# Trump’s Election as a Warning to Liberals (& Conservatives) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 12, 2016, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569 "2016-12-12T23:33:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2016, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/81 "2016-12-16T22:44:34Z")
> [@Korhut](#): > > However, I have heard many in the mainstream media take the position that a vote for Trump is stupid and can only be explained by racism. Many? Name two. ---
**Author:** ![Korhut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bcef8e/32.png) [@Korhut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Korhut)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2016, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/82 "2016-12-16T22:49:10Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Ah-the _Oliver Hardy_ Defense(aka “_Now_ look what you made me do!”). For all your feeble protests, the only one in that voting booth was _you_, and _you_ decided you would rather have Trump as President. _You_ were o.k. with his very troubling past, his dubious business dealings and the way he treats anyone not in his small family circle. Suck it up and take responsibility. I am not okay with his past but I do prefer his future to Hillary’s. I think I made a good decision given the options, but it was distasteful. Now we can talk about his past, her past if you’d like in another thread. I really don’t think Hillary’s any cleaner than Trump. But I’d like to see if we can learn something from the Democrat’s reaction to the Trump win. Maybe we can do better in 4 years? ---
**Author:** ![Korhut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bcef8e/32.png) [@Korhut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Korhut)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2016, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/83 "2016-12-16T22:58:11Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Many? Name two. “This was a white-lash against a changing country,” - Van Jones, CNN “I was confident because I thought there were more Americans who believe in progress and equality than there were Americans who were racist, xenophobic, misogynistic, and homophobic.” - Roxan Gay, New York Times ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/84 "2016-12-17T00:39:30Z")
> [@Korhut](#): > > “This was a white-lash against a changing country,” - Van Jones, CNN > > “I was confident because I thought there were more Americans who believe in progress and equality than there were Americans who were racist, xenophobic, misogynistic, and homophobic.” - Roxan Gay, New York Times Neither of these is the equivalent of “…a vote for Trump is stupid and can only be explained by racism.” ---
**Author:** ![Korhut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bcef8e/32.png) [@Korhut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Korhut)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/85 "2016-12-17T01:43:39Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Neither of these is the equivalent of “…a vote for Trump is stupid and can only be explained by racism.” :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/86 "2016-12-17T03:35:15Z")
> [@Korhut](#): > > I guess it’s to be expected. I am a middle-aged white male making decent money. so of course i must be racist, right? I mean, clearly, I would have no other basis to look at the candidates available and pick Trump as the best choice if racism wasn’t the driving factor in my life. Yeah, you’re not a bigot. You just thought it would be better if a bigot was running the country. That’s a super important and useful distinction! ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/87 "2016-12-17T03:40:58Z")
And, again, we see a complete lack of willingness to engage in rational issue-based discussion, as opposed to pointing fingers and flinging accusations of bad behavior for being on the other side. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/88 "2016-12-17T04:10:29Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > It is a very poor way of looking at the world when a person thinks that their particular viewpoint is the only “correct” viewpoint that could exist. Morals are, after all, not absolutes, generally speaking. Though their views may change, I find most people to be moral absolutists. Americans, certainly. Many conservatives claim to base their morals on the inerrant word of God, or tradition, or the free market, never to be questioned. For all the talk of relativist liberals over the years I haven’t seen much evidence of it. You don’t often hear a liberal say, well, that’s just how they do it down there in Alabama, you can’t judge their culture from your position of privilege. They want to establish their moral system everywhere they can, just like conservatives. I agree people shouldn’t insult each other, but that doesn’t have much to do with legitimacy, just good manners. [Build a garden instead.](http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/02/23/in-favor-of-niceness-community-and-civilization/) I can give a polite devil’s advocate position from everything from anarchism to white nationalism, doesn’t mean I believe any of it. > [@](#): > > If that continues, you’ll continue to lose power when, by all reasonable metrics, you should be gaining it. America is a conservative country with an election system that favors the current conservative population distribution. I don’t see why liberals should be making gains, outside of some social causes that don’t ruffle the feathers of the business class. I never bought into the demographic collapse meme. It’s a mix of transparent wishful thinking and tribalistic triumphalism. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/89 "2016-12-17T04:53:50Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > And, again, we see a complete lack of willingness to engage in rational issue-based discussion, as opposed to pointing fingers and flinging accusations of bad behavior for being on the other side. Yeah, why don’t you get back to me when your political party doesn’t routinely accuse me of being a pedophile. ---
**Author:** ![Korhut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bcef8e/32.png) [@Korhut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Korhut)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/90 "2016-12-17T05:31:19Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Yeah, you’re not a bigot. You just thought it would be better if a bigot was running the country. > > That’s a super important and useful distinction! It is. I looked at the candidates and felt the bigot would be better than Clinton. I have to say, i was expecting better from a moderator. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/91 "2016-12-17T05:34:18Z")
Well, it’s been a disappointing year all around. ---
**Author:** ![Korhut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bcef8e/32.png) [@Korhut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Korhut)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/92 "2016-12-17T05:47:34Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > Though their views may change, I find most people to be moral absolutists … country with an election system that favors the current conservative population distribution. I don’t see why liberals should be making gains, outside of some social causes that don’t ruffle the feathers of the business class. I never bought into the demographic collapse meme. It’s a mix of transparent wishful thinking and tribalistic triumphalism. I’ve cut quite a bit out, but an insightful response, marshmallow. I agree with your point that liberals aren’t very successful with social justice issues that go too far against business interests. But I do think that we will continue to make some important progress, even in a Trump presidency. For example, I am hopeful that the increasing use of smartphones to monitor police will continue to bring to light the horrible overuse of lethal force. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/93 "2016-12-17T15:39:48Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > It’s 1848 all over again. We wanted liberty and justice…and the reactionaries shut it all down. > > (Also the FBI director, damn his eyes.) May I ask what this is a reference to? ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/94 "2016-12-17T21:34:24Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > May I ask what this is a reference to? France, and the crack-down by conservatives that shut down revolutionary hopes of greater egalitarianism: > [@](#): > > Following the overthrow of King Louis Philippe in February, the elected government of the Second Republic ruled France. In the months that followed, this government steered a course that became more conservative. On 23 June 1848, the people of Paris rose in insurrection,[1] which became known as June Days Uprising – a bloody but unsuccessful rebellion by the Paris workers against a conservative turn in the Republic’s course. [French Revolution of 1848 - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Revolution_of_1848) (Well, I’m assuming that’s what Trinopus meant, anyway.) ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569/95 "2016-12-17T22:37:47Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Yeah, why don’t you get back to me when your political party doesn’t routinely accuse me of being a pedophile. How about we engage in rational discussion once every other week and do the accusation thing every other week. That way we can all ease into this uneasy truce… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-s-election-as-a-warning-to-liberals-conservatives/774569.md?page=4)