# Trump planning a bunch of pardons? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 6, 2018, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547 "2018-06-06T15:27:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/61 "2018-06-12T02:20:42Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > So, even if he pardoned himself (let’s assume he can, it seems undetermined but likely), could he still be forced to disgorge (I believe that is the term of art) the ill-gotten gains? I would assume yes? All of Congress couldn’t get him to disclose his tax returns. In the last couple of years we have learned of the complete disconnect between what Congress can do, and what Congress will do. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/62 "2018-06-12T03:00:03Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Indeed: as mentioned earlier what Alice Johnson received was a _commutation_, \*\*not \*\*a pardon. It means that your \*sentence \*is \*reduced \*NOT that your conviction is lifted and record cleaned. It’s a “s/he has had enough already, lay off” decision. So the base seens to be taking it fine so far. > > Of course, Mr. Tremendous then floated posthumously pardoning Muhammad Ali, and the Ali family lawyer had to point out that his conviction was vacated on appeal by the Supreme Court so there is nothing to pardon. Not just was Ali’s conviction overturned, but Jimmy Carter pardoned all Vietnam draft dodgers in 1977. The consensus here locally (Louisville, Kentucky… Ali’s hometown) is that this is a ploy to try to win some of the black votes ahead of the midterms. Also, I wonder: if Trump were to pardon himself, that would negate any 5th Amendment protection, correct? If so, then wouldn’t he then be obligated to have to answer a Mueller subpoena? Could he be thrown in jail for refusing to comply? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/63 "2018-06-12T03:14:25Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > Not just was Ali’s conviction overturned, but Jimmy Carter pardoned all Vietnam draft dodgers in 1977. The consensus here locally (Louisville, Kentucky… Ali’s hometown) is that this is a ploy to try to win some of the black votes ahead of the midterms. Well ahead of the midterms. Carter was inaugurated on January 20 and issued the pardons on January 21. Carter had said during his campaigns that he planned on issuing a blanket pardon if he was elected so if the public had felt strongly opposed they had their chance to reject his plan by not voting for him. So it really wasn’t so much a “ploy” as it was following through on a campaign promise. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/64 "2018-06-12T03:21:44Z")
I think you’re misunderstanding me. My thought was that there was nothing to pardon Ali for, since the blanket pardon issued by Carter covered Ali’s “draft dodger” status. I was suggesting that TRUMP was using the idea of pardoning Ali as a ploy ahead of the midterms. I wasn’t commenting on Carter other than just for the Vietnam pardon. Apologies if I was unclear. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/65 "2018-06-12T04:06:53Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > Also, I wonder: if Trump were to pardon himself, that would negate any 5th Amendment protection, correct? If so, then wouldn’t he then be obligated to have to answer a Mueller subpoena? Could he be thrown in jail for refusing to comply? Nah. He’d just pardon himself - it’s pardons all the way down. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/66 "2018-06-12T04:09:28Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > Nah. He’d just pardon himself - it’s pardons all the way down. That’s weird. The post you quoted was written by me, but is attributed to another poster. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 9:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/67 "2018-06-12T09:46:01Z")
I hope so. And I also wish the governors of each state would go thru the system and pardon a bunch. I was watching a show and the[Innocence Project](https://www.innocenceproject.org/) estimates their are between 40,000 and 100,000 people in this country who were wrongly convicted. Plus we have thousands more that got way to long and harsh of a sentence. I work with some former prison guards who told me this. The American prison system is out of control. We put way too many people in prison. Do you know 1/3rd of all the women in prison in the world are locked up in American prisons? ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/68 "2018-06-12T14:26:59Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > That’s weird. The post you quoted was written by me, but is attributed to another poster. That is wierd - your name & the link go to Czarcasm’s post but the text is from the following post (which I was responding Mods - what is going on? ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/69 "2018-06-12T14:33:34Z")
Does he realize the grave responsibility inherent in arbitrarily deciding to release a convicted prisoner, and is he deeply looking into these cases before making such a decision? No, it’s just all politics with him. That’s Trump. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/70 "2018-06-12T16:25:20Z")
Whatever donald does it is something that Mueller has already thought about more intelligently. Do people really think that presidential pardons are a panacaea for everything? There are state charges for starters. But this is not even getting into what a tangled web we weave when we think about this stuff so casually, and with so much confirmation bias. Mueller knows all this already, so the scenario of donald, or his underlings, being able to play this like a fiddle is not realistic. Once you grant pardons to solve a problem like this it makes the problem much bigger. Donald can flip himself and perhaps save himself from jail by playing the resign card. Let’s see if Mueller will give him a chance to stay out of the pen. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/71 "2018-06-12T17:26:44Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > I think you’re misunderstanding me. My thought was that there was nothing to pardon Ali for, since the blanket pardon issued by Carter covered Ali’s “draft dodger” status. > > I was suggesting that TRUMP was using the idea of pardoning Ali as a ploy ahead of the midterms. I wasn’t commenting on Carter other than just for the Vietnam pardon. > > Apologies if I was unclear. My apologies as well. I did misunderstand you. I thought you were saying Carter issued the pardon as a ploy to win black votes in the 1978 midterm elections. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/72 "2018-06-12T17:54:13Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Does he realize the grave responsibility inherent in arbitrarily deciding to release a convicted prisoner, and is he deeply looking into these cases before making such a decision? No, it’s just all politics with him. > > That’s Trump. Trump is playing _Celebrity Pardon_. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/73 "2018-06-13T03:14:28Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > That’s weird. The post you quoted was written by me, but is attributed to another poster. > [@jasg](#): > > That is wierd - your name & the link go to Czarcasm’s post but the text is from the following post (which I was responding > > Mods - what is going on? Not sure, I suspect a copy/paste/post edit mishap. I’ve corrected it. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547/74 "2018-06-13T04:01:20Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Not sure, I suspect a copy/paste/post edit mishap. I’ve corrected it. > > [/moderating] Thanks. I recall only a delete of a few quoted lines, not c&p but could have been… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-planning-a-bunch-of-pardons/815547.md?page=3)