Yes but this particular building was the one of a group of buildings that was adjacent to the field where the event was taking place, right?
I think most of the Internet is wondering why that particular building’s rooftop wasn’t covered by anyone physically there. And if we’re all wondering that, it’s weird to me that the shooter was confident that it wasn’t.
Not in a conspiracy way, mind you. In a dumb luck way.
In hindsight, there seem to be two things that could have happened differently:
The gunman could have worn something that would make him appear to be a member of law enforcement.
As someone else pointed out, the cop who first confronted the gunman (but had to retreat because of the rifle being pointed in his face) could have fired his pistol in the air several times. The sound of gunshots would have gotten Secret Service to scramble around the president and make people take cover.
Wow. It shows people yelling at an officer in the vicinity that there’s someone on the roof.
That’s correct. Probably the closest building to the stage (outside the perimeter). The perimeter meaning going through security/metal detectors, etc. For example, you can be at or inside an airport, but outside the perimeter (TSA security checkpoint), but there is a police presence well outside the perimeter.
No idea. Maybe it was covered and the kid found a few seconds when it wasn’t. I also think dumb luck played a part.
What the google maps does show**, is there are many buildings for a motivated shooter with a rifle to get on and I believe those are the “last tier” of coverage the snipers would be responsible for scanning for threats (not the close one the shooter was on). But how anyone leaves the closest one uncovered to allow this is malpractice. As was the response when it was known a guy with a gun was on the building. I’d imagine breakdown in communication - both actually communicating at all and clearly understood by all when you are - the latter one takes training I bet.
**You need to take elevation/topography into account which I haven’t seen.
Nice article with pictures of area.
Secret Service blames local police, says they were tasked with securing properties surrounding Trump’s Pa. rally
The Secret Service blamed local police for failing to secure the rooftop from which gunman Thomas Matthew Crooks attempted to assassinate former President Donald Trump, insisting it was outside the perimeter the federal agency was tasked with protecting.
Instead, securing and patrolling the factory grounds of AGR International Inc. — located about 130 yards from the stage where Trump was speaking Saturday — was the responsibility of local Pennsylvania police, Secret Service representative Anthony Gugliemi said
The Secret Service was only tasked with covering the grounds where Trump’s rally took place, with local police being recruited to assist with those efforts and secure the area outside the rally.
The officer backed down the ladder, and in those moments, Crooks took aim and fired about eight bullets at the rally. He struck Trump in the ear, fatally struck bystander Corey Comperatore in the audience, and gravely wounded two others in the crowd.
Within moments, Secret Service snipers stationed on a barn rooftop behind the stage fatally shot Crooks. Snipers appeared to have their sights trained in the direction of Crooks before they opened fire on him, though it is unclear whether they had seen him.
There only appear to be a handful of buildings with line of sight that are close enough for someone who is not a highly trained professional to be a threat. A colossal fuck up.
During the one presidential detail I was in that was applicable, despite being warned to not go on the roof several people still did. Local PD was sent to chase them away. I’m sure that’s true at every event. An appearance by the president or former president/current candidate is a spectacle. People want to see. If you shot every looky-loo who went where they weren’t supposed to be it would be a bloodbath. Even still the building was close enough that it should have been covered more securely. The buildings we dealt with were much further away. Maybe it was seen as being impractical for someone to get to the roof but the shooter found a way?
A 150 meter shot? An AR-15 is an ideal weapon for that. During army qualification that’s one of the gimmes. With iron sights it doesn’t get dicey until 200-300 meters but that has more to do with the eyeballs than the weapon. That’s assuming a basic level of skill and experience and a rifle that is adequately zeroed. My personal zero is close to factory zero so I’m confident of making any 150 meter shot minus adrenaline.
or at least fire a warning shot / shot into the air (had he no direct comm. line with SS)
… that should trigger a lot of 1000 times trained processes from SS - and they would have gotten trump off the stage in no time.
Memo to SS: “Tasking” local police with an important job does not excuse you from responsibility to verify that it’s being done properly.
Combine that with the Secret Service saying the local cops were supposed to secure the area the shooter used, and you get SS reluctant to shoot not just a random “civilian” looky-loo, as you say, but possibly a local cop or state trooper.
In most cases and possibly every state firing a warning shot is illegal. Not firing a warning shot is so hardwired into police that there is no way it will happen in the heat of the moment during a unique situation.
Looky loo’s aren’t using an AR-15 style camera.
I think you’re referring to a shot intended to warn a suspect. Here, the intent would have been to warn the Secret Service.
So what? Their instinctual training would still be not to do that
Here’s a bigger picture of the area. Trump, Sniper, Shooter are in the middle (all blue X in picture). It’s roughly 650 yards from edge of picture to center X. So, lots of realistic long-range (300+ yards) shot opportunities (again, depending on what topography allows). My point is, the snipers are covering a lot ground. The snipers behind Trump at some point know there is a potential threat in the specific direction the shooter is actually at before he shoots so something was communicated to them (they are looking through their scopes scanning/ready to shoot; not scanning with their binoculars looking for a potential threat) but they might be “looking” way past that building the shooter was on - even if just a hundred yards past or so. Or they just didn’t have an angle on the shooter (the roofs are angled, not flat). We don’t know any of this yet.
No, but that figure in camo holding a rifle on the roof over there could be a statie or sheriff’s deputy. Wouldn’t want to shoot him, maybe get on the radio to find out who he is and keep a bead on him in the meantime. Until he fires and resolves any ambiguity the hard way.
then call it a shot that didn’t hit the subject. ;o)
think of it as a different form of “police whistle” … (which I assume are no longer a thing) …
SS got complacent, cops screwed up. The whackos only have to get lucky once.
I suspect that there are a few people who could die and, while it wouldn’t be guaranteed to make the world better, it would be difficult for it not become so. (This isn’t to advocate any particular death, I’m just saying that I’m not sure that your statement is factually accurate.)
If you blow a whistle it won’t kill someone. You’re responsible for wherever the bullet lands. When you aren’t firing at something specific it’s more likely you will hit something not intended. That’s why it’s hardwired in to not take the Keanu Reeves Point Break shot even if you think it looks cool.
Moderating:
You’re far afield from the topic at hand, which is meant for discussion of facts that are being developed in the aftermath of the shooting.
Speculating on whose death would make the world a better place isn’t a good look, either. Stop with these posts.