# Trump lies he’s the Devil, Biden lies , it oh that’s just old Joe **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 20, 2020, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404 "2020-10-20T12:01:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/61 "2020-10-20T21:43:32Z")
There were dozens of Obama lies listed on the Politifact website in addition to the specific ones I cited about it supposedly being easier to buy a Glock (a very expensive handgun, by the way) than a book, computer or vegetable. Go through all the Politifact lies and try to explain them away. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/62 "2020-10-20T21:44:59Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > > [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > > > > [@Jackmannii](#): > > > > > > No need to be squeamish about it - all politicians lie, period. > > > > Ok, I’ll bite. What are some Obama lies told between when he started his Presidential campaign and January 20, 2017? And I want actual lies, like what Trump tells. > > There’s a thing called Google for those who’ve forgotten Obama’s lies. > > "In July 2016, Obama asserted: “We flood communities with so many guns that it is easier for a teenager to buy a Glock than get his hands on a computer or even a book.” … > > A year earlier, Obama bewailed “[neighborhoods where it’s easier for you to buy a handgun and clips than it is for you to buy a fresh vegetable](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2015/03/12/obamas-odd-series-of-exaggerated-gun-claims/?utm_term=.776087fd4).” That’s called “hyperbole”. Obama is asserting that “there are a lot of guns out there”. Given that there are 1.2 handguns in the US per every US citizen, he is factually correct. It doesn’t mean that it is literally easier to purchase a firearm than a computer. Trump lies in the classic sense of taking credit for things he didn’t do or saying things did or did not happen regardless if they didn’t or did happen. Also, conservatives seem to forget that we knew who Trump was before he became President. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/63 "2020-10-20T21:46:24Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > There were dozens of Obama lies listed on the Politifact website in addition to the specific ones I cited about it supposedly being easier to buy a Glock (a very expensive handgun, by the way) than a book, computer or vegetable. > > Go through all the Politifact lies and try to explain them away. I might, but at the moment I’m mostly curious why you seem unable to post any actual Obama lies if there are so many. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/64 "2020-10-20T21:56:26Z")
I regret your laziness. Get back to me when you’ve “debunked” the Politifact list, for example. Then again, maybe both Politifact and the Washington Post (which bemoaned Obama’s “whoppers”) are Secret Tools of the Right-Wing Agenda. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/65 "2020-10-20T22:19:45Z")
> [@robby](#): > > I’m probably wasting my time here, but if you look at the two men objectively, you are comparing a mountain of lies to a molehill, both in quantity and degree of separation from the truth. Whether the comparison is between Trump and Biden or between Trump and Obama, @Jackmannii, this is exactly what I’m talking about when I use the analogy of comparing mountains to molehills. If you can’t objectively see the difference between the way that Trump lies continuously as compared to other U.S. politicians, I’m not sure what to say. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/66 "2020-10-20T22:36:34Z")
19 times out of 20, when someone says “Both sides are equally bad”, what they actually mean is, “I can no longer deny that my side is bad, but I can’t yet admit that the other side is better.” ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/67 "2020-10-20T22:37:56Z")
The only Presidents I can think of that were pretty much honest were Carter & Teddy Roosevelt. (maybe others pre-TR, like GW of course.) The rest lie whenever it seemed expedient. The problem with Trump is he’s pathological, he just lies. Then he seems to believe his own lies. Then he lies about lying even when we have the video tape. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/68 "2020-10-20T22:39:17Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Here’s a non sequiter- Rush Limbaugh says his lung cancer is terminal! > No link, because fuck Rush Limbaugh and his shitty cancer ridden lungs! > Pizza Night! Heh. You’re like the old Jewish guy who goes to confession after he sleeps with a supermodel. _”I’m telling EVERYONE!”_ 😃 Any more seats available on that bus? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/69 "2020-10-20T22:39:34Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Then he lies about lying even when we have the video tape. Or tweet. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/70 "2020-10-20T22:41:44Z")
All Abo-aaaad! ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/71 "2020-10-20T23:04:23Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > I regret your laziness. Says the guy who can’t be bothered to post any actual lies. Ok, I looked through the first couple things that showed up on the Politifact list. The first one was about steel production and productivity, and it’s clear Obama made an error. When called about it, the White House corrected the mistake. I see no evidence that Obama continued to quote the incorrect information after the correction. While one can never say with certainty, the evidence here points to error, not lie. The second one dealt with his position on using executive power to fix the immigration system. It’s clear that Obama became increasingly frustrated with Republican intransigence as his administration wore on, and eventually decided to just start bypassing them. I do think he should own up to that. And furthermore, it strains credulity to think he wasn’t familiar with his own previous positions. So if you want to call this one a lie, I’m okay with that. But yeah, a pretty minor one. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/72 "2020-10-20T23:11:03Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > I regret your laziness. > > Get back to me when you’ve “debunked” the Politifact list, for example. > > Then again, maybe both Politifact and the Washington Post (which bemoaned Obama’s “whoppers”) are Secret Tools of the Right-Wing Agenda. That’s not how it works. No one has an obligation to try to find proof that their own assertions are wrong. You made the claim so you have to back it up. It’s up to you to go through Politifact, pull out the statements you think they prove are lies (and not just false–those aren’t the same thing) and then bring them up. Your current example was an exaggeration for rhetorical effect. Those aren’t lies in the sense we’re talking about in regards to Trump. If all the other examples you see are of the same quality, then we can fairly say that Obama didn’t lie. Politifact just judges whether things are true. It does not judge how dishonest the person is saying them. Things can be untrue for many reasons. If you think some rise to the level of “lie” in the way Trump lies, you’ll have to make that claim. So far, you have not. You’ve just engaged in ad hominem. None of us are lazy for not doing your job. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/73 "2020-10-20T23:13:10Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > But it’s not as if past Presidents have been paragons of honesty. A straw man that no one has asserted or has any interest in defending, or is relevant or important to anything going on in the world. _ **Plonk!!!** _ – another one for the ignore list ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/74 "2020-10-20T23:44:22Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > _ **Plonk!!!** _ – another one for the ignore list You just don’t get the unassailable logic: 1. Trump has told thousands of obvious lies, some minor and some that have negatively impacted the nation’s health, finances, credibility and alliances. 2. But it’s not as if past Presidents have been paragons of honesty. 3. Therefore, Trump’s lies are of no consequence. See? It’s like how you can use this in your defense trial: 1. Judge, I know I was caught red-handed stealing money out of a bank vault. 2. But it’s not like everyone hasn’t stolen something at one point. Ever take a pen from a business, and “forget” to return it? 3. Therefore, I should walk free. Works every time. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2020, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/75 "2020-10-21T02:56:06Z")
Probably the most obnoxious tendency on the Dope is willful ignorance based on frantic hyper-partisanship. A poster takes offense at my saying that all politicians lie (while I singled out Trump as a uniquely egregious example), challenging me to name _a single time_ Obama ever lied. Even for a person who worships the ground Obama trod upon, this is an utterly moronic assertion, as anyone knows who maintained sentient existence during the past decade. Obama’s many prevarications were described in a linked article by Politifact, further corroborated by the Washington Post and The Hill (other sources exist as well). None of the sites provided can be dismissed as tools of Trump. Trying (and failing) to demolish one cited example but refusing to consider any others demonstrates sheer laziness undoubtedly compounded by embarrassment. You don’t get to demand “cite?” and then insist that you don’t have any obligation to look at the cite(s) provided. How transparently lame. I do admit to one instance of laziness. When a previous poster argued that a lie isn’t really a lie if it’s “hyperbole”, I should’ve dug up codes for ROTFLMAO smilies in response. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2020, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/76 "2020-10-21T07:54:04Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > > [@bobot](#): > > > > Here’s a non sequiter- Rush Limbaugh says his lung cancer is terminal! > > No link, because fuck Rush Limbaugh and his shitty cancer ridden lungs! > > Pizza Night! > > Heh. You’re like the old Jewish guy who goes to confession after he sleeps with a supermodel. _”I’m telling EVERYONE!”_ > 😃 > Any more seats available on that bus? No, but there’s room here in this handbasket ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2020, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/77 "2020-10-21T09:01:34Z")
The issue is degree and the extent to which it is done. Did Obama lie? Absolutely. No question. Did Trump lie? Absolutely. No question. So, how would you compare the two on their lies? How would you rate them and/or rank them? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2020, 10:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/78 "2020-10-21T10:24:22Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > > [@kaylasdad99](#): > > > > Any more seats available on that bus? > > No, but there’s room here in this handbasket Here’s the proper sized handbasket. [https://www.chicagotribune.com/resizer/jJTRur-VklKiCWbLGrpkoSKC9Os=/800x600/top/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-tronc.s3.amazonaws.com/public/RSYWACWA3VDEXPXDIK6HYDRANY.jpg](https://www.chicagotribune.com/resizer/jJTRur-VklKiCWbLGrpkoSKC9Os=/800x600/top/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-tronc.s3.amazonaws.com/public/RSYWACWA3VDEXPXDIK6HYDRANY.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2020, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/79 "2020-10-21T11:27:35Z")
Playing the “False Equivalency” card, hey? Can’t say I blame you. It worked very well in 2016 for you when you somehow convinced half the nation that sending emails on an unofficial server was as bad or worse than colluding with Russia to steal the election. Let’s see, Biden steals a candy bar. Trump robs a Federal Reserve Bank. Yep, they’re both criminals. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2020, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404/80 "2020-10-21T12:25:32Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Probably the most obnoxious tendency on the Dope is willful ignorance based on frantic hyper-partisanship. True dat. Why you’re calling yourself out though, is the question. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-lies-he-s-the-devil-biden-lies-it-oh-that-s-just-old-joe/923404.md?page=5)