# Trump associates may have coordinated with Russians, according to US officials **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 23, 2017, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799 "2017-03-23T00:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 198
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3944 "2018-02-23T20:10:20Z")
> [@Tzigone](#): > > Here’s the [plea document](https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/23/politics/rick-gates-plea-document/index.html). I take that to be the document he’s expected to affirm and sign, since it doesn’t seem to be written by him. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3945 "2018-02-23T20:24:09Z")
Shorter Gates: “Oh, look…I’m not an untouchable Master of the Universe after all!” ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3946 "2018-02-23T20:28:32Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > I take that to be the document he’s expected to affirm and sign, since it doesn’t seem to be written by him. Yeah, that’s just how they labeled it, I see. Can anyone make anything of the [Rohrabacher mention](http://www.latimes.com/politics/essential/la-pol-ca-essential-politics-updates-gates-plea-in-russia-investigation-1519412418-htmlstory.html). Trying to understand any actual implications. Of course, now Gates actually had pled (pleaded?) guilty, but only to two counts. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3947 "2018-02-23T21:01:22Z")
> [@Tzigone](#): > > Yeah, that’s just how they labeled it, I see. > > Can anyone make anything of the [Rohrabacher mention](http://www.latimes.com/politics/essential/la-pol-ca-essential-politics-updates-gates-plea-in-russia-investigation-1519412418-htmlstory.html). Trying to understand any actual implications. > > Of course, now Gates actually had pled (pleaded?) guilty, but only to two counts. From Talking Points Memo: > [@](#): > > … Per the court filing, Gates on Feb. 1 knowingly and falsely testified that “there were no discussions of Ukraine” at a March 19, 2013 meeting between Manafort, “a senior Company A lobbyist,” and “a Member of Congress.” > > Though the document does not name the other two participants, their identities can be pieced together from contemporaneous news reports and recent filings with the Justice Department under the Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA). > > The member of Congress appears have been Rep. Dana Rohrabacher (R-CA), jokingly nicknamed “Putin’s favorite congressman” for his strong pro-Russia stance. Manafort’s June 2017 FARA filing– which acknowledges that his firm, DMP International, LLC, conducted millions of dollars in business with the pro-Russia Ukrainian Party of Regions –notes that he met with Rohrabacher on that day. Three days later, Manafort donated $1,000 to Rohrabacher’s congressional campaign. [Who Was In The Fateful Meeting That Rick Gates Lied To Mueller About? - TPM – Talking Points Memo](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/rick-gates-lied-mueller-meeting-ukraine-manafort-mercury-rohrabacher) As a member of Congress, presumably Rohrabacher would be of most use to Putin (and to Putin’s chosen Ukrainian pols) as an advocate for reducing sanctions, and for whatever other geopolitical positions Putin wants to see being promoted by the US. He’s chair of the U.S. House Foreign Affairs Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations, where he can short-circuit any criticisms of Russia that might arise due to Putin’s dismal record on human rights. Other than that, I can’t guess. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3948 "2018-02-23T21:24:16Z")
[Manafort Left an Incriminating Paper Trail Because He Couldn’t Figure Out How to Convert PDFs to Word Files](https://slate.com/technology/2018/02/paul-manafort-couldnt-convert-pdfs-to-word-documents.html) ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3949 "2018-02-23T21:30:42Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > [Manafort Left an Incriminating Paper Trail Because He Couldn’t Figure Out How to Convert PDFs to Word Files](https://slate.com/technology/2018/02/paul-manafort-couldnt-convert-pdfs-to-word-documents.html) I can almost forgive that part for a non-tech person on older versions Office. It’s not being able to save the Word document as a PDF that gets me. It’s just a ‘Save As’, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3950 "2018-02-23T21:33:37Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > [Manafort Left an Incriminating Paper Trail Because He Couldn’t Figure Out How to Convert PDFs to Word Files](https://slate.com/technology/2018/02/paul-manafort-couldnt-convert-pdfs-to-word-documents.html) I’m a computer forensics guy. That article makes me smile. I’d love to do the forensics on some of the devices involved in this case. Putting together the timeline of document revisions and such would be a hoot. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3951 "2018-02-23T21:34:48Z")
> [@Tzigone](#): > > I can almost forgive that part for a non-tech person on older versions Office. It’s not being able to save the Word document as a PDF that gets me. It’s just a ‘Save As’, isn’t it? Yes, as far as I know, recent versions of Word let you simply ‘save as’ a PDF. But these guys were making millions through their money-laundering. If Manafort had an old version of Word/Office, he could surely have come up with a few bucks to upgrade. And even as far back as 2015 (when the ‘help me, Gates’ email trail was made), there were plenty of YouTube videos that anyone could easily access by typing ‘convert PDF’. Thirty seconds of viewing and ol’ Paul could have figured it out. What a doofus. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3952 "2018-02-23T21:56:03Z")
[Paul Manafort is fukt.](https://apnews.com/6ebdbd65b9744284aa304bb1f0c67548/The-Latest:-Manafort-responds-to-Gates'-guilty-plea) > [@](#): > > The new allegation against Paul Manafort comes in a newly unsealed indictment made public Friday. The indictment followed a guilty plea by Manafort’s longtime business associate, Rick Gates. > > The indictment accuses Manafort of paying the former politicians, informally known as the “Hapsburg group,” to appear to be “independent” analysts when in fact they were paid lobbyists. Some of the covert lobbying took place in the U.S. > > The indictment says the group was managed by a former European chancellor. Court papers accuse Manafort of using offshore accounts to pay the group more than 2 million euros. > [@](#): > > Paul Manafort says in a statement that the plea by Rick Gates on Friday does not change his commitment to defend himself against what he calls “untrue piled up charges.” Manafort says he had “hoped and expected” that Gates would have “the strength” to continue to trial. He says Gates chose to plead guilty for “reasons yet to surface.” I’m gonna guess that “several years in jail” and “the loss of everything that comprises his life” were pretty strong motivators. Unfortunately, the people he’s been dealing with prolly have a different priority for those things. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3953 "2018-02-23T22:15:29Z")
“A former European chancellor”? How many countries have chancellors? I didn’t read the Wiki very closely, but aren’t we pretty much talking Germany, Austria, or Switzerland? > **[Chancellor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chancellor)** > > Chancellor (Latin: cancellarius) is a title of various official positions in the governments of many nations. The original chancellors were the cancellarii of Roman courts of justice—ushers, who sat at the cancelli or lattice work screens of a basilica or law court, which separated the judge and counsel from the audience. A chancellor's office is called a chancellery or chancery. The word is now used in the titles of many various officers in various settings (government, education, religion). Now... It’s gotta be the Swiss, right? You can’t have a real scandal unless Swiss banks are involved somehow. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3954 "2018-02-23T22:26:32Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > [Manafort Left an Incriminating Paper Trail Because He Couldn’t Figure Out How to Convert PDFs to Word Files](https://slate.com/technology/2018/02/paul-manafort-couldnt-convert-pdfs-to-word-documents.html) Hahaha…that’s hilarious…and all too common. I’m still surprised by how many people are just too lazy or uninformed to learn basic things when it comes to IT, although the degree is lessening over time. But then if they didn’t, there’d probably be substantially less IT jobs available. ---
**Author:** ![ganthet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de0a6/32.png) [@ganthet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ganthet)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3955 "2018-02-23T22:30:03Z")
> [@Bayard](#): > > “A former European chancellor”? How many countries have chancellors? I’m guessing it’s Gerhard Schroder, former chancellor of Germany from ‘98 to 2005. He’s been involved in several investment firms since leaving office and is particularly known for being close to Putin and publicly sympathetic to Russian actions in Crimea and elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3956 "2018-02-23T22:42:16Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > [Paul Manafort is fukt.](https://apnews.com/6ebdbd65b9744284aa304bb1f0c67548/The-Latest:-Manafort-responds-to-Gates'-guilty-plea)I’m gonna guess that “several years in jail” and “the loss of everything that comprises his life” were pretty strong motivators. Unfortunately, the people he’s been dealing with prolly have a different priority for those things. Here is a link to the indictment - [https://www.justice.gov/file/1038741/download](https://www.justice.gov/file/1038741/download) - five new charges. I wonder what, if any, complications will hit the group of European politicians? (Page 22 - item 30) ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3957 "2018-02-23T23:29:20Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > Here is a link to the indictment - [https://www.justice.gov/file/1038741/download](https://www.justice.gov/file/1038741/download) - five new charges. > > I wonder what, if any, complications will hit the group of European politicians? (Page 22 - item 30) Check out page 30, listing the forfeitures: [This property alone is Zillowed at $1.6 million](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1046-N-Edgewood-St-Arlington-VA-22201/12085537_zpid/) [This may be about $2.5 million](https://streeteasy.com/building/29-howard-street-manhattan#tab_building_detail=2) [$4.1 million in Brooklyn](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/377-Union-St-Brooklyn-NY-11231/30572214_zpid/) [$9 million in Water Mill, NY](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/174-Jobs-Ln-Water-Mill-NY-11976/32731144_zpid/) And his cash value life insurance policy. Which, by the way, this is a BAD TIME for Manafort to be losing his _life insurance_! So, that’s… $17 million, estimated? ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3958 "2018-02-23T23:48:57Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Check out page 30, listing the forfeitures: > > [This property alone is Zillowed at $1.6 million](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1046-N-Edgewood-St-Arlington-VA-22201/12085537_zpid/) > > [This may be about $2.5 million](https://streeteasy.com/building/29-howard-street-manhattan#tab_building_detail=2) > > [$4.1 million in Brooklyn](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/377-Union-St-Brooklyn-NY-11231/30572214_zpid/) > > [$9 million in Water Mill, NY](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/174-Jobs-Ln-Water-Mill-NY-11976/32731144_zpid/) > > And his cash value life insurance policy. Which, by the way, this is a BAD TIME for Manafort to be losing his _life insurance_! > > So, that’s… $17 million, estimated? Did you read through the list of wire transfers? Imagine the number for the Trump Organization. That indictment will be delayed just for all the typing… ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2018, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3959 "2018-02-23T23:53:07Z")
[Seriously: Paul Manafort is FUKT!](https://apnews.com/d783c2fdba7642c290eddd965452603a/Ex-Trump-aide-pleads-guilty,-will-cooperate-in-Russia-probe) > [@](#): > > The plea by Rick Gates revealed that he will help special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation in “any and all matters” as prosecutors continue to probe the 2016 campaign, Russian meddling and Gates’ longtime business associate, one-time Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2018, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3960 "2018-02-24T00:11:30Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Check out page 30, listing the forfeitures: > > [This property alone is Zillowed at $1.6 million](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1046-N-Edgewood-St-Arlington-VA-22201/12085537_zpid/) > > [This may be about $2.5 million](https://streeteasy.com/building/29-howard-street-manhattan#tab_building_detail=2) > > [$4.1 million in Brooklyn](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/377-Union-St-Brooklyn-NY-11231/30572214_zpid/) > > [$9 million in Water Mill, NY](https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/174-Jobs-Ln-Water-Mill-NY-11976/32731144_zpid/) > > And his cash value life insurance policy. Which, by the way, this is a BAD TIME for Manafort to be losing his _life insurance_! > > So, that’s… $17 million, estimated? So, are those assets pledged for bail? Is that even allowed? ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2018, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3961 "2018-02-24T01:37:29Z")
> [@Bayard](#): > > “A former European chancellor”? How many countries have chancellors? I didn’t read the Wiki very closely, but aren’t we pretty much talking Germany, Austria, or Switzerland? > > [Chancellor - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chancellor) > > It’s gotta be the Swiss, right? You can’t have a real scandal unless Swiss banks are involved somehow. The [Swiss](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chancellor_of_Switzerland) Chancellor is a very different office from the German or Austrian ones. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2018, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3962 "2018-02-24T02:09:38Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > So, are those assets pledged for bail? Is that even allowed? No, this is what the government will seize if Manafort is convicted. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2018, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/3963 "2018-02-24T02:26:02Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > No, this is what the government will seize if Manafort is convicted. And Sir Burnt Sienna buys it for pennies on the dollar. That was the plan the whole time! 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=197) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=199)