# Trump calls for Biden to "Resign in Disgrace" **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 16, 2021, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754 "2021-08-16T00:21:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2021, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/64 "2021-08-16T23:17:33Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > This may get worse. Biden has ordered 4,000 soldiers back into the country to help secure the evacuation, but the Taliban control the entire country now. Biden has implored them to ‘go easy’ on the American troops and not interfere with the evacuation. We’ll see how well that works. You make it sound like Biden is helpless and begging the Taliban for mercy. What he actually said is that if the Taliban interfere, they will be met with decisive military force. ---
**Author:** ![divemaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/divemaster/32/78_2.png) [@divemaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/divemaster)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2021, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/65 "2021-08-16T23:17:53Z")
Biden inherited what he wanted to inherit. Recall that on the _very first day_ of Biden’s administration he laid waste to all sorts of Trump’s directives and regulations. Executive Orders nixed. New EOs established to negate Trump stuff. Newly-implemented regulations reversed. (The federal agency I work for is helping draft numerous new regulations implemented by Biden to explicitly reverse the Trump regulations we just spent two years putting into effect. So, no, Biden doesn’t get to say “geeze I was dealt a shitty hand and I can’t do anything about it.” If he WANTED to change course from Trump’s action, he certainly could have. He did on everything else. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2021, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/66 "2021-08-16T23:22:23Z")
> [@divemaster](#): > > Biden inherited what he wanted to inherit. Recall that on the _very first day_ of Biden’s administration he laid waste to all sorts of Trump’s directives and regulations. Executive Orders nixed. New EOs established to negate Trump stuff. Newly-implemented regulations reversed. (The federal agency I work for is helping draft numerous new regulations implemented by Biden to explicitly reverse the Trump regulations we just spent two years putting into effect. > > So, no, Biden doesn’t get to say “geeze I was dealt a shitty hand and I can’t do anything about it.” If he WANTED to change course from Trump’s action, he certainly could have. He did on everything else. And FWIW, Biden is not denying that. He lays appropriate blame on part of the situation on Trump, because some of the blame lies there. But in his statement today he goes on to say this: > [@](#): > > “I am president of the United States of America, and the buck stops with me,” he said. “I’m deeply saddened by the facts we now face, but I do not regret my decision to end America’s war-fighting in Afghanistan.” It would not be an accurate understanding of the situation to understand that the Trump administration drawing us down to 2,500 troops, including dismantling key bases and deployments that provided critical air support to Afghan military units, and signing an agreement that saw 5,000 imprisoned terrorists released into Afghanistan with no commitment from the Taliban to a cease fire or peace put things in a pretty bad state. Biden would be looking at a significant major new deployment to stabilize things in Afghanistan, he could not have just “stayed the course” from the Trump Admin. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2021, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/67 "2021-08-16T23:23:10Z")
To be fair, half the country is completely blindsided by the idea of a President taking responsibility for his actions. ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2021, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/68 "2021-08-16T23:52:12Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Biden was?? You mean trump. trump ordered and started the unilateral withdrawal. Biden inherited the mess. By what manner of wizardry did Trump control Biden’s actions, and prevent him from planning an orderly withdrawal? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/69 "2021-08-17T00:04:47Z")
This presumes an orderly withdrawal was possible. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/70 "2021-08-17T00:40:48Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > And overwhelmingly in the last election the country voted for a man who, as part of his platform, promised a withdrawal from Afghanistan. And coming in second, for a man who had already signed off on a withdrawal from Afghanistan. Based on some vague commitment to “don’t make trouble for us as we leave”. But, yeah, all the talking things up by the current team was very likely done already as Dead Man Walking, knowing better. The new Admin could have come in and said early on: _that alleged “deal” the other guy did with the Taliban? He prepared NOTHING to organize the withdrawal_ and the public could have allowed Joe to take the whole year to “do it right”… But for all we know, it might have been that at some point early in his term he learned that no matter when or how, the moment the sign was given it would all fall apart, fast. But, that _saying_ you knew that, would itself accelerate it. So instead, keep talking a good game until it becomes undeniable. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/71 "2021-08-17T02:01:30Z")
I don’t know, I think the reality is that the opposition is going to encourage terrorism from Afghanistan. If the opposition was willing to invite Russian influence to disrupt our political process, then I have no doubt they’d be willing to encourage collaborate with foreign governments to engage in terrorist warfare in an effort to discredit the Democratic party. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/72 "2021-08-17T07:52:32Z")
> **[Why the Afghan Army Fell to the Taliban - The Bulwark](https://www.thebulwark.com/why-the-afghan-army-fell-to-the-taliban/)** > > When the U.S. withdrawal was announced, logistical support evaporated. This is the best explanation I have read about why the Afghan army collapsed so quickly: > War is not just fighting on the battlefield. Logistics are vitally important. More to the point, Americans trained the Afghans to fight as we do, not like the Afghans used to, so they became reliant on our methods, tactics, and equipment, including air support and a complex system of military units that requires an exhaustive command and communications network. While we may have had good intentions and good reasons for making the Afghans reliant on these tools and techniques, we never taught the Afghans how to do them on their own. We did them for the Afghans ourselves. > > When, in April, President Biden abruptly announced our pending withdrawal, the American focus turned from logistical support to exit. On top of the 3,500 American members of the military, 17,000 more military contractors [stopped](https://www.usnews.com/news/world-report/articles/2021-07-21/number-of-private-military-contractors-in-afghanistan-drops-precipitously-as-biden-pushes-withdrawal-plan) assisting the Afghans more or less overnight. The Afghan military lost the equivalent of two logistics divisions, without the time to adjust to the new reality, learn how to supply itself with logistical support—something we never taught them—and teach itself how to operate complicated American machines and equipment, which takes months, if not longer, to learn. The American personnel [didn’t even provide the courtesy](https://www.csis.org/analysis/special-inspector-general-afghanistan-reconstruction-sigar-high-risk-list) of fixing the equipment they were leaving behind, much of it down due to maintenance issues. At that point, fighting was not courageous. It was reckless. > > In the backrooms, Afghan military commanders immediately began to mitigate the situation to keep their heads—literally speaking. Out of fear for their lives and the lives of their loved ones, they started studying their options. Some chose to keep on fighting, a decision that might soon cost their lives; some planned their escapes; others pledged loyalty to the Taliban, either genuinely or out of fear. Needless to say, it reflects poorly on the Biden administration that they didn’t understand these problems. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/73 "2021-08-17T08:11:06Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > There needs to be some expression that goes way, way, way beyond “pot calling the kettle black” to describe Trump criticizing Biden. I don’t know what such an expression would be. If you use an expression, you are already losing. You are losing from the moment you express anything that implies there is any meaning or value in what the orange one vomits. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/74 "2021-08-17T08:17:16Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > Biden can be faulted for the chaotic nature of the evacuation. He can’t be faulted for the Taliban take-over – if the Afghan armed forces weren’t willing to fight for their country after 20 years and $2T in training, then the outcome was inevitable, sooner or later. It just came sooner. > > Republican politicians will yell for a long time, but it won’t stick. The American public does not give 2 shits about Afghanistan. They aren’t “not willing to fight.” They are not remotely trained in the type of fighting they would need to do. They were trained to fight the way the US military does, with their overwhelming manpower, equipment, and firepower. It’s not like the US was training them to fight on their own. Not only would they lose these fights, but their families are in danger, with no one there to protect them. It’s actually quite likely that their lives will be better under the Taliban. Again, the blame for this is not on Biden’s shoulders entirely. He didn’t not know what was going on. He tried something but it didn’t work out. His goal was to bring in Iran. And, I’m sorry, but not leaving was never an option. Trump negotiated with the Taliban. If they didn’t pull out, the Taliban attacks with the US there and we take casualties, and then we have to stay in for a lot longer. I continue to promote Beau of the Fifth Columnon this… He’s been covering this issue basically since Trump made the deal, and has covered what Biden was doing since before he took office. If your information is only from recent days, you’re missing a lot. Here’s Beau’s latest video: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/XVotMlYOGHA/maxresdefault.jpg "Let's talk about who's to blame for all this....") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVotMlYOGHA) ---
**Author:** ![shh1313](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shh1313/32/8020_2.png) [@shh1313](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shh1313)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/75 "2021-08-17T10:22:30Z")
There’s a rat in the wood pile. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/76 "2021-08-17T11:09:25Z")
Talking to my MAGA brother, I took the tact of praising Trump for realizing we needed to get out, praised Biden for seeing Trump’s wisdom and sticking to Trump’s plan, remonstrated that 'no, withdrawals like this are always messy, ala Vietnam in ‘75’, ending up with him agreeing that, all things considered, Biden acted for the best. ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/77 "2021-08-17T11:10:31Z")
this shouldn’t have been a surprise to anyone who knows about Afghanistan as its a pattern that goes back possibly centuries if anyone remembers since the 18th/19th century what passes for the Afghan military at any point is known for siding with whoever has the most guns/weapons at the time which is their idea of winning it seems I remember when we invaded news reports were saying one reason we succeeded initially was 60 percent of the Taliban opposition forces either surrendered defected or just disappeared and went home in like 2 weeks supposedly the same happened when the Soviets came and left and when the Taliban took over most of the official army defected/disappeared in the same pattern ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/78 "2021-08-17T11:12:58Z")
Well, there was that tweet that said: 'In 1918, the world’s most feared imperial power flees Afghanistan in a move which heralds its coming irrelevance. In 1989, the world’s most feared imperial power flees Afghanistan in a move which heralds its coming irrelevance. In 2021, the world’s most fea…’ Pretty good for 280 characters. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/79 "2021-08-17T11:47:53Z")
> [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > While I am not thrilled about the happenings in Afghanistan, I’d like to hear what actions should have been taken after the agreements Trump had made (on behalf of the US) with the Afghan and Taliban officials. I am not totally aware of the situation in Afghanistan, but it seems to me as if the Afghanistan problem has existed for decades, an I don’t see that Biden has any other course of action. Clearly the Afghan war was never going to end well, but it didn’t have to end this chaotically. What Biden (using “Biden” as a metonym here) should have done is implement a better-phased withdrawal that would have protected the interest of US citizens and allies at at risk. We can (and should) blame Bush for getting Afghanistan wrong out of the gate, and Obama for continuing that mistake, and Trump for naïvely giving away the store in some shallow attempt at being a peacemaker. (I’m _highly_ suspicious at what bribes Trump may have attempted and I really want to see this investigated). But Biden fucked up the exit. There’s no other way to say it. Specifically, abandoning Bagram before getting everyone evacuated. To me, it really speaks poorly of Dems that they refuse to own any part of this. A leader with any integrity would say “this may or may not be my fault, but it happened on my watch, and I’m responsible.” At a bare-ass _minimum_ he should fire the entire CENTCOM chain of command. Biden should resign as soon as he signs all the major legislation in the pipeline. We all know he was just a runway for President Kamala anyway. Why not let him eat all the recent failures, and maybe we get 11½ solid years out of her. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/80 "2021-08-17T11:52:06Z")
> [@nightshadea](#): > > if anyone remembers since the 18th/19th century what passes for the Afghan military at any point is known for siding with whoever has the most guns/weapons at the time which is their idea of winning it seems From Catch-22: > Nately: “You talk like a madman.” > Old Man: “But I live like a sane one. I was a Fascist when Mussolini was on top. Now that he has been deposed, I am anti-Fascist. When the Germans were here, I was fanatically pro-German. Now I’m fanatically pro-America! You’ll find no more loyal partisan in all of Italy than myself.” > Nately: "You’re a shameful opportunist! What you don’t understand is that it’s better to die on your feet than to live on your knees.” > Old Man: “You have it backwards! It is better to live on your feet than to die on your knees. I know.” > Nately: “How do you know?” > Old Man: “Because I am 107 years old. How old are you?” > Nately: “I’ll be 23 in January.” > Old Man: “If you live that long.” ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/81 "2021-08-17T12:14:12Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > {…} A leader with any integrity would say “this may or may not be my fault, but it happened on my watch, and I’m responsible.” {…} Yea, if only Biden would say something like that, “I am President of the United States of America, and the buck stops with me.” > **[Remarks by President Biden on Afghanistan | The White House](https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2021/08/16/remarks-by-president-biden-on-afghanistan/)** > > East Room 4:02 P.M. EDT   THE PRESIDENT:  Good afternoon.  I want to speak today to the unfolding situation in Afghanistan: the developments that have taken place in the last week and the steps we’re taking to address the rapidly... ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/82 "2021-08-17T12:15:51Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > A leader with any integrity would say “this may or may not be my fault, but it happened on my watch, and I’m responsible.” From Biden’s speech yesterday: > [@](#): > > I’m now the fourth American president to preside over war in Afghanistan. Two Democrats and two Republicans. I will not pass this responsibility on to a fifth president. I will not mislead the American people by claiming that just a little more time in Afghanistan will make all the difference. Nor will I shrink from my share of responsibility for where we are today and how we must move forward from here. I am president of the United States of America, and the buck stops with me. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2021, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754/83 "2021-08-17T12:22:47Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > “I am President of the United States of America, and the buck stops with me.” In your view, does “the buck stops with me” serve any purpose except as a word-saying ceremony? If Trump fucked up this badly, would you let him get away with that statement, or would you demand his resignation over it? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-calls-for-biden-to-resign-in-disgrace/948754.md?page=5)