# Trump associates may have coordinated with Russians, according to US officials **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 23, 2017, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799 "2017-03-23T00:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 41
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/803 "2017-07-11T22:15:00Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Hey hey hey!! Swamp Thing would make a fantastic President! ANIMAL MAN WOULDVE WON THOUGH (you know how people in the Rust Belt feel about vegetables) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/804 "2017-07-11T22:19:54Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > What do you all make of Trump Sr.'s [statement](http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/president-trump-on-donald-jrs-emails-i-applaud-his-transparency/article/2628305) regarding Trump Jr.? This statement is pretty much the same as you hear many times from the family of an accused thief/murderer: “My son is a good boy. He wouldn’t do no harm to nobody. He’s a good, good boy.” ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/805 "2017-07-11T22:24:17Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > First it’s “NEVER HAPPENED! FAKE NEWS!” > > Then it’s “HAPPENED BUT IT’S NO BIG DEAL! FAKE NEWS!” > > Then it’s “OKAY IT HAPPENED AND IT’S NOT GREAT BUT HILLARY DID/WOULD DO IT TOO! FAKE NEWS!” > > What’s the next iteration? “Its not illegal if the president does it.” ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/806 "2017-07-11T22:26:02Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Thank you for this OPINION piece. I knew it was an OPINION piece because that’s what it says at the beginning; “OPINION”. > > I did have a laugh at the part that said: “As the Times stories about Donald Trump Jr. emerged, Trump Jr. and those involved opted for transparency every step of the way” > > Seriously. It said that. With a straight face, I presume. I’m sure you have followed how Trump Jr.'s story has changed each day, as more details have come out. Transparency? Right. “Transparency” is the talking point of the hour, straight out of > Trump’s press room. > I then enjoyed the author’s OPINION on the nefarious deeds of the Clintons; Bill gave a speech once in Russia, for which he was paid. Hillary gave approval for a sale of 20% Uranium to Russia. [(A false claim, by the way. A lie.)](http://www.snopes.com/hillary-clinton-uranium-russia-deal/) > > I hope you are embarrassed by posting this link. Sarcasms not your ting innit? I mean i post something that is this close to an Onion piece and you think I was super-cereal? ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/807 "2017-07-11T22:28:59Z")
> [@skdo23](#): > > Or just close this thread and start a new one with the Twitler Jr. posts pasted in. As the OP, I cringe every time I click on the Elections forum and see the bohemeth this thread has become. Also, my wife is really pissed about all of the female attention I’m getting just b/c I’m the guy who started the thread with \>40k views. As someone who’s checked in on this thread periodically since the start, I think it provides a valuable public service for anyone interested in how political arguments shift over time as information comes out – and how motivated reasoning trumps factual evidence. Would that I could go back and see a similar thread starting in 1972 titles something like “Burglars arrested during break-in at Democratic national headquarters…” I look forward to seeing what posters will be saying on this in a week, or a month. So I vote to keep it rollin’! ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/808 "2017-07-11T22:31:32Z")
> [@snoe](#): > > I look forward to seeing what posters will be saying on this in a week, or a month. So I vote to keep it rollin’! “Hillary would have buried that snitch’s body under the same casino if she had been a successful real estate developer with links to the mob!” ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/809 "2017-07-11T22:36:14Z")
I still don’t think anything will come of this, but it certainly has sexier legs than that stupid-ass dossier. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/810 "2017-07-11T22:44:10Z")
Whatever floats your opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/811 "2017-07-11T22:47:44Z")
> [@Bayard](#): > > I swear I am not conspiracy theorist. Well, I mean not any more than is to be expected when there’s a massive government conspiracy unfolding. I mean, I’m not into metallic haberdashery. But does this line in the email from Goldstone sound odd to anyone else? > > > [@](#): > > > > Originally Posted by Rob Goldstone: > > This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump. > > And then later Goldstone makes sure to refer to the attorney as “a Russian government attorney,” in case we missed it. > It just sounds like a too-perfect interpolation or some kind of setup. First because it’s not a smoking gun, it’s a fucking smoking 21-gun salute. And second, because Goldstone goes from calling DJT Sr. “your father” to calling him “Mr. Trump”. This almost sounds like the infamous Dan Rather memo. But, then, the emails were confirmed by DJT Jr. himself, so… What The Fuck? … > [@Bayard](#): > > … I’m just flabbergasted by this development. The parts of the emails I quoted sound too perfect, like the emails were crafted to make sure the point was obvious that Trump Jr. knew he was supposed to be getting election help from Russia. The most likely scenario is that Trump and Goldstone really were that brazen, but it just kind of boggles my mind that you’d record your secret plan like that, and drop in lines that sound (to me, anyway), like “just remember, this is totally, totally wrong.” > > In that way, it recalls for me the purported National Guard memo that Dan Rather reported on in 2004 (IIRC). In that case, a forgery was probably passed to Rather and ended up discrediting him when he ran with it. But, that can’t really be what’s going on here, since if you’re trying to pull that trick, you release the forgery anonymously. > So, we’re either dealing with stupid and brazen conspirators who lay everything out in emails, or there’s some crazy con going on that I can’t imagine. … I’m surprised so few people are picking up on what you did. Yes, the email from Goldstone was clearly designed _with the U.S. Code in mind_: > [@](#): > > From Title 52-VOTING AND ELECTIONS > Subtitle III-Federal Campaign Finance > CHAPTER 301-FEDERAL ELECTION CAMPAIGNS > SUBCHAPTER I-DISCLOSURE OF FEDERAL CAMPAIGN FUNDS > § 30121. Contributions and donations by foreign nationals > (a) Prohibition. It shall be unlawful for— > (1) a foreign national, directly or indirectly, to make— > (A) a contribution or donation of money or other thing of value, or to make an express or implied promise to make a contribution or donation, in connection with a > Federal, State, or local election; > (B) a contribution or donation to a committee of a political party; or > (C) an expenditure, independent expenditure, or disbursement for an electioneering communication (within the meaning of section 30104(f)(3) of this title); or > (2) a person to solicit, accept, or receive a contribution or donation described in subparagraph (A) or (B) of paragraph (1) from a foreign national. [http://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title52-section30121&num=0&edition=prelim](http://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title52-section30121&num=0&edition=prelim) The emails: > [@](#): > > June 2016 > Rob Goldstone to Trump Jr > Emin just called and asked me to contact you with something very interesting. > The Crown prosecutor of Russia met with his father Aras this morning and in their meeting offered to provide the Trump campaign with some **official** documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father. > This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but **is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr Trump** – helped along by Aras and Emin. > What do you think is the best way to handle this information and would you be able to speak to Emin about it directly? > I can also send this info to your father via Rhona, but it is ultra sensitive so wanted to send to you first. > [@](#): > > 7 June 2016 > Goldstone to Trump Jr > Hope all is well. Emin asked that I schedule a meeting with you and **the Russian government attorney** who is flying over from Moscow for this Thursday. I believe you are aware of the meeting – and so wondered if 3pm or later on Thursday works for you? I assume it would be at your office. > **[Full text of the emails between Donald Trump Jr and Rob Goldstone](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/11/donald-trump-jr-emails-full-text-russia-rob-goldstone)** > > Donald Trump’s son was forced to release emails showing what he was told was Russia’s attempt to harm Hillary Clinton’s campaign – here’s what they said “Official documents” and “part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr Trump” and “the Russian government attorney” are designed to leave no doubt that Don Jr. knew he was being invited to receive information from not only a foreign national, but from _an official representative of an adversarial nation’s government_. (Whether the woman really was an official representative is immaterial. What matters is what Don. Jr. was told and that he agreed to the meeting.) “Would be very useful to your father” and “…support for Mr Trump” are designed to make clear that something of value—as per the U.S. Code subsection 30121–was being offered to Don Jr. and that if he took the meeting, he would be doing so in order to receive something of value to his father’s campaign. We know that at the time these emails were sent, the Kremlin had little reason to believe that Trump Sr. would win the Presidency. But in accordance with their standard operating procedure, they found it worthwhile to acquire Don Jr. as an asset. Inviting him to violate US federal election laws—as these emails explicitly did—had the potential to give them operating control over Don Jr., given that if he bit, they would then have the power to expose his unlawful conduct. If Trump had lost, as expected, Don Jr. could have gone on to assist the Kremlin in material ways in their ongoing project of undermining US and other western democracies. (So, yeah: what you picked up on–the odd artificiality in the construction of Goldstone’s emails–_is_ there.) ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/812 "2017-07-11T22:50:36Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Whatever floats your opinion. I was also of the opinion that it was impossible for Trump to win, the girl on Lazytown would be a big star and that “Titanic” would be a flop. I OWN my mistakes. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/813 "2017-07-11T22:50:40Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > I was super-cereal? Thank you for this. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/814 "2017-07-11T23:05:12Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Sarcasms not your ting innit? I mean i post something that is this close to an Onion piece and you think I was super-cereal? Oh, I see. “I was … joking. Ya, that’s the ticket! It was just pullin’ ya leg! That’s it!” ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/815 "2017-07-11T23:07:01Z")
Oh and as for Kaine, and these ancient white lawyers screaming ‘treason’ and costing the Dems more and more votes…this guy, [this soldier arrested for pledging loyalty to ISIS and offering to provide documents](https://pjmedia.com/homeland-security/2017/07/10/u-s-soldier-arrested-for-supporting-the-islamic-state/),i assure you will not be charged with treason. So sure as \*\*\*\* meeting with a Russian lawyer to possibly get incriminating info on HRC is NOT treason. edit: And yes, i know…PJ media…blah blah blah. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/816 "2017-07-11T23:08:16Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Oh, I see. > > “I was … joking. Ya, that’s the ticket! It was just pullin’ ya leg! That’s it!” The giveaway should have been ‘we’re not back to HRC would have, we’re at DID’…link to tin hat opinion piece. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/817 "2017-07-11T23:14:26Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > The giveaway should have been ‘we’re not back to HRC would have, we’re at DID’…link to tin hat opinion piece. TBH, there was no “give away” in your post. ---
**Author:** ![skdo23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@skdo23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/skdo23)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/818 "2017-07-11T23:16:36Z")
> [@snoe](#): > > As someone who’s checked in on this thread periodically since the start, I think it provides a valuable public service for anyone interested in how political arguments shift over time as information comes out – and how motivated reasoning trumps factual evidence. > > Would that I could go back and see a similar thread starting in 1972 titles something like “Burglars arrested during break-in at Democratic national headquarters…” > > I look forward to seeing what posters will be saying on this in a week, or a month. So I vote to keep it rollin’! Thanks. I just remember last summer when election related threads would quickly spiral into dozens of pages, which was a huge pain in the ass for the moderators. I’m just worried that I created a monster. And it actually occurred to me earlier today that my OP was the modern equivalent of mentioning that there was a break in at the Watergate.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/819 "2017-07-11T23:53:29Z")
I haven’t been paying much attention to this story lately, but everyone seems very excited about it again. Can I get someone’s CliffsNotes? Is the impeachment back on? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2017, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/820 "2017-07-11T23:55:06Z")
> [@skdo23](#): > > Thanks. I just remember last summer when election related threads would quickly spiral into dozens of pages, which was a huge pain in the ass for the moderators. I’m just worried that I created a monster. And it actually occurred to me earlier today that my OP was the modern equivalent of mentioning that there was a break in at the Watergate.🙂 The title says “Trump associates may have coordinated with Russians, according to US officials”. Do we have an answer for _what_ they coordinated together yet? ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2017, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/821 "2017-07-12T00:05:21Z")
**HurricaneDitka:** The latest from the _New York Times_, [“Russian Dirt on Clinton? ‘I Love It,’ Donald Trump Jr. Said”](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/11/us/politics/trump-russia-email-clinton.html) > [@Jo Becker](#): > > The June 3, 2016, email sent to Donald Trump Jr. could hardly have been more explicit: One of his father’s former Russian business partners had been contacted by a senior Russian government official and was offering to provide the Trump campaign with dirt on Hillary Clinton. > > The documents “would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father,” read the email, written by a trusted intermediary, who added, “This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump.” > > If the future president’s eldest son was surprised or disturbed by the provenance of the promised material — or the notion that it was part of a continuing effort by the Russian government to aid his father’s campaign — he gave no indication. > > He replied within minutes: “If it’s what you say I love it especially later in the summer.” > > Four days later, after a flurry of emails, the intermediary wrote back, proposing a meeting in New York on Thursday with a “Russian government attorney.” That meeting was attended by Donald Trump, Jr.; Paul Manafort (then head of Trump’s campaign); and Jared Kushner (who is now the White House’s Everything Czar). ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2017, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799/822 "2017-07-12T00:09:05Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > **HurricaneDitka:** > > The latest from the _New York Times_, [“Russian Dirt on Clinton? ‘I Love It,’ Donald Trump Jr. Said”](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/11/us/politics/trump-russia-email-clinton.html) > > That meeting was attended by Donald Trump, Jr.; Paul Manafort (then head of Trump’s campaign); and Jared Kushner (who is now the White House’s Everything Czar). Thanks! I don’t get the NYT. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=40) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-associates-may-have-coordinated-with-russians-according-to-us-officials/782799.md?page=42)