# Trump associates may have coordinated with Russians, according to US officials **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 23, 2017, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799 "2017-03-23T00:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 153
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2017, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3044 "2017-11-28T23:23:40Z")
I’m not wasting my time looking up things that I think are well known, and also very incidental to the key issue under discussion. Sherrerd can believe whatever he/she wants. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3045 "2017-11-29T00:05:44Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > I’m not wasting my time looking up things that I think are well known, and also very incidental to the key issue under discussion. It was _your_ claim. If you can’t support it, then you can’t support it. (Also, what Sage Rat said.) ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3046 "2017-12-01T03:12:18Z")
_President Trump over the summer [repeatedly urged senior Senate Republicans](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/30/us/politics/trump-russia-senate-intel.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news), including the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, to end the panel’s investigation into Russia’s interference in the 2016 election, according to a half dozen lawmakers and aides. Mr. Trump’s requests were a highly unusual intervention from a president into a legislative inquiry involving his family and close aides._ These are not the actions of an innocent man. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3047 "2017-12-01T03:32:17Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > _President Trump over the summer [repeatedly urged senior Senate Republicans](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/30/us/politics/trump-russia-senate-intel.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news), including the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, to end the panel’s investigation into Russia’s interference in the 2016 election, according to a half dozen lawmakers and aides. Mr. Trump’s requests were a highly unusual intervention from a president into a legislative inquiry involving his family and close aides._ > > These are not the actions of an innocent man. They’re not. But that Trump was doing these things comes as no surprise. He has the impulse control of a toddler. The interesting thing (to me) is the extent to which even Republicans have resisted him. There is a sizeable faction who will follow Trump right into the sewer to the entire detriment of their own careers, both politically and possibly legally (think Devin Nunes). But I think there is also a faction who will act to remove Trump once they feel they have the political cover provided by the outcome of the Mueller investigation. Cowardly? You bet. But maybe a ray of hope for something positive before the mid-terms. I expect December, January and February to be brutal. I think by March, things are going to get extremely bad for Trump, and very fast. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3048 "2017-12-01T03:56:01Z")
How long before Manafort makes a scramble for Paraguay, I wonder? ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3049 "2017-12-01T04:59:40Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > How long before Manafort makes a scramble for Paraguay, I wonder? Assuming he’s got a fourth passport squirreled away somewhere, since I expect the three we know about have been confiscated already. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3050 "2017-12-01T05:27:33Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Assuming he’s got a fourth passport squirreled away somewhere, since I expect the three we know about have been confiscated already. Yes, the existing three were confiscated. Perhaps he has a fourth – or can manage to get another one made (presumably with a new identity, too). ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3051 "2017-12-01T05:41:13Z")
> [@](#): > > How long before Manafort makes a scramble for Paraguay, I wonder? We have extradition with Paraguay, only place the Federal gov can’t reach you is Puerto Rico. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3052 "2017-12-01T05:49:05Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > We have extradition with Paraguay, only place the Federal gov can’t reach you is Puerto Rico. Sick burn! Well done. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3053 "2017-12-01T05:52:21Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > We have extradition with Paraguay, only place the Federal gov can’t reach you is Puerto Rico. Indeed, well played. 😃 (I thought we didn’t have extradition with Paraguay, so ignorance fought as well.) ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3054 "2017-12-01T06:03:00Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > There is a sizeable faction who will follow Trump right into the sewer to the entire detriment of their own careers, both politically and possibly legally (think Devin Nunes). But I think there is also a faction who will act to remove Trump once they feel they have the political cover provided by the outcome of the Mueller investigation. Cowardly? You bet. But maybe a ray of hope for something positive before the mid-terms. I suspect that the pro-Trump faction is pretty tiny (particularly in the Senate). After all, both the House and Senate Intelligence committees are investigating Trump, and I believe that the Ethics committees of both arms are as well; Mueller was appointed by Trump’s own cabinet; and most congressmen, when asked about Mueller, just say something to the effect of, “Let’s see the investigation out.” There is only a handful of congressmen, and I think they’re all in the House, that have done anything to support Trump or attack Mueller. But I do agree that they’re all waiting for an excuse to bail on him. The annoying thing for me, looking at the decision by the RNC to back Trump rather than force him to run against Cruz, during the primaries, and looking at what a sweet, oblivious oaf George W. Bush has seemed in every outing since leaving the Presidency, is that I think the RNC had basically decided that it’s too difficult to run an intelligent man for the Presidency. Most of the electorate likes people that they can understand in their own terms and if you give that to them, then you’ve got a lock on the Executive branch. You just have to hope that the idiot in question will bow to his VP, the people in his cabinet, and Congress. I think that Ryan and McConnell thought that they could suck up to Trump and polish his ego sufficiently to be able to keep him in line. And so those two are now wishing for an out, on a problem that they probably voted to take on, because they wanted to run the country from Congress, not the Executive branch. They made Trump promise to take their pick of VP and Supreme Court Justice, and figured that the rest could be handled through some basic manipulation and simple reason like, “Even your most adamant followers, when polled, are saying that you should stop tweeting.” So while I do appreciate that the roosters have come home to roost, for the RNC, it annoys me that the rest of us have to pay for their dirty schemes. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3055 "2017-12-01T14:25:57Z")
Flynn is being charged with making false statements to the FBI. TV reports that he will plead guilty (presumably as part of a deal): [http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/breaking-59](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/breaking-59) ---
**Author:** ![Randolph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Randolph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randolph)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3056 "2017-12-01T14:42:00Z")
**Hark!** The falling domino sings. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3057 "2017-12-01T14:49:10Z")
This list of people that are bigger than Flynn, and therefore worth giving him a plea deal, is pretty small. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3058 "2017-12-01T14:53:03Z")
So what happens if Trump pardons Flynn? I assume that’s legal (even if it’s very obviously incredibly shady). Has Flynn broken any NY state laws? If so, presumably Mueller has been working with the NY AG, and then NY would prosecute. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3059 "2017-12-01T15:11:38Z")
Flynn has already pled guilty, which makes a pardon moot, since it doesn’t vacate the conviction. Flynn has voluntarily given up his presumption of innocence on the lying to the FBI charge, probably in exchange for his testimony against higher-ups (and, as **Snarky Kong** has noted, there aren’t very many higher-ups above his former position with the campaign and the administration). A pardon doesn’t negate that. I’m guessing the next fish (and the one Flynn is putting the bait on the hook for) is Kushner, because Jared is up to his eyeballs in this whole thing. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3060 "2017-12-01T15:20:28Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > We have extradition with Paraguay, only place the Federal gov can’t reach you is Puerto Rico. A late entry for Post Of The Year. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3061 "2017-12-01T16:13:01Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Flynn has already pled guilty, which makes a pardon moot, since it doesn’t vacate the conviction. Flynn has voluntarily given up his presumption of innocence on the lying to the FBI charge, probably in exchange for his testimony against higher-ups (and, as **Snarky Kong** has noted, there aren’t very many higher-ups above his former position with the campaign and the administration). A pardon doesn’t negate that. > > I’m guessing the next fish (and the one Flynn is putting the bait on the hook for) is Kushner, because Jared is up to his eyeballs in this whole thing. Oh, Ivanka! That poor dear! This must be mortifying for her. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3062 "2017-12-01T16:16:33Z")
[https://twitter.com/ABC/status/936628560374071296](https://twitter.com/ABC/status/936628560374071296) ABC News reports that Flynn is prepared to testify that he was ordered by Trump to contact Russians. ---
**Author:** ![dgrdfd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eb8c5e/32.png) [@dgrdfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dgrdfd)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2017, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3063 "2017-12-01T16:29:07Z")
So where are the collusion-deniers now? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=152) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=154)