# Trump associates may have coordinated with Russians, according to US officials **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 23, 2017, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799 "2017-03-23T00:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 240
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2018, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4785 "2018-07-18T20:57:02Z")
Aren’t they supposed to be svelte, slinky and sexy? I mean, this whole Slavic thing may rock in Bulgaria, where the men crave the sturdy potato dumpling look… ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2018, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4786 "2018-07-18T21:41:36Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Of course. Their remote maintenance needs didn’t end in 2006. They might have stopped using PCanywhere, but all this means is they used another means to remote into their machines. Something custom written, perhaps something from Kaperski (sp)? Wouldn’t be surprised–given the years-long push to get consumers to take advantage of the free-or-cheap Kaspersky security (ha!) software, they or a related company may well have been offering free software to election officials and voting-machine manufacturers for just as many years. All these centuries, later, we _still_ fail to understand the lesson of the Trojan Horse story… ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2018, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4787 "2018-07-18T22:30:33Z")
A voting machine shouldn’t even have something worth calling an OS, just everything hardcoded to do one basic task. And yeah, reading more of the new Butina document, the two were “cohabiting” - which since they talk about her apartment I take to not mean cohabiting but rather “sexing”. She’s not Antje Traue, but for a 55 year old, dumpy bald man, a 29 year old red head probably seems like a decent catch. That he’d let her run him so hard probably tells us a bit about the other romantic prospects that he had in life (i.e., not many). ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2018, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4788 "2018-07-18T23:22:37Z")
Who was the “he”, there? She seems to get named together with a lot of old white guys. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2018, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4789 "2018-07-18T23:38:00Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Who was the “he”, there? She seems to get named together with a lot of old white guys. Paul Erikson. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2018, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4790 "2018-07-18T23:51:31Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Paul Erikson. Includes photo: [Meet The Operative Who Was Alleged Conduit Between Mariia Butina And GOP - TPM – Talking Points Memo](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/paul-erickson-center-nexus-between-butina-russia-gop) ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4791 "2018-07-19T01:17:42Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Aren’t they supposed to be svelte, slinky and sexy? I mean, this whole Slavic thing may rock in Bulgaria, where the men crave the sturdy potato dumpling look… How is this not GOP catnip? I mean, c’mon. Most of these guys (at gun shows or in politics) aren’t Chris Hemsworth either, for that matter. [![](https://images.dailykos.com/images/566707/story_image/maria_butina_ruger1022archangel_D6A5649web.jpg?1531772294) ](https://images.dailykos.com/images/566707/story_image/maria_butina_ruger1022archangel_D6A5649web.jpg?1531772294) ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4792 "2018-07-19T02:12:32Z")
Don’t usually cross-post, but [this](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/18/world/europe/trump-intelligence-russian-election-meddling-.html) seems important: New York Times: > [@](#): > > WASHINGTON — Two weeks before his inauguration, Donald J. Trump was shown highly classified intelligence indicating that President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia had personally ordered complex cyberattacks to sway the 2016 American election. > > The evidence included texts and emails from Russian military officers and information gleaned from a top-secret source close to Mr. Putin, who had described to the C.I.A. how the Kremlin decided to execute its campaign of hacking and disinformation. > > Mr. Trump sounded grudgingly convinced, according to several people who attended the intelligence briefing. But ever since, Mr. Trump has tried to cloud the very clear findings that he received on Jan. 6, 2017, which his own intelligence leaders have unanimously endorsed. My goodness. I’m shocked. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4793 "2018-07-19T02:21:24Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Don’t usually cross-post, but [this](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/18/world/europe/trump-intelligence-russian-election-meddling-.html) seems important: > > New York Times: > > My goodness. I’m shocked. This was two weeks before he took office. So it’s good. Now we need proof that he ordered it/supported it from the get go. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4794 "2018-07-19T02:28:48Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > This was two weeks before he took office. So it’s good. Now we need proof that he ordered it/supported it from the get go. I don’t know if proof is needed that he ordered it. I don’t think it is much in doubt that he supported it, based solely on what we already know. All this goes to obstruction, and it may even be evidence of his participation in an ongoing conspiracy against the interests of the United States, throughout the entirety of his “presidency.” ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4795 "2018-07-19T03:27:15Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I don’t know if proof is needed that he ordered it. I don’t think it is much in doubt that he supported it, based solely on what we already know. All this goes to obstruction, and it may even be evidence of his participation in an ongoing conspiracy against the interests of the United States, throughout the entirety of his “presidency.” That’s true. Yet, I’m still hoping for a 5 day senate hearing asking him questions. That would just be hilarious. “Were you given information on Russian election meddling on–” “Obama! He did it! He’s the one who gave it to me personally!” And things like that. I’d love to be a video content supervisor on this. Every time he says, “I didn’t say that” we play the tape. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4796 "2018-07-19T03:45:03Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > That’s true. **Yet, I’m still hoping for a 5 day senate hearing asking him questions.** That would just be hilarious. “Were you given information on Russian election meddling on–” “Obama! He did it! He’s the one who gave it to me personally!” And things like that. > > I’d love to be a video content supervisor on this. Every time he says, “I didn’t say that” we play the tape. 😃 Only 5 days? 😉 I’m still waiting for this day: [From Russia With Love](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEG41O5Y9-k) Never gets old. 🙂 Although we need to update… Mueller has got the first one already. You’re aware that Jared Kushner has been evading service of a subpoena since April, right? His Secret Service detail has prevented it from being served. Not a subpoena from Mueller, though. Which is good… means he’s more likely a target. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4797 "2018-07-19T04:05:53Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Only 5 days? 😉 > > I’m still waiting for this day: [From Russia With Love](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEG41O5Y9-k) > > Never gets old. 🙂 > > Although we need to update… Mueller has got the first one already. > > You’re aware that Jared Kushner has been evading service of a subpoena since April, right? His Secret Service detail has prevented it from being served. Not a subpoena from Mueller, though. Which is good… means he’s more likely a target. Oh, best part of video is Kelly Anne Conway who won’t shut up. As far as Kushner goes, “I never met him,” says Donald Trump. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4798 "2018-07-19T06:16:30Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > For many people, politics is just a sport now, where you root for your team blindly. So what if your team fiddled with the ball to get an advantage? So what if your players use PEDs? So what if the officials give your team the better calls? That’s life in the big leagues. I could understand that point of view if it wasn’t so selective. Ask them about Obamacare and it’s “forsooth, he rammed it down our throats with a 60 vote Senate majority and 18 months of open debate, and a biased supreme court! Usurper!” ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4799 "2018-07-19T06:59:26Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > …You’re aware that Jared Kushner has been evading service of a subpoena since April, right? His Secret Service detail has prevented it from being served. Not a subpoena from Mueller, though. Which is good… means he’s more likely a target. Sorry but I’m having trouble finding anything that says Kushner has been personally subpoenaed for anything. My Google-fu is failing me today. I did find reference to Kushner Co being served supoenas in April but that would seem to be something else. I would appreciate it if you could direct me to anything about him using his Secret Service detail to dodge service. ETA: Huh, looks like this must be what you are talking about - [https://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000164-aa6b-d7cf-aff4-ee7f62cc0000](https://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000164-aa6b-d7cf-aff4-ee7f62cc0000) ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4800 "2018-07-19T07:04:08Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > Sorry but I’m having trouble finding anything that says Kushner has been personally subpoenaed for anything. My Google-fu is failing me today. I saw mention of this on Rachel Maddow’s show on Tuesday night. She indicated that whoever is trying to serve the subpoenas is now resorting to sending them via regular USPS mail, as all other methods were being blocked by the Secret Service. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4801 "2018-07-19T14:02:34Z")
I was looking into some of the various crimes that could plausibly be linked to the Russian government - i.e., supported by or"allowed" to continue - and apparently St. Petersburg and Moscow are centers of child prostitution. I have also been rereading the Steele Dossier, since I was curious whether Butina would show up (possibly she is the emigree who is mentioned in one section, but it’s not obvious that she is if so). The Dossier, I was surprised to discover (since it has been a long time since I read it) intimates that Trump’s questionable financial interests were largely Chinese in nature not Russian. While the Dossier does present the pee tape narrative, in other places it simply says that Russia has various materials on sexual behaviors that Trump has engaged in. It also notes that Trump came to Russia far more frequently than makes sense given his business interests. Offers were made several times to him, on various projects, but he turned them down. Now there was a lawsuit of a Jane Doe against Trump, accusing him of raping her when she was 13. I read it, back in 2016, and her account described how she saw him at a party but then later she was tied to a bed (as I recall) and a man entered and raped her, and even though it was black and he was in silhouette, she knew it was him. Which may well be true, but seems liable to fail in court, which is potentially why the case was dropped. Obviously, it could also be the case that it was a crazy person or a person seeking money. The woman’s lawyer says that she was threatened to abandon the case. This was all as part of Trump’s relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. Trump himself had commented that Epstein liked “the younger sort”, in 2002. Epstein was not arrested until 2005. As of 2002, Trump claimed to have been friends with him for 15 years, and there doesn’t seem to be any indication that Trump ceased being friendly until the arrest. Now, apparently there was a second Epstein/Trump case that I had missed before: > **[The one weird court case linking Trump, Clinton, and a billionaire pedophile](https://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/04/jeffrey-epstein-trump-lawsuit-sex-trafficking-237983)** > > A woman suing in connection with Jeffrey Epstein’s underage sex ring claims she was first approached while working as a towel girl at Trump’s Mar-a-Lago resort. A woman named Virginia Giuffre is claiming that Epstein’s girlfriend recruited her into “servicing” Epstein, as a 15 year old while she was working at Mar-A-Lago. Notably, Alan Dershowitz, the previously staunch Liberal lawyer who now defends Trump’s presidency through various opinion pieces, served as Epstein’s lawyer in the 2005 case. He appears to have been friends with him since, at least, the late 90s and there are flight logs of the two of them with unknown girls of which Dershowitz remembers the age of one but not the remainder: > **[Flight Logs Put Clinton, Dershowitz on Pedophile Billionaire’s Sex Jet](https://www.gawker.com/flight-logs-put-clinton-dershowitz-on-pedophile-billio-1681039971)** > > Bill Clinton took repeated trips on the " > Lolita Express"—the private passenger jet owned by billionaire pedophile Jeffrey Epstein—with an actress in softcore porn movies whose name appears in Epstein's address book under an entry for "massages,"... Now, George Nader appears to have been the go-between of Trump and the UAE for some deal that currently we do not have any information on. Ostensibly, it was the fifth or sixth attempt to set up a back channel with Russia. George Nader is a convicted pedophile who was introduced to Trump, it seems, by Elliot Broidy - who appears to be a shady bastard second only to Harvey Weinstein, though possibly more in the realm of general corruption and financial misdeeds. > **[The wild story of how a convicted pedophile got his picture taken with Trump](https://www.businessinsider.com/george-nader-elliot-broidy-photo-with-trump-2018-5)** > > According to the Associated Press, the circumstances surrounding the photo are unclear, but it may have been linked to a $189,000 donation from Broidy to the Republican National Committee. Ultimately, it currently seems unclear when these three (Trump, Broidy, and Nader) met or what previous exploits they may have had. I have never found the pee tape story particularly compelling. While silly, having a bunch of prostitutes pee on the bed of someone you hate seems like Wolf of Wall Street / powerful rich man who can get away with anything shenanigans. It’s not wearing a diaper and begging Mommy to peg you. But, notably, Keith Schiller didn’t deny that Russia tried to send Trump some prostitutes, he just said that they were turned away. But no one asked how old they were. I probably doubt that Trump is a pedophile - as in someone who actively and pointedly only has urges for sex with children - but I wouldn’t be shocked to discover that the man doesn’t give a fuck how old his sexual partners are, to some extent, and may even have used the pretext of an offer for some deal in Russia to have taken the occasional trip there, to get what he can’t in the US, even though he wasn’t strongly considering those offers. A pee tape would not explain Trump’s extreme deference to Putin. A video of Trump with a 13, 14, or 15 year old girl, peeing or otherwise, that’d have you obeying every little command with zero hesitation. I can’t say that this is conclusive, by any means, but I can say that your average person knows fewer than two convicted pedophiles and generally will create relationships after establishing such behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4802 "2018-07-19T14:20:42Z")
Create -\> Severe ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4803 "2018-07-19T14:25:26Z")
Did Obama tell his cyber security chief to stand down during the Russian cyber attacks on the month of the election? Clarity is needed. Why in the world would he do this? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2018, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/4804 "2018-07-19T14:33:06Z")
Do you have any evidence that he did? Present that, and then we’ll talk. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=239) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=241)