# Trump is wasting taxpayer money sending superfluous letters to take credit for the stimulus payments **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 2, 2020, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012 "2020-05-02T03:55:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/61 "2021-04-30T04:14:13Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > We look silly trying to defend what we just spent 40 posts decrying. This ^^^. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/62 "2021-04-30T05:19:01Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > I’m not sure why it’s always an all-or-nothing. In this case it is both sides. Let’s just admit it and move on. We look silly trying to defend what we just spent 40 posts decrying. As you rightly point out it’s nowhere near as important as a lot of other policies. > > Overall there’s little comparison between Biden and Trump but sometimes there are. Because, as I’ve said before, “both sides” is nearly always an argument being put forth in bad faith. It is equivocation between the two sides in an attempt to defend the worse. And this attempt by @D_Anconia is no exception. To agree with his framing is to help further his goal of trying to rehabilitate Trump and Republicans, which is a poor choice. It’s not as if his framing is the only possible one. People have already pointed out that the letter is so similar to the old one that it looks like Biden wasn’t involved with its making. They’ve pointed out that Biden didn’t make a big political deal out of making sure that people were told that he gave them the checks. Trump did—his ego required his name on everything to get people to praise him. They even held up the checks themselves to get his name put on them. Biden did none of this, and that makes a difference. Framing matters. It’s actually bewildering to me that you would want to frame Trump and Biden as being comparable, as the only thing that framing accomplishes is to attack Biden. It’s a lesser version of pointing out that someone did something that Hitler did—and that’s clearly an attack on them. Trump is a fascist, nationalist, autocratic narcissist. His goals and intentions are at complete odds with anything Biden is doing. Pointing out superficial similarities is not legitimate framing. It’s bewildering to me to see people agree with such framing when they are opposed to the clear goal of that framing. It is foolhardy to always talk facts and not care how they are presented—to not care about their framing. Framing is what wins. Trump didn’t win over so many people or even alienate so many people because of his arguments. He won with his framing. Heck, his framing was so good that he could flat out lie and didn’t matter to his supporters. Framing matters. It is not a good idea to agree to your opponent’s framing when that framing attacks you and makes them superficially look better. It’s not a good idea to agree with any argument that tries to say Biden and Trump are the same. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/63 "2021-04-30T12:49:26Z")
Lol. Trump: leads Insurrection, is responsible for 400,000 deaths and 10,000,000 lost jobs Biden: Copies the incorrect template, sends it out. MAGA: SEE? BOTH SIDEZ! ---
**Author:** ![SingleMalt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/singlemalt/32/3961_2.png) [@SingleMalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SingleMalt)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/64 "2021-04-30T14:01:11Z")
President T delays a much-needed stimulus payment so that he can get his name on the check, and have a self-congratulatory letter prepared, because President T cares more about getting credit than giving aid. President B refuses to delay the much-needed stimulus payment rather than be sure that his predecessor’s self-aggrandizement has been removed, because President B cares more about giving aid than getting credit. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/65 "2021-04-30T14:10:56Z")
Goofus delays sending much needed $ so that Grandma will know Goofus is sending her $ Gallant just throws the damn check in the mail using one of Goofus’s old envelopes, goes about his day ---
**Author:** ![SingleMalt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/singlemalt/32/3961_2.png) [@SingleMalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SingleMalt)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/66 "2021-04-30T15:38:14Z")
I see you’ve Highlighted the situation. This is why I love the Straight Dope. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/67 "2021-04-30T16:24:41Z")
I don’t disagree that the stakes are high, I just disagree that ignoring our own faults is a good way to address it. To me a lot of politics is trust. I wouldn’t trust Trump to take out the garbage. I trust Biden in part because he’s willing to admit mistakes. When someone comes in to gloat that the Biden administration did something Trump-like to me the best response is: “Yup, bad look for Biden. His administration dropped the ball. It’s a small thing but hopefully they learn from it.” Trump never learned anything, except how to grift. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/68 "2021-04-30T16:47:54Z")
> [@SingleMalt](#): > > I see you’ve Highlighted the situation. and yes we saw what you did there. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2021, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/69 "2021-04-30T17:13:02Z")
It’s absolutely relevant. Just because the man at the top is accountable for the things that are done in his organization, it doesn’t mean he’s _responsible_ for them. In other words, if some jackass policeman beats someone up, the Chief of Police is certainly accountable, but he’s not necessarily responsible. That means that he may have done everything _RIGHT_ in terms of training, culture change, and so forth, and this cop killed someone in spite of it. But he’s accountable in the sense that he has to ensure that the offending cop is arrested and tried, any necessary changes are made in his department to try to prevent it in the future, and even possibly being asked to resign if it’s egregious enough. That’s being accountable. Biden is almost certainly not responsible for the decision to reuse a Trump-era check. That kind of thing is extremely unlikely to actually be something they bother any President with. But he’s definitely accountable for whatever fallout it causes. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/70 "2021-05-01T04:16:43Z")
President Biden signed the American Rescue Plan into law. He didn’t have to, but he did. He owns it. It’s silly to say that Biden did it for the “right” reasons, whilst Trump did the same exact thing for nefarious reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/71 "2021-05-01T05:37:01Z")
It was bullshit when Trump did it. It’s bullshit when Biden does it. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/72 "2021-05-01T06:58:58Z")
Biden wanted to hold up checks so that he could scribble his name on all of them? That is horrible! ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/73 "2021-05-01T07:06:32Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Biden wanted to hold up checks so that he could scribble his name on all of them? Not that I’m aware of, but what Biden did is still bullshit. Noah Bookbinder of Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington sums it up pretty well. > At the time, Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington, a center-left watchdog group, criticized Trump’s letter as “self-aggrandizing … at taxpayer expense.” > > Noah Bookbinder, the president of CREW, told Insider there were “aggravating factors” in Trump’s letter, such as his putting his own signature on the stimulus checks, a decision that may have [delayed their mailing](https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-putting-name-on-stimulus-checks-wapo-2020-4). Nevertheless, “this trend toward presidents sending self-serving signed letters at taxpayer expense is unfortunate regardless of who does it,” he said, adding: “I hope that President Biden will not learn the wrong lessons from his predecessor and continue this kind of tactic.” > **[Biden sends out IRS letter heralding stimulus checks, prompting critics to...](https://www.businessinsider.com/biden-sends-out-irs-letter-trumpeting-1400-dollar-stimulus-checks-2021-4)** > > Biden is sending letters to millions of Americans heralding his American Rescue Plan, which includes $1,400 checks and child tax credits. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/74 "2021-05-01T07:08:11Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > Not that I’m aware of, but what Biden did is still bullshit. Both levels of bullshit are equal to you? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/75 "2021-05-01T07:08:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Both levels of bullshit are equal to you? Nope. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/76 "2021-05-01T07:15:56Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > Nope. Do you see why people are trying to point out the level of bullshit actually matters when comparing what was done in the past to what is presently being done? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/77 "2021-05-01T07:21:21Z")
I do see that. The part of the article I quoted, that I said summed things up pretty well, pointed out reasons why what Trump did was worse. I do, in fact, agree with the thing I said I agreed with. This is a weird fight for you to pick. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/78 "2021-05-01T08:23:36Z")
The difference is that Trumps sending the letter was a sin of commission while Biden’s was a sin of omission. Trump willfully left a giant turd on the sidewalk, while Biden has been slow cleaning it up. Then D’Aconia comes in and claims that since the turd is still there it must be Biden’s. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2021, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/79 "2021-05-01T14:08:30Z")
Conservatives said there was nothing wrong with Trump’s letter and people were making noise over nothing. Now they’re upset that no one is making noise over what they said was nothing. These jackasses aren’t happy even when they get what they want; suddenly they want the opposite. Fuck ‘em. ---
**Author:** ![icon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c6cbf5/32.png) [@icon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/icon)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2021, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012/80 "2021-05-02T15:44:54Z")
If you look at both letters they are significantly different in tone, and the Biden letter gets to the point quicker in letting you know the important part (how much you personally should have received). It also lets you know where you can get more information about what the package includes, something that the Trump letter did not. To me it looks like both were letters that were going be sent out anyway so that everyone could check to see if they received the amount that the IRS said they should. Much like I receive a confirmation letter (even though I specifically requested electronic only communications) from one account when I deposit something. That both decided to add additional text to that letter is understandable and the fact that Biden is using a tactic that Donald Trump used does not make it automatically bad. I barely spent time reading either letter anyway before they ended up in the shredder. `//i\\` [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-is-wasting-taxpayer-money-sending-superfluous-letters-to-take-credit-for-the-stimulus-payments/853012.md?page=5)