# Trump associates may have coordinated with Russians, according to US officials **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 23, 2017, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799 "2017-03-23T00:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 188
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3744 "2018-01-30T03:15:39Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > In what way do you think they’ll try to influence the election this time? And I seriously doubt the Republicans would use that particular excuse; I think a different one, almost certainly, equally lame. It seems to me that Republican politics has been in a bizarre, reverse-feedback loop for years. George W. Bush was touted as a plain-speaking, common-sense, businessman; a president who’d streamline government, cut taxes, etc. At the end of his two terms the deficit was rising and the economy was in a shambles. Bush, himself, became _persona non grata_ within the party, but a mere 8 years later the same people who rejected Bush have decided that the country needs a businessman president to streamline government, cut taxes, and all the other things that haven’t worked for 30 years. And they’re more fervent in their beliefs than ever. They keep trying to pull rabbits of their hat, “this time, for sure!” I fully expect the Russian meddling in the coming election to be along the lines of “stop Russian meddling in elections, vote Boris Badenov!” and I’m worried that lots of people will believe it. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3745 "2018-01-30T03:24:56Z")
> [@Arizona\_Mike](#): > > Sounds pretty hamfisted and Bubba-like, yeah: > > [Bill Clinton’s airport run-in with Loretta Lynch was no accident](https://nypost.com/2016/10/03/book-details-how-team-obama-schemed-to-let-hillary-skate/) That article was written by a guy who the National Review - a thoroughly conservative publication - saw fit to criticize for making shit up about Hillary Clinton in his 2005 book. Why? Because among other things, he claimed that Chelsea Clinton was the product of a marital rape. So, uh, you find this guy trustworthy? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3746 "2018-01-30T03:53:37Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > So, uh, you find this guy trustworthy? Republican-trustworthy: “He says all the right things about people I hate.” ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3747 "2018-01-30T03:59:11Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > That article was written by a guy who the National Review - a thoroughly conservative publication - saw fit to criticize for making shit up about Hillary Clinton in his 2005 book. > > Why? Because among other things, he claimed that Chelsea Clinton was the product of a marital rape. > > So, uh, you find this guy trustworthy? Consider the source of the “reporter.” You may as well take your news from the National Enquirer. And that’s probably an insult to the Enquirer. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3748 "2018-01-30T04:25:29Z")
Considering their connection to Trump, no, not really. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3749 "2018-01-30T04:28:30Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > In what way do you think they’ll try to influence the election this time? I’m not sure of the “in what way,” but the CIA believes that they’ll be trying to do so: > [@BBC](#): > > Asked if his concerns extended to the upcoming US mid-term elections in November, he replied: “Of course. I have every expectation that they will continue to try and do that, but I’m confident that America will be able to have a free and fair election [and] that we will push back in a way that is sufficiently robust that the impact they have on our election won’t be great.” > **[Russia 'will target US mid-term elections' says CIA chief](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42864372)** > > The director of the CIA tells the BBC there has been no reduction in Russian meddling in Europe and the US. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3750 "2018-01-30T04:28:49Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Considering their connection to Trump, no, not really. True 'nuff. But my opinion of the New York Post is even lower. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3751 "2018-01-30T04:44:49Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > That article was written by a guy who the National Review - a thoroughly conservative publication - saw fit to criticize for making shit up about Hillary Clinton in his 2005 book. > > Why? Because among other things, he claimed that Chelsea Clinton was the product of a marital rape. > > So, uh, you find this guy trustworthy? I put him on the dismiss column when I found that he wrote a book calling Obama “The Amateur” :rolleyes: And that roll eyes is there because one has to wonder then: how does Klein sees a certified troglodyte political neophyte like Trump? Why, he is best buddies with him! [https://wonkette.com/601339/what-do-you-suppose-donald-trump-talked-about-at-lunch-with-clinton-conspiracy-nut](https://wonkette.com/601339/what-do-you-suppose-donald-trump-talked-about-at-lunch-with-clinton-conspiracy-nut) ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2018, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3752 "2018-01-30T04:52:22Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > I’m not sure of the “in what way,” but the CIA believes that they’ll be trying to do so: > > [Russia 'will target US mid-term elections' says CIA chief](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42864372) Yeah, do keep an eye on Pompeo. [CIA Backs Off Director’s Claim that Russian Meddling Didn’t Swing the 2016 Election](https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/10/20/558947072/cia-backs-off-directors-claim-that-russian-meddling-didnt-swing-election) (NPR) ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3753 "2018-02-02T04:21:05Z")
Possibly the biggest news in a while, though I don’t know that it will get much media notice: > **[Manafort co-defendant’s lawyers quit](https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/371914-manafort-co-defendants-lawyers-quit/)** > > Lawyers for Richard Gates, a former Trump campaign aide charged with tax fraud and money laundering last year as part of special counsel Robert Mueller’s Russia probe, have fil… I don’t know exactly what this means, but I suspect that it means that Gates has flipped. A week or two ago, it was reported that Gates had a new lawyer, and that the new lawyer was seen going to Mueller’s office several times. Now, the old lawyers are gone. Maybe they were being paid for by Manafort? I don’t know, but I suspect that it’s because the old lawyers were incompatible with a cooperation deal in some way. As of several pages ago, like the majority here, I didn’t think that it mattered much if Gates flipped, since it would only take out Manafort. But, apparently, the relationship between Manafort and Trump goes back to the 80s and they’ve worked on quite a few things together, both in business and in local politics: > **[Paul Manafort and Donald Trump Have Known Each Other for a Very, Very Long Time](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/a-timeline-of-paul-manaforts-relationship-with-the-trump-world.html)** > > They’ve known each other since the 1980s. So while, before, I assumed that they had separate money laundering deals, it now seems a lot more likely that they would have shared a lot of the same contacts and methods. Before, it sounded like Trump had maybe hooked up Manafort with one of his exorbitant loans, through some buddies in the financial biz, and that maybe there might be a path through that back to Trump (traveling through several steps). Gates might be a lead, but only a first step in a long path. It now seems a lot more likely that they would have had regular deals to launder money together and that Gates would have seen an array of those deals and, potentially, his testimony can directly go straight to Trump, or at least reduce the number of layers that need to be traversed. If Mueller already has a lot of Trump transaction data that had been flagged as suspect, it might be as easy as showing a few of them to Gates and seeing if he can confirm and testify to the effect that those transactions were specifically in the aim of laundering illicit cash. Conceivably, we could see movement in just days on the money laundering front. I don’t know that I can would put the odds of that at anything higher than 20%, but at the moment, it was looking like we might have to wait all of the way to 2019 for one of the money trails to open up. I’ll be checking Trump’s Twitter for attacks on Gates. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3754 "2018-02-02T06:29:52Z")
[Sen. Ron Wyden (D-OR) seeks documents on Russia money links to the NRA](https://apnews.com/adafcdc056ad4086aedc0fdb387ddede/Senator-seeks-documents-on-Russia-money-links-to-the-NRA). > [@](#): > > In letters sent to Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin and the NRA on Friday, Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon requested any documents showing financial links between Russia and the gun lobbying organization. News reports last month said the FBI is investigating contact between Alexander Torshin, who is the deputy governor of Russia’s central bank and a close ally of President Vladimir Putin, and the NRA. > [@](#): > > A separate letter addressed to NRA treasurer Wilson Phillips Jr. included a more specific request for documents that detail financial transactions with Russian nationals. > > “I am specifically troubled by the possibility that Russian-backed shell companies or intermediaries may have circumvented laws designed to prohibit foreign meddling in our elections,” Wyden wrote. > > The letter cited a story on the FBI investigation published by McClatchy last month. The NRA, one of the most powerful lobbying groups in U.S. politics, spent heavily to support Donald Trump’s presidential candidacy. The candidate strongly backed gun rights. **Torshin, who is a lifetime member of the NRA, reportedly met with Donald Trump Jr. during an NRA gala in 2016.** (bolding mine) I also posted this in the Mueller thread in the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3755 "2018-02-02T17:59:28Z")
Well, the Nunes memo is out and it’s a complete dud. Basically, it says that FBI used part of the Steele dossier as justification to get a warrant on Page. Republicans are saying this proves the Trump investigation is based on the dossier. However, three problems with that. 1) Carter Page is not Donald Trump. 2) the FBI waited until he left the campaign to get the warrant and 3) it’s a counter-intelligence warrant, which means they’re really watching Russians and may or may not be interested in Page. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3756 "2018-02-02T18:08:09Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > Well, the Nunes memo is out and it’s a complete dud. Basically, it says that FBI used part of the Steele dossier as justification to get a warrant on Page. Republicans are saying this proves the Trump investigation is based on the dossier. However, three problems with that. 1) Carter Page is not Donald Trump. 2) the FBI waited until he left the campaign to get the warrant and 3) it’s a counter-intelligence warrant, which means they’re really watching Russians and may or may not be interested in Page. And, according to Glenn Simpson’s testimony, the Steele dossier was only used to confirm information that the FBI had already developed. I haven’t read the memo yet, but Nunes is also claiming that Steele had an axe to grind against Trump according to the news services (another assertion that tends to be contradicted by Simpson’s testimony), and that the original meeting between the FBI official and Steele was improper and that that official should have been fired. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3757 "2018-02-02T19:00:27Z")
And Page was a subject of interest to the FBI be since 2013, apparently. (Adding in Paul Manafort, that makes at least two people in the campaign that were already under investigation by the FBI before it ever started.) ---
**Author:** ![Arizona\_Mike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7cd45c/32.png) [@Arizona\_Mike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arizona_Mike)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3758 "2018-02-02T19:19:09Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > And, according to Glenn Simpson’s testimony, the Steele dossier was only used to confirm information that the FBI had already developed. > > I haven’t read the memo yet, but Nunes is also claiming that Steele had an axe to grind against Trump according to the news services (another assertion that tends to be contradicted by Simpson’s testimony), and that the original meeting between the FBI official and Steele was improper and that that official should have been fired. Sounds like Simpson was an unreliable witness. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3759 "2018-02-02T19:30:23Z")
> [@Arizona\_Mike](#): > > Sounds like Simpson was an unreliable witness. Darn those professionals who don’t say what you want to hear. Darn them to heck. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3760 "2018-02-02T21:12:30Z")
> [@Arizona\_Mike](#): > > Sounds like Simpson was an unreliable witness. You realize Republicans are already distancing themselves from the memo? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3761 "2018-02-02T21:31:56Z")
> [@Arizona\_Mike](#): > > Sounds like Simpson was an unreliable witness. How so? I’ve read both testimonies of his, and I don’t see anything that’s inconsistent in either. Feel free to cite specific, _evidenced_ instances of how he is unreliable. Not your belief, but facts. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3762 "2018-02-02T23:01:45Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > You realize Republicans are already distancing themselves from the memo? For instance…? ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2018, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3763 "2018-02-03T01:03:58Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > For instance…? [https://mobile.twitter.com/SenatorLankford?ref\_src=twsrc^tfw&ref\_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.lawfareblog.com%2Fnotable-reactions-nunes-memo](https://mobile.twitter.com/SenatorLankford?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.lawfareblog.com%2Fnotable-reactions-nunes-memo) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=187) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=189)