# Trump invites his Russian handler to the White House. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 3, 2018, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729 "2018-04-03T16:22:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/1 "2018-04-03T16:22:38Z")
That Vlad must have been one helluva field agent. The US has ostensibly joined its allies in condemning the Russian poisoning in the U.K. But, Trump not only congratulated Putin on his “election”, he invited Putin to the White House. Pretty much tells the West that the US is allying itself with Russia. Putin and his cohort must be amazed at how easy it’s been to turn the “leader of the free world” into a Russian asset. The KGB trained Vlad well. > **[ANALYSIS | Trump inviting Putin to White House is 'naive at best,' and his...](https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/collusion-donald-trump-us-russia-fbi-mueller-investigation-1.4602489)** > > In a proposition certain to raise the darkest of suspicions, Donald Trump last month invited the Russian leader to the White House during a phone call that experts say risks opening diplomatic doors to the Kremlin at precisely the wrong time. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/2 "2018-04-03T16:31:24Z")
Are they going to do the party trick where Donald talks while Vladimir drinks a glass of vodka? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/3 "2018-04-03T16:48:47Z")
An article on the decline in popular support for the US among its former allies, which in turn means a decline US “soft power” internationally: > **[Trump's First Year: Everyone Hates Us Now](https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a15367684/trump-world-leadership-gallup-poll/)** > > A damning new Gallup poll shows how the perception of the United States has changed under Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/4 "2018-04-03T19:33:28Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > But, Trump not only congratulated Putin on his “election”, he invited Putin to the White House. > > Pretty much tells the West that the US is allying itself with Russia. > > Putin and his cohort must be amazed at how easy it’s been to turn the “leader of the free world” into a Russian asset. Although it is kind of fun in a horrifying way to see Trump as just a stooge of Putin, this is giving far too much credit to both of them. Trump just [likes strongman dictators](https://www.npr.org/2017/05/02/526520042/6-strongmen-trumps-praised-and-the-conflicts-it-presents) and wishes himself to be included in that category, hence his utter unwillingness to admit that he failed to win the popular vote even as virtually everyone conceded that he was the legal winner of the Electoral College. Donald Trump isn’t restrained or smart enough to be trusted with an actual conspiracy, and while his campaign members, including sons and son-in-law almost certainly had contacts with Russian figures with connections to the GRU or FSB, and Trump himself may be beholden to figures within Russian organized crime who loaned him money, the notion that he is getting direct orders from Putin is unlikely if for no other reason that he’d probably accidentially or in a fit of senility retweet them to the general public. Putin, for his part, isn’t any kind of elite spymaster genius. He is a demagogic troll who has rolled into power by giving away large pieces of Russian infrastructure and resources to kleptocrats, annexed other nations territory by threat of force under manufactured pretenses, used his security contacts to harry, muck, or kill critics and opponents, and appealed to the largely indifferent Russian public by the time-honored tradition of standing up a strawman villian and claiming to be the only leader strong enough to protect his people, a tactic used by every powerful Russian and Soviet leader since Ivan I of Moscow. He thought it would be clever to fuck with the democratic elections of Europe and the United States, and in particular feed fake news and hacked emails to make life rough for the Hillary Clinton presidency, and I suspect he was just as surprised ([if not just a little amused](https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/russia-is-laughing-at-trump-and-all-of-us)) that Donald Trump won instead. This does now put him in the slightly awkward position that he no longer has a credible opponent in the United States [despite continued provocations](https://www.justsecurity.org/42399/timeline-russian-provocations-dangerous-acts-january-20-2017/) but he can still fluster about Germany and Poland—besides the US, the two traditional threats to _Rodinu_—without any concerns that NATO will have enough of a consensus to act out against further incursions in the Ukraine or Georgia, and potentially won’t have sufficient initiative to act against threats to the NATO Baltic states, which (while unlikely) if successful would undermine all of NATO. Russia is a nation on decline by every quantifiable measure, and Putin is willing to take a few gambles especially if the consequence is just international condemnation or sanctions that he can characterize internally as an attack on the Russian people by foes abroad. Trump should not be inviting Putin to the White House for a State Dinner for any number of reasons including the alienation of our close strategic allies, but it doesn’t really make the case that he is literally Putin’s puppet, or that Putin has the power to dictate US policy. Melania, however, is a different story… Stranger ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/5 "2018-04-03T20:16:58Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Melania, however, is a different story… Sorry… watnow? Are you suggesting Melania is some sort of Svengali, or is this the sound of Poe’s Law whooshing overhead? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/6 "2018-04-03T20:44:03Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Are you suggesting Melania is some sort of Svengali, or is this the sound of Poe’s Law whooshing overhead? Haven’t you read the first novel in John le Carré’s new _Karla Reborn Trilogy_? It’s titled _Rich Man, Poor Man, Beggarman, Stooge_. If not, I don’t want to spoil it for you, but Robert Mueller is asked to look into irregularities… Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/7 "2018-04-04T04:33:06Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > That Vlad must have been one helluva field agent. > > The US has ostensibly joined its allies in condemning the Russian poisoning in the U.K. > > But, Trump not only congratulated Putin on his “election”, he invited Putin to the White House. > > Pretty much tells the West that the US is allying itself with Russia. > > Putin and his cohort must be amazed at how easy it’s been to turn the “leader of the free world” into a Russian asset. > > The KGB trained Vlad well. > > [White House, Red Menace? Trump inviting Putin to D.C. is 'naive at best.' His timing is probably worse | CBC News](http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/collusion-donald-trump-us-russia-fbi-mueller-investigation-1.4602489) Is there a debate here? If so, can you frame it? Otherwise I’d be glad to move it. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/8 "2018-04-04T12:36:28Z")
Why not? Putin owns the place. Might as well call it Kremlin West. “Donald! We make carved bust of you. Here, put on desk. Make sure mouth always face you- put right here by phone. And speak clearly for daddy, please?” ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/9 "2018-04-04T13:29:34Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Is there a debate here? If so, can you frame it? Otherwise I’d be glad to move it. > > [/moderating] **Bone** , do you think its a wise move to invite Putin to a White House summit at this time, especially in light of what we know about the, shall we say, somewhat less than 100% democratic election he just ‘won’? How do you think our allies will view this? Do you think this will have any effect on U.S. international relations and our standing in that area? Is this in America’s best interest? There’s plenty to debate about this. Let’s not be hasty. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/10 "2018-04-04T17:31:26Z")
My first response was based on thinking this was in the Pit. More seriously: 1- No, this is not the time to invite Putin for a state visit. The annexation of Crimea, the interference in the US election (Brexit, too), and the assassination attempt in the UK are not behaviors we want to dignify by extending an invitation to the White House, even if it is in tippy-top shape. 2- Our allies will likely be justifiably alarmed and concerned. This will be seen as too warm an overture to such a cold regime. 3- This is most definitely not in our national interest. When Putin wants to have a summit, a precondition should be changing his behavior. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/11 "2018-04-04T18:14:14Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Haven’t you read the first novel in John le Carré’s new _Karla Reborn Trilogy_? It’s titled _Rich Man, Poor Man, Beggarman, Stooge_. If not, I don’t want to spoil it for you, but Robert Mueller is asked to look into irregularities… > > Stranger I’m looking forward to the next one in the series, _Tweeter, Traitor, POTUS, Spy_. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/12 "2018-04-04T18:44:32Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I’m looking forward to the next one in the series, _Tweeter, Traitor, POTUS, Spy_. Nope, it is _The Dishonorable Neonate_. The last installment has yet to be announce but my money is on _Manafort’s Quislings_. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/13 "2018-04-04T20:34:51Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > **Bone** , do you think its a wise move to invite Putin to a White House summit at this time, especially in light of what we know about the, shall we say, somewhat less than 100% democratic election he just ‘won’? How do you think our allies will view this? Do you think this will have any effect on U.S. international relations and our standing in that area? Is this in America’s best interest? Is there any possibility that Trump is an [unwitting pawn](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/UnwittingPawn) in a [Batman Gambit](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BatmanGambit) to remove Putin permanently? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/14 "2018-04-04T21:51:19Z")
Maybe I’ve seen too many spy thrillers but I’m envisioning a scenario in which Trump’s mob comrades from the past 30 or so years feel that Putin’s ongoing actions against the technological infrastructure here pose a serious threat to the way of life that they’ve grown accustomed to. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/15 "2018-04-04T22:09:40Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > used his security contacts to harry, muck, or kill critics and opponents, I don’t recognize this usage of “muck.” ---
**Author:** ![HelenGawn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@HelenGawn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelenGawn)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2018, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/16 "2018-04-04T23:15:43Z")
Trump is turning into [Martha Hanson.](http://theamericans.wikia.com/wiki/Martha_Hanson) ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2018, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/17 "2018-04-05T00:02:39Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > **Bone** , do you think its a wise move to invite Putin to a White House summit at this time, especially in light of what we know about the, shall we say, somewhat less than 100% democratic election he just ‘won’? How do you think our allies will view this? Do you think this will have any effect on U.S. international relations and our standing in that area? Is this in America’s best interest? > > There’s plenty to debate about this. Let’s not be hasty. It looks like the OP is being asked by a mod to actually frame whatever it is that the OP wishes to debate. **Bone** is offering to move the thread to a more appropriate forum. Move it, not close it. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2018, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/18 "2018-04-05T00:54:22Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > That Vlad must have been one helluva field agent. Pfft. Turning Trump is Fieldcraft 101. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2018, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-invites-his-russian-handler-to-the-white-house/811729/19 "2018-04-05T01:15:25Z")
> [@HelenGawn](#): > > Trump is turning into [Martha Hanson.](http://theamericans.wikia.com/wiki/Martha_Hanson) Martha wasn’t nearly as credulous at Donald Trump. Stranger