane forecasts) never released a forecast indicating Alabama was in harm’s way? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/73 "2019-09-06T12:13:25Z")
Trump thinks he is a weatherman because he once slept with a woman named Stormy. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/74 "2019-09-06T12:16:24Z")
While I still think this was just a mistake on his part that he’s no doubling down on, does he have any interests in Alabama? Is it possible he was trying to include Alabama in the forecasts in order to divert relief funds to that state or a business in that state? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/75 "2019-09-06T13:04:05Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > [Report: WH Official Says Trump Drew Sharpie Bubble On Map](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-bubble-hurricane-dorian-map-alabama) > > “White House Official Says Trump Personally Drew Sharpie Bubble On Map” The man can clearly draw a pretty good circular arc. I wonder if it was free hand, or if he used an old-school compass or an anchor point of some sort, about which to rotate his sharpie marking. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/76 "2019-09-06T13:08:26Z")
Supposedly he spent _too_ much time looking at interior decorating patterns for his projects, so it would not surprise me if he took several copies of the map and just kept drawing on new ones until he got a good approximation of a circle. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/77 "2019-09-06T13:10:03Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > While I still think this was just a mistake on his part that he’s no doubling down on, does he have any interests in Alabama? Is it possible he was trying to include Alabama in the forecasts in order to divert relief funds to that state or a business in that state? Doug Jones is a Democrat who replaced Jeff Sessions in the Senate via special election. He has to run again in 2020. Trump needs every Republican senator he can get. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/78 "2019-09-06T13:47:12Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Again, he projected one of many forecasts a fraction further in the same direction which is just a common sense way of looking at it. > > It’s standard practice for leaders to stress the need to be prepared. this s a mountain out of a no-hill driven by a need to demonize the President. > > Anybody with common sense could look at the projection and see a need for people in Alabama to be concerned. On September 4th he drew a line in sharpie that extended the NOAA forecast from the morning of August 29th into Alabama to back up his claim that on September 1st he had new information that Alabama was going to be hit. “And, I will say, the states – and it may get a little piece of a great place: It’s called Alabama. And Alabama could even be in for at least some very strong winds and something more than that, it could be. This just came up, unfortunately. It’s the size of – the storm that we’re talking about. So, for Alabama, just please be careful also.” The dates of these things matter. There was no forecast on September 1st showing a danger to Alabama. Altering a forecast from August 29th does not retroactively create a forecast on September 1st showing that Alabama was in danger. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/79 "2019-09-06T14:20:35Z")
Here’s a [timeline](https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/06/politics/fact-check-timeline-of-trumps-alabama-dorian-map-fiasco/index.html) of the Sharpie Saga. About a third the way down the page one can the NOAA forecast from September 1. It is quite clear that Alabama is not in danger and even extending that forecast would not put Alabama in danger. It was incredibly irresponsible for the president later that same to day to say that he had new information that Alabama was in danger when he did not. It is also not possible for the forecast from the 29th that he extended into Alabama on the 4th to have been that new information. ---
**Author:** ![rbroome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/838e76/32.png) [@rbroome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rbroome)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713/80 "2019-09-06T14:21:05Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > OK, I’ll play along. I’d like to dismiss this as another mindless political attack on the President. > > How did he fake a prediction last Thursday? Are you implying the NHC prediction was accurate? Because… it wasn’t. by a considerable amount. Not even close. All he did was extended it out a little further which is common sense. Did you think the NHC version was going to evaporate before Alabama. > > Since the NHC was wrong you must know something we don’t. Show your work. You miss several important points. First, the NOAA forecast chart that was altered is an official government document that describes the results of the model+forecast. It doesn’t show Alabama because Alabama wasn’t in the forecast-the forecast is for a limited time, which is carefully documented and tested for validity. Obviously, common sense would have you realize that if the storm did in fact reach Tallahassee Alabama would feel the effects soon. But the NOAA map isn’t based on just common sense, it is based on a forecast for a limited time. The NOAA forecast WAS accurate at the time. It accurately described the results of the forecast. That the forecast turned out to change with additional data is inevitable and not a criticism of the forecast. That ALWAYS happens. To alter the map is to change what NOAA said. That is a bad thing. Second, NOAA weather service forecasts are by law special. If the weather service makes a prediction that a storm is or isn’t going somewhere, many expensive and dangerous things start to happen. Evacuations, stockpiling, personnel relocations, etc. NOAA has been sued before for blowing a forecast which resulted in the loss of life. If it were some guy on Youtube speculating on the future course of the storm that would be one thing. But the President is a Government official. What he says matters. He was needlessly exposing the Government to possible legal liability. NOAA is very protective of their forecasting responsibility. For good reason. I live in Louisiana and the legal and practical consequences of a weather forecast are immediately obvious to us several times a year. To cite a few examples, if a Tropical Storm or Hurricane is anywhere in the Gulf one can’t buy flood insurance. The window closes completely. So you can’t buy or sell a house when that happens. Which makes for a tense time down at the mortgage lenders offices whenever a storm is predicted. Large refineries and oil rigs have to suddenly shift operations and fly people around when a storm is predicted. And those decisions are not optional. No one is allowed to say, aw heck, the storm isn’t really coming here. I could go on. But millions of dollars are always spent and lives are put at risk (and occasionally lost) based solely on the NOAA weather forecast. Yes, no one would take Trumps prediction seriously. But you could also bet that a business facing a large bill would try to make a case out of a top Government official making his own weather prediction. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-and-his-cat-license/839713.md?page=5)