# Trump & Cuba **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 16, 2017, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150 "2017-06-16T23:55:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/201 "2017-06-21T15:45:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > That would be fine. There just has to be a recognition. Frankly, even an apology would suffice. Hmmm. And you saw in the quote from my earlier linked article that Canada and Spain got something like a ten cents on the dollar deal about 30 years ago for their outstanding claims? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/202 "2017-06-21T15:49:01Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > But you said earlier that you’d be okay with my strategy if you believed that it would actually significantly help the Cuban people (and the American people in a smaller way, presumably), at least if I understood you correctly, even if it meant the Castros or their ilk were still in charge (at least for a few decades). In that post, the Castros didn’t seem to be important to your analysis. > > How sure are you that your personal feelings aren’t throwing your analysis out of whack? Your scenario went decades into the future, where any Castro that had a hand in the heft would be long dead. I don’t deny I have strong personal feelings here. I am not sure that those feelings are not an influence. But how else can I respond? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/203 "2017-06-21T15:50:13Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Hmmm. And you saw in the quote from my earlier linked article that Canada and Spain got something like a ten cents on the dollar deal about 30 years ago for their outstanding claims? I don’t recall an admission of wrongdoing as part of that deal. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/204 "2017-06-21T15:52:05Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I don’t recall an admission of wrongdoing as part of that deal. That’s what the money is for. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/205 "2017-06-21T16:18:38Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > That’s what the money is for. 😉 “We owe you money for that totally legitimate sale of property,” is just as plausible as “We owe you money for stealing your property.” ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/206 "2017-06-21T17:14:39Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Your scenario went decades into the future, where any Castro that had a hand in the heft would be long dead. > > I don’t deny I have strong personal feelings here. I am not sure that those feelings are not an influence. But how else can I respond? Pretend the Castros have been dead for 20 years, but everything else is the same – someone else is in power but has behaved the exact same way. That seems to me to be a good way to take personal feelings about individuals out of the picture – what would your position be in that scenario? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/207 "2017-06-21T18:21:02Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Pretend the Castros have been dead for 20 years, but everything else is the same – someone else is in power but has behaved the exact same way. That seems to me to be a good way to take personal feelings about individuals out of the picture – what would your position be in that scenario? I have to admit I’d be comfortable with rapprochement in that situation. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/208 "2017-06-21T18:23:01Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I have to admit I’d be comfortable with rapprochement in that situation. Then I think you should reconsider your position – personal feelings about one man shouldn’t come into play when we’re considering policy that will affect the lives of millions of people. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/209 "2017-06-21T18:25:36Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I don’t recall an admission of wrongdoing as part of that deal. And you don’t think demanding an apology in an international dispute isn’t completely frigging ridiculous? I mean, taking Cuba back from foreign ownership was kind of a big point of the revolution. Would you ever expect America to apologize for dumping British tea into the harbour? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2017, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/210 "2017-06-21T23:56:01Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Cites for these claims? I already told you that. ETA: no harm in saying it again. CBS news radio. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2017, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/211 "2017-06-22T15:58:23Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Then I think you should reconsider your position – personal feelings about one man shouldn’t come into play when we’re considering policy that will affect the lives of millions of people. So **Bricker** , have you reconsidered at all, or do you plan to, based on your realization that your opposition to rapproachment is entirely based on your feelings about one man? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2017, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/212 "2017-06-23T13:58:06Z")
Still thinking about it **Bricker**? Hopefully you’re deep in contemplation about my wise words… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2017, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/213 "2017-06-23T14:30:17Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Still thinking about it **Bricker**? Hopefully you’re deep in contemplation about my wise words… 😉 We all are, hence the lack of posts. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2017, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/214 "2017-06-29T17:35:38Z")
**Bricker** , had a chance to think about it yet? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2017, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/215 "2017-06-29T17:38:16Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > So **Bricker** , have you reconsidered at all, or do you plan to, based on your realization that your opposition to rapproachment is entirely based on your feelings about one man? Calcification of old habits of thought does not break easily. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2017, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/216 "2017-06-29T18:00:54Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Calcification of old habits of thought does not break easily. Fair enough. I appreciate your candor on this, and I hope you continue to think about it. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2017, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/217 "2017-07-25T17:07:50Z")
**Bricker** , have you thought about this any more in the last month? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2017, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/218 "2017-09-13T18:23:43Z")
Hey **Bricker** , any progress on the de-calcification? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2017, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/219 "2017-09-29T15:06:33Z")
[The Trump administration announced a slight change in policy today](https://apnews.com/3602399b00044443883aa2bdef0f1a84/AP-sources:-US-cuts-embassy-staff,-urges-no-travel-to-Cuba): > [@](#): > > The United States is warning Americans against visiting Cuba and ordering more than half of U.S. personnel to leave the island, senior officials said Friday, in a dramatic response to what they described as “specific attacks” on diplomats. > > The decision deals a blow to already delicate ties between the U.S. and Cuba, longtime enemies who only recently began putting their hostility behind them. The embassy in Havana will lose roughly 60 percent of its U.S. staff, and will stop processing visas in Cuba indefinitely, the American officials said. > > In a new travel warning to be issued Friday, the U.S. will say some of the attacks have occurred in Cuban hotels, and that while American tourists aren’t known to have been hurt, they could be exposed if they travel to Cuba. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2017, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150/220 "2017-10-03T22:21:21Z")
Hey! Ho! You go! [US orders 15 Cuban diplomats to leave](https://apnews.com/d460b2fa001a4063a18a415e3e0e6697/Ties-threatened:-US-orders-15-Cuban-diplomats-to-leave) > [@](#): > > The United States expelled 15 of Cuba’s diplomats Tuesday to protest its failure to protect Americans from unexplained attacks in Havana, plunging diplomatic ties between the countries to levels unseen in years. > > Only days ago, the U.S. and Cuba maintained dozens of diplomats in newly re-opened embassies in Havana and Washington, powerful symbols of a warming relationship between longtime foes. Now both countries are poised to cut their embassies by more than half, as invisible, unexplained attacks threaten delicate relations between the Cold War rivals. > > The State Department gave Cuba’s ambassador a list Tuesday of 15 names and ordered them out within one week, officials said, in a move that aims to “ensure equity” between each nation’s embassy staffing. Last week, the U.S. announced it was withdrawing 60 percent of its own diplomats from Havana because they might be attacked and harmed if they stay. > > The dual moves marked a sharp escalation in the U.S. response to attacks that began nearly a year ago and yet remain unexplained despite harming at least 22 Americans — including a new victim identified this week. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-cuba/789150.md?page=10)