# Trump Magically Turns NFL Games Into Anti-Trump Rallies **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 24, 2017, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216 "2017-09-24T20:34:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/301 "2017-09-26T18:07:14Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > I have always stood. I have always put my hand over my heart and sung along. The thing is, I love my country – but I never felt it was always right. I have been know to take to the streets, carrying a sign and chanting, when I felt our government wasn’t right about an important issue. > > Now it seems that standing for the anthem is saying that political dissent is somehow unAmerican. I really can’t get my head around that notion. > > But I don’t think I’ll be standing for the anthem any longer. I haven’t been to a professional game since high school days, and have never been into it that much myself, but I have a bunch of friends who are big football fans and we get together some weeks to watch the Bengals get their asses kicked. Due to trump, I may attend my first game of this millennium, just so that I can continue sitting as the anthem comes on. > [@Okrahoma](#): > > No. It is not demanding loyalty. It is expecting it. Do you see the difference? If someone is expecting loyalty, then they are demanding it. There is no difference. If you expect to see loyalty, and you don’t see it, what do you do? You then demand it. You order the owners to fire the “sons of bitches” who do not show the loyalty that you expect. > [@](#): > > When you stand for the national anthem, together with all the other people around you, of all colors and political creeds, you express unity. You all belong, you are all Americans, and you identify with the country. Whatever color or party or political persuasion you are. > > When you don’t stand for the anthem, for whatever stupid reason, you are separating yourself from others. And then, pathetically, you (plural) have the audacity to claim that those that are disgusted at your behavior are “dividers”. And those are the only reasons and ways in which it is acceptable for an american to profess their patriotism? Can you please list the forms of free speech that you find acceptable? ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/302 "2017-09-26T18:07:31Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > I have no idea who “he” is in your post, so I’m having some difficulty figuring out exactly what you thought I was writing about so that your reply makes sense. > > A request that, if refused, has negative repercussions is not, IMO, a request, it is a demand. > > “Could you please not do that? If you do, I’ll break your arm” is not a request, it’s a demand. > > “Expecting” people to do something is demanding it from them; it removes their choice and replaces it with your “expectation”. An expectation is something that you believe will happen. An expectation is not something that you believe may or may not happen. Becoming upset with someone for not meeting your expectations is becoming upset them with for not doing as you wished, which removes choice from the other person. > > Which means that no, it was a demand, not a request. Sorry… “He” here is Trump. And what he is demanding is really hyperbole and should be ignored, but he’s a chest thumping blowhard for saying these things. Yes I see your point that he was demanding, but I see it as hyperbole to roll my eyes at and say, shut up, do your job and not this shit. I am on his email list and he pinged me for my take on this, and I basically told him that. And I’m on Clinton’ email list too, BTW. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/303 "2017-09-26T18:09:28Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > No, you don’t get it. Just like you didn’t get it for the whole period of the presidential campaign. So, would you care to answer my question: In what way does Trump benefit from making large portions of the population become permanently disgusted with him? …or would you rather just keep on trollin’? ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/304 "2017-09-26T18:10:57Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I really don’t think it is. I think it’s exacerbating it. Most people just went along before, because nobody really gave a shit. Now, all of a sudden, it’s a defined political statement whether you stand or not. It wasn’t before. In order to “exacerbate” the division, it has to exist in the first place. Trump didn’t create the divisions. And yes, his tweets and the reactions to them are making it more of a defined political statement on whether you stand or not. It is a huge win for any politician when his opposition is cornered into supporting something extremely unpopular. Standing up for the national anthem a widespread, accepted and popular tradition in the United States. That is why I said that Trump’s tweets were a brilliant move. Just wait until some Democratic politicians feel pressured (or decide on their own) into not standing for the national anthem. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/305 "2017-09-26T18:12:23Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > So, would you care to answer my question: > > In what way does Trump benefit from making large portions of the population become permanently disgusted with him? Loaded question, presuming things not in evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/306 "2017-09-26T18:13:25Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Insulting NFL players and their mothers for peacefully protesting is neither “pointing out the division” nor “reflecting reality”. Note the way that **Okrahoma** is trying to change the narrative here, too. Now, in his words, this is all a brilliant Trump plan to divide the nation, so we know who is a patriot and who isn’t…? Huh? No, that’s not what this is about and that isn’t whats going to happen. It’s about Trump not liking the NFL, it’s black players (just generally, because their black) and about how Trump always reaches for the low-hanging populist fruit. Idiots like **Okrahoma** and **Clothahump** might want to make it about something else, but they’ll fail. And that will likely only make them madder. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/307 "2017-09-26T18:15:42Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > In order to “exacerbate” the division, it has to exist in the first place. Trump didn’t create the divisions. That’s a distinction without a difference to me as for what I see the role of a president as. You obviously disagree. That’s fine. (For the record, that’s the same reason I disliked Hillary’s “deplorables” comments.) I think a leader should promote unity and difference of opinion rather than “my way or the highway” sort of mindset. I saw firsthand the aftermath of what happened in Yugoslavia when Milosevic and Tuđman got their hands on nationalism and exacerbated divisions within their peoples. That’s the sort of thing that frightens me. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/308 "2017-09-26T18:16:32Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > When you stand for the national anthem, together with all the other people around you, of all colors and political creeds, you express unity. You all belong, you are all Americans, and you identify with the country. Whatever color or party or political persuasion you are. > > When you don’t stand for the anthem, for whatever stupid reason, you are separating yourself from others. And then, pathetically, you (plural) have the audacity to claim that those that are disgusted at your behavior are “dividers”. A lot of folks who are butt hurt about people kneeling during the anthem are the same folks who were talking about seceding when a black man was in the oval office. And they, like you, considered themselves patriots. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/309 "2017-09-26T18:17:04Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > The problem is that it resonates with about 50% of the country’s population, and as such, his is a stance of division. [http://remingtonresearchgroup.com/](http://remingtonresearchgroup.com/) "Do you think NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem? Yes: 64% No: 24% Unsure: 12%" "Last week, Donald Trump said NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem. Do you think NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem? Yes: 64% No: 25% Unsure: 11%" As I said, brilliant political move. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/310 "2017-09-26T18:20:14Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > [http://remingtonresearchgroup.com/](http://remingtonresearchgroup.com/) > > "Do you think NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem? > > Yes: 64% > No: 24% > Unsure: 12%" > > "Last week, Donald Trump said NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem. Do you think NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem? > > Yes: 64% > No: 25% > Unsure: 11%" > > As I said, brilliant political move. I mean, hell, I would probably vote “yes” in that survey. But that doesn’t mean I have any problem with those choosing not to. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/311 "2017-09-26T18:21:06Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > In order to “exacerbate” the division, it has to exist in the first place. Trump didn’t create the divisions. > > And yes, his tweets and the reactions to them are making it more of a defined political statement on whether you stand or not. It is a huge win for any politician when his opposition is cornered into supporting something extremely unpopular. Standing up for the national anthem a widespread, accepted and popular tradition in the United States. That is why I said that Trump’s tweets were a brilliant move. > > Just wait until some Democratic politicians feel pressured (or decide on their own) into not standing for the national anthem. No matter what kind of spin you try to put on this, this will, and is, backfiring on the orange buffoon. Trump, in his inimitably narcissistic way, made this a referendum on Trump. The national anthem, while this controversy lasts, will no longer be about America or patriotism, but about whether or not you stand with or against Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/312 "2017-09-26T18:24:20Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I mean, hell, I would probably vote “yes” in that survey. But that doesn’t mean I have any problem with those choosing not to. Any time a politician can manage to ally himself to the 64% of the country while forcing the opposition to ally themselves to 24% is a huge win. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/313 "2017-09-26T18:26:27Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > Any time a politician can manage to ally himself to the 64% of the country while forcing the opposition to ally themselves to 24% is a huge win. Congratulations on the huge win. The value of the prize has been significantly diminished, however. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/314 "2017-09-26T18:28:41Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > Any time a politician can manage to ally himself to the 64% of the country while forcing the opposition to ally themselves to 24% is a huge win. Sean Hannity?!.. Don’t you have a show to prepare for? You’ve packed on the pounds too. Maybe take your fat ass outside for a run… It’ll do you good. ---
**Author:** ![SaneBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@SaneBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SaneBill)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/315 "2017-09-26T18:32:20Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > I believe it is a lot more than 50%. So everybody who stand is a Trump supporter now ? > [@Okrahoma](#): > > Any time a politician can manage to ally himself to the 64% of the country while forcing the opposition to ally themselves to 24% is a huge win. Man, you’re stupid, that 64 % is not people wanting respect to Trump. Many of those people hate and loath Trump. And any moron can jump into a bandwagon if the question is right. Say do YOU want a total world destruction in a nuclear war ? No ? Well, neither did Obama - - - and 100 % of the population. Brilliant move by Obama. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/316 "2017-09-26T18:34:22Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > [http://remingtonresearchgroup.com/](http://remingtonresearchgroup.com/) > > "Do you think NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem? > > Yes: 64% > No: 24% > Unsure: 12%" > > "Last week, Donald Trump said NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem. Do you think NFL players should stand and be respectful during the national anthem? > > Yes: 64% > No: 25% > Unsure: 11%" > > As I said, brilliant political move. That’s not the question. The question is whether they should be fired for respectfully and peacefully protesting with a kneel or by sitting during the national anthem. That’d be a much more interesting poll. As would a poll on whether the mothers of NFL players who choose to peacefully protest are “bitches”, as Trump says they are. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/317 "2017-09-26T18:36:55Z")
> [@SaneBill](#): > > So everybody who stand is a Trump supporter now ? Yeah, this is Okrahoma’s 4th grade, “HaHa! Made you look!”, mentality hard at work. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/318 "2017-09-26T18:37:53Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > That’s not the question. You think that’s not the question. I think that is how most of the population sees the question. Especially as more and more players, Democratic politicians etc. “take the knee”. Again, you may disagree. But I see this as a brilliant political move that will benefit Trump. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/319 "2017-09-26T18:39:52Z")
The clear majority (61%) also doesn’t think players should be fired for not standing. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/320 "2017-09-26T18:44:06Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The clear majority (61%) also doesn’t think players should be fired for not standing. 🙂 You may think that the public perception of the kerfuffle is about firing. I don’t think so. I think it is about the not standing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216.md?page=17)