# Trump Magically Turns NFL Games Into Anti-Trump Rallies **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 24, 2017, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216 "2017-09-24T20:34:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 36
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/701 "2017-10-11T13:02:59Z")
Mike Pence wasted hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars for a political stunt involving the flag, and a stunt that is aimed to suppressing freedom of expression. If the NFL owners want to sanction the players, that’s between them and the league, but when a presidential administration goes out of its way to politicize ostensibly black athletes and “black” sports, then it using the potentially massive influence of the Executive to shape a social debate. This administration’s behavior is deliberately misrepresenting the flag at best; at worst, they are sowing the seeds of ethnic divisions in a society that has been haunted for centuries by race-based inequality and even had a civil war in which 600,000 men lost their lives over a racial cause. This is the height of irresponsibility, politically. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/702 "2017-10-11T13:13:30Z")
> [@Alley\_Dweller](#): > > [He stood with his hand over his heart during the anthem and then left.](https://youtu.be/kTxNHhku624?t=31s) Trying to keep it from escaping. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/703 "2017-10-11T13:16:41Z")
Probably guarding his wallet. There may have been negroes there. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/704 "2017-10-11T19:03:01Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Trying to keep it from escaping. You are supposing he has a heart to escape. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2017, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/705 "2017-10-11T19:06:43Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > The figure going around Facebook (so, you know, take with much salt) is $250,000, not counting the cost of clearing the airspace during his little jaunt. > > Both Pence and Kaepernick have the right to protest, but Colin’s protest hasn’t cost the taxpayer a dime. Did the city of Indianapolis tax payers have to pay for the security involved? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/706 "2017-10-12T14:53:45Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > A leader would have stayed and listened to their concerns, instead of spending a quarter million taxpayer bucks to exercise his own First Amendment rights. > > He walked out of _Hamilton_, he walked out of an NFL game, what else has he snowflaked out of rather than engage and lead? It would have been weird if he stayed after the show was over. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/707 "2017-10-12T15:09:09Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Modern America: > > The flag = The Troops > The Troops = White Troops > > National symbols represent the military. > > Veterans have a superior tier of citizenship that overrides any non-military concerns. > > Commercial event = mandatory display of appreciation for the military. I am probably as sick of the warrior worship in this country as you. Mostly because its almost entirely lip service and virtue signaling. However, I agree that veterans are (or at least at the moment they signed up) superior citizens than the average citizen. ISTM that when you sign up for the military, you are signing a blank check. You go where they need you to go. You do what they need you to do. You die if they need you to die. You know this going in. The military is disproportionately black and American Indian. The military disproportionately comes from the South. I don’t see how the military is more “white” than the general population. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/708 "2017-10-12T15:13:36Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Found this on Facebook this morning. > > Things that did not offend Mike Pence and cause him to leave early: > > 1. Claiming you can grab a woman’s genitals and kiss them because you’re a celebrity. Turns out this is kinda sorta true. People are subjected to sexual harassment and assault in Hollywood. Sometimes its quid pro quo and sometimes its tolerated because they want to get ahead in the industry. See Harvey Weinstein. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/709 "2017-10-12T15:15:50Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Oh, I’m not disagreeing with you at all about what that symbol means. I’m just saying that there are some people, particularly in the rural North, who are sufficiently clueless and/or dumb about the history of the symbol to think it means something else. Is it possible that kneeling football players are sufficiently clueless and/or dumb about the history of some symbols as well? > [@](#): > > This is how you get some white vets being genuinely taken aback that black high schoolers would be offended by the display of the Confederate flag. To some (not very bright or well-informed) people, it’s sort of like being called a traitor for displaying a British flag. Just as nowadays an American showing or wearing the Union Jack probably implies no more than a fondness for Masterpiece Theater or the Royal Family’s outfits instead of treason to the Revolutionary cause,\* these people think that displaying the Confederate flag means basically that you’re a gun-toting non-PC antigovernment maverick type, not that you are symbolically advocating the enslavement and oppression of black people. > > I don’t agree with their interpretation, and it’s only historical ignorance and/or stupidity that allows them to find that interpretation credible, but for some people that genuinely is how they interpret it. But people are still allowed to be offended, right? Just like people are allowed to be offended by people kneeling during the national anthem. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/710 "2017-10-12T15:17:03Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Very interesting–thanks. > > Yes, no doubt most such people who display the Confederate flag would be deeply resentful of any suggestion that their action signals ‘race hatred’ to onlookers. But that’s just because they’ve carefully avoided thinking about it (or are incapable of thinking about it). Are football players incapable of thinking that their actions signal disrespect for the nation, the military and veterans? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/711 "2017-10-12T15:19:44Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I am probably as sick of the warrior worship in this country as you. Mostly because its almost entirely lip service and virtue signaling. However, I agree that veterans are (or at least at the moment they signed up) superior citizens than the average citizen. > > ISTM that when you sign up for the military, you are signing a blank check. You go where they need you to go. You do what they need you to do. You die if they need you to die. You know this going in. > > The military is disproportionately black and American Indian. The military disproportionately comes from the South. I don’t see how the military is more “white” than the general population. I disagree that veterans are super citizens. We need soldiers, but we need teachers, plumbers, electrical linemen, and every other occupation out there. Some have hazards involved. You choose your career, you accept the risks that go with it. To think that your ass should be perpetually kissed for your choice is unreasonable. You have a point that the military is quite integrated. But those whose panties are in the greatest twist about this anthem crap are overwhelmingly white and overwhelmingly racist. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/712 "2017-10-12T15:29:58Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I am probably as sick of the warrior worship in this country as you. Mostly because its almost entirely lip service and virtue signaling. However, I agree that veterans are (or at least at the moment they signed up) superior citizens than the average citizen. > > ISTM that when you sign up for the military, you are signing a blank check. You go where they need you to go. You do what they need you to do. You die if they need you to die. You know this going in. > > The military is disproportionately black and American Indian. The military disproportionately comes from the South. I don’t see how the military is more “white” than the general population. I for one am sick of this fake phony warrior worship, especially when it comes from draft dodgers and cowards. But then war hawks are usually exactly that type, always ready to fight to the last drop of someone else’s blood (while they line their own pockets). However, as a veteran (one who never saw combat) I don’t think I’m superior to anyone and I don’t want anyone putting me on a pedestal - especially not to make cheap political points. The military - every one of them - takes an oath to defend the Constitution. That Constitution says we all have a right to free expression. That includes kneeling or sitting down. It does NOT mean you are free to express yourself only how the Orange Draft Dodging Shit Gibbon lets you. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/713 "2017-10-12T15:33:55Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Are football players incapable of thinking that their actions signal disrespect for the nation, the military and veterans? Trump signaled far, far more disrespect for the military and veterans during his campaign and hypocritical assholes like you still voted for him and continue to defend his idiocy. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/714 "2017-10-12T15:56:14Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Are football players incapable of thinking that their actions signal disrespect for the nation, the military and veterans? Perhaps because they do not signal disrespect for any of these things. It isn’t about the flag, it isn’t about the military, it isn’t about veterans. It’s about black people being victims of police violence. If you think that your being upset because people don’t behave as you want them to is their problem, you’ve got it backwards. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/715 "2017-10-12T15:57:06Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Are football players incapable of thinking that their actions signal disrespect for the nation, the military and veterans? Why do so many idiots keep suggesting that the flag and the anthem somehow belong to the military and to veterans? Neither the flag nor the anthem is a symbol of the military, and neither belong to veterans alone. As for disrespect for the nation: well, that’s sort of the point. They’re asking why they should respect a nation that claims to honor values of freedom and equality, while continuing a long history of treating some of its citizens as inferior by allowing things like police brutality directed disproportionately at blacks people. It’s about protesting the police violence, but in some measure it’s also about protesting the society and the nation that allows it to continue. One of the fundamental problems of patriotism and nationalism is that they seek to sustain a largely illusory sense of unity and commonality of interest, while blithely ignoring the very real differences and inequalities, and loudly shouting down anyone who wants to point out those things. Eugene Debs, criticizing American involvement in World War I, understood all of this a century ago: > [@](#): > > These are the gentry who are today wrapped up in the American flag, who shout their claim from the housetops that they are the only patriots, and who have their magnifying glasses in hand, scanning the country for evidence of disloyalty, eager to apply the brand of treason to the men who dare to even whisper their opposition to junker rule in the United States. No wonder Sam Johnson declared that “patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel.” He must have had this Wall Street gentry in mind, or at least their prototypes, for in every age it has been the tyrant, the oppressor, and the exploiter who has wrapped himself in the cloak of patriotism, or religion, or both to deceive and overawe the people. That speech got Debs tried and imprisoned under the Sedition Act. It’s lucky for the protesting NFL players that the Cheeto-in-Chief and his jackbooted acolytes have no such tool at their disposal these days, although i’m not completely confident that they wouldn’t try it anyway. ---
**Author:** ![SaneBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@SaneBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SaneBill)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/716 "2017-10-12T16:45:53Z")
Another angle: [Adam Neely: Anthem](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TI7nhSIuHg4). If you’re interested in music bookmark this guy. ---
**Author:** ![somepumpkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7feea3/32.png) [@somepumpkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/somepumpkin)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/717 "2017-10-12T17:02:26Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Are football players incapable of thinking that their actions signal disrespect for the nation, the military and veterans? Our local news interviewed some Carolina Panthers’ fans about the issue the other night. There were also a couple of Afghanistan-war veterans in the bar, so they asked them, too. The veterans said, and I’m paraphrasing, that one of the freedoms that they were protecting for us is the right to protest. They found no personal disrespect in someone protesting the flag or the country. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/718 "2017-10-12T17:26:40Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Are football players incapable of thinking that their actions signal disrespect for the nation, the military and veterans? They are certainly aware that their actions are being deliberately misrepresented that way by those with a pro-racism agenda. But how is that the fault of those bringing it up? And what different method would you consider acceptable, if any? We don’t even need to ask how you got military and veterans out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/719 "2017-10-12T17:31:07Z")
[Rush Limbaugh weighing in, suprprisingly](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/limbaugh-trumps-comments-on-nfl-starting-to-make-me-nervous/ar-AAtjsBF) > [@](#): > > “There’s a part of this story that’s starting to make me nervous, and it’s this: I am very uncomfortable with the president of the United States being able to dictate the behavior and power of anybody. That’s not where this should be coming from,” Limbaugh said on his show. ---
**Author:** ![somepumpkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7feea3/32.png) [@somepumpkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/somepumpkin)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216/720 "2017-10-12T17:59:58Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > [Rush Limbaugh weighing in, suprprisingly](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/limbaugh-trumps-comments-on-nfl-starting-to-make-me-nervous/ar-AAtjsBF) I have fallen and I can’t get up. Wow… I would have never expected even a glimpse of \*reason \*from that guy. \ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216.md?page=35) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-magically-turns-nfl-games-into-anti-trump-rallies/797216.md?page=37)