# Trump bloody after shots fired at a Trump Rally: Jul 13, 2024 **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [July 13, 2024, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162 "2024-07-13T22:13:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/402 "2024-07-14T12:47:13Z")
If it wasn’t summer, this guy probably would have ended up in a schoolyard rather than a political rally. Political motivation may have nothing to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/403 "2024-07-14T12:57:20Z")
Thank god it wasn’t an immigrant. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/404 "2024-07-14T13:04:37Z")
The uncertainty surrounding Biden may have pushed the shooter into taking action. There’s a perception that Trump has locked up a win for reelection. It’s dangerous when it appears that the election process is broken. The voters need to believe that our system isn’t broken. That the next President hasn’t been already choosen. I expect the Secret Service will severely limit Trump’s appearances until the election. Keeping him safe is a priority over his desire to hold public events. ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/405 "2024-07-14T13:10:05Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The shooter was aiming upwards towards the stage and lectern. > > The Secret Service was firing up at the shooter on a roof. > > How did someone standing below in the crowd get hit? What makes you think he was aiming _up_ at the stage when he was firing from a roof? Plus, Trump clearly was surrounded by devotees, including on bleachers behind him. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/406 "2024-07-14T13:14:07Z")
I haven’t seen a diagram showing the positions of the people involved. I hope that comes out today. I didn’t see anyone else on stage react like they were hit. But, perhaps that’s what happened. The bullet that nicked Trump went somewhere. It’s surprising the Secret Service snipers missed this guy until he fired. Several witnesses have said they told police he was crawling up there. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/407 "2024-07-14T13:18:48Z")
One of the local candidates seated near Trump said people behind him were struck. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/408 "2024-07-14T13:26:12Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > This video I saw a few days ago came to mind. One reason Trump is holding outdoor rallies in the summer heat may be that the campaign finds them cheaper and/or some cities/venue owners don’t want to get stuck with the bill from a rally and won’t host them. Also, an outdoor venue makes failure to fill it to capacity somewhat easier to obfuscate – no built-in seating sections left empty. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/409 "2024-07-14T13:31:25Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I haven’t seen a diagram showing the positions of the people involved. From the article posted by **hajario** : [![](https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/07/14.2n.ShooterMap-1-1.jpg?quality=75&strip=all) ](https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/07/14.2n.ShooterMap-1-1.jpg?quality=75&strip=all) ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/410 "2024-07-14T13:37:28Z")
That’s helpful thanks. He had a direct shot at Trump. 400 ft isn’t very difficult with a scope. Major screw up by the Secret Service. I expect the other casualties will be added later. Families need to be notified first. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/411 "2024-07-14T13:43:49Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > That’s helpful thanks. He had a direct shot at Trump. 400 ft isn’t very difficult with a scope. Major screw up by the Secret Service. > > The other casualties will be added later. - Until recently, militaries trained to hit from several hundred yards with iron sights. In trained hands, 400 ft. is handgun range. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/412 "2024-07-14T13:49:16Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Maybe the shooter thought that Trump was the Antichrist I do. Trump portrays himself as a Successful Business Man, the Former President, the _Real_ President, a Lady’s Man (Adulterer), a Liar, a Saviour, and a Victim. That’s seven ‘heads’, right? And he’ll undoubtedly claim he was mortally wounded but got better. See the Revelation 13:3-6. 😉 🤔 🤡 ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/413 "2024-07-14T13:49:19Z")
Handgun range? No. Not the effective range, anyway. Easily within rifle range using just iron sights? Yes. I qualified on an Army range with targets out to 300 meters back in 2010 (this was the standard at the time, and may still be today). Not that I could have hit a head-sized target with iron sights at that range, but then again maybe I could have at closer to 100-150 meters. Especially if I had multiple shots (the way the Army range works is you only get one shot per pop-up or else you run out of ammo). I suspect the evidence will show that this particular shooter didn’t zero in his sights and/or scope. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/414 "2024-07-14T13:52:53Z")
> [@snfaulkner](#): > > Btw, I’ve seen a few episodes from said channel. It’s not very political. That’s the same thing I was thinking. I used to subscribe to Demo Ranch just to watch them shoot stuff, but it got boring after a while (and his thumbnails, IIRC, were getting really click baity). If Matt(?) is a republican it wouldn’t surprise me, but politics weren’t part of the channel, at least not when I was watching it. If you just want to watch people shooting stuff with big guns, it’s not a bad channel to watch. Come to think of it, I did catch a recent-ish video of his where a gun blew up in someone’s hand. It wasn’t pretty. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/415 "2024-07-14T13:59:41Z")
> [@ASL\_v2.0](#): > > Handgun range? No. Not the effective range, anyway. > **[The Long Shot - Handguns](https://www.handgunsmag.com/editorial/tactics_training_shot_022305/138904#replay)** > > Pushing the limits of the service pistol Multiple hits out to 200 yards. Granted, the groups were large at 200 but the 100 yd groups were “minute of body”. The point is that the Secret Service allowed a shooter to get close enough to use a handgun let alone a rifle. Major screw-up. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/416 "2024-07-14T14:00:33Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > 400 ft. is handgun range. Umm… I think you have an extra zero in there. Not that I wouldn’t find cover. VERY lucky shots do happen (Its gonna hit something after all). If anyone cares to know, an AR-15 ‘type’ rifle is most likely a .223 . So basically a .22 in diameter. But longer and heavier, and blazingly fast compared to a standard .22 . ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/417 "2024-07-14T14:03:00Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > > [@aceplace57](#): > > > > I haven’t seen a diagram showing the positions of the people involved. > > From the article posted by **hajario** : This article has a better, less cluttered diagram and shows where the spectator benches were as well. Not just directly behind, but also slightly to either side, with one set of benches (to Trump’s left, having his back to the benches) appearing to be down range in the shooter’s line of fire towards Trump: > **[Thomas Matthew Crooks: What we know about Donald Trump shooting suspect](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3gw58wv4e9o)** > > The man who attempted to assassinate Donald Trump has been named by the FBI as Thomas Matthew Crooks. [![](https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/1536/cpsprodpb/3554/live/095feee0-41db-11ef-b74c-bb483a802c97.png.webp) ](https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/1536/cpsprodpb/3554/live/095feee0-41db-11ef-b74c-bb483a802c97.png.webp) ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/418 "2024-07-14T14:06:24Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > Here’s a long thread on Twitter by a former LEO with presidential protection experience who talks about where the breakdown might have happened. > > He describes the Secret Service as being responsible for near protection, that is right by the president, and very far protection, snipers on the roof looking for long distance threats. > > General protection within the range of the crowd and local grounds he describes as the responsibility of local law-enforcement. In his estimation that would include the very close building where the sniper was. > > I’m sure plenty of blame is about to be passed around, but an interesting perspective. > > [https://x.com/lttimmcmillan/status/1812383798740324380?s=61&t=7zPHcBzjb1UW-wh6DrDc3g](https://x.com/lttimmcmillan/status/1812383798740324380?s=61&t=7zPHcBzjb1UW-wh6DrDc3g) As I said above I’ve been involved in 3 presidential security details. I could say several to make it sound more important. The one for Bush in Iraq isn’t comparable. One in particular was in an open area. The SS visited every building in line of sight and warned everyone to not go on the roof to watch. A few people did and were immediately spotted by the SS and chased off. There were a lot of buildings to watch. A lot more than there were in Pennsylvania. Someone really screwed up and it all falls on the Secret Service. Local law enforcement is in charge of nothing and takes all orders from the Secret Service. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/419 "2024-07-14T14:06:51Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > There was undoubtedly a failure on the part of the Secret Service. I think it’ll be a while before we find out exactly what the root cause was, but understaffing isn’t totally implausible. Maybe they’d have covered that other building if they had more people. I keep thinking they must have had some drones up for aerial surveillance… how could they miss a guy laying on a rooftop? ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/420 "2024-07-14T14:10:32Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > I keep thinking they must have had some drones up for aerial surveillance… how could they miss a guy laying on a rooftop? White man toting a gun in Trump-loving rural Pennsylvania. What’s remarkable about that? ---
**Author:** ![TeroSunbear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terosunbear/32/14748_2.png) [@TeroSunbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TeroSunbear)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2024, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162/421 "2024-07-14T14:10:45Z")
Still no manifesto from the shooter. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-bloody-after-shots-fired-at-a-trump-rally-jul-13-2024/1004162.md?page=22)