# Trump threatens to sue Univision and NBC: Case can haz legs? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 1, 2015, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940 "2015-07-01T05:15:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/41 "2015-07-01T17:56:54Z")
> [@commasense](#): > > In discussing lawsuits, lawyers and corporate PR officials _ **never** _ sound worried. Exactly. That PR shill is being paid a lot of money, specifically because he can stand there and sound like half-billion-dollar lawsuits are something he deals with 3 or 4 times a day. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/42 "2015-07-01T18:16:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The First Amendment does not operate to prevent me from opining on what you shouldn’t be allowed to say. > > Just as it doesn’t operate to prevent you from opining that networks should be allowed to disregard contracts if they feel the party to them is using “race war” language. Agreed. And tell you what, I’ll bow out in recognition of the fact that I can’t be the most useful contributor on this subject. But I am genuinely interested in the question of whether extra-contractual considerations come into play in a case where a Spanish language network tries to cut ties with a public figure/presidential candidate whose platform includes hate speech against Mexicans, assuming the contract itself doesn’t provide for that. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/43 "2015-07-01T18:34:26Z")
Amusingly, the suit itself claims that the First Amendment does in fact operate to prevent Univision from terminating their contract with Trump: > [@](#): > > 1. However, Univision’s attempt to suppress Mr. Trump’s First Amendment rights and defame his image did not end there. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/44 "2015-07-01T18:35:53Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > It’s possible, but very unlikely. Few things would poison a litigant’s credibility position quicker than making a sweeping claim like this and having the defendant be able to file an answer that says, “The plaintiff doesn’t mention 5(b)(vi) which allows termination in case of immoral behavior on the part of MUO.”. That may be true on the legal stage, but I suspect that that is secondary in terms of Trumps goals in filing the lawsuit. Primarily I suspect that Trump is suing because it bolsters the narrative he’s cultivating that he’s a guy always gets what he wants and that those who mess with him live to regret it. Even if the case is an open and shut case against him\* he’d still probably file it just on those grounds that his making a big hullabaloo about filing it will hit the front page, while it being thrown out of court some months down the road will merit a short paragraph on page 10. \*not that I think it is necessarily open and shut against him, just that the fact he’s filing it shouldn’t be seen as an indication that its not. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/45 "2015-07-01T18:46:02Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > … And is it possible that Trump’s claim is omitting that portion of the contract that contains clauses as to moral behavior, defamation and so forth? IOW, the parts that might be relevant to the justification Univision has for terminating the contract. Absent the need to support their use of an escape clause, Trump will almost certainly file a motion in limine to exclude the defendants’ justification for breaking the contracts. One party being a dick is not an excuse for another party to break a contract–unless not being a dick is part of the contract. This is absolutely maddening, because any fool can see that Trump’s actions could reasonably be seen as harmful to Univision and NBC, but they don’t get to talk about that. However, rather than breach their contracts they ought to have brought a suit against Trump for damaging them. Which would be a hard case to support because it’d be entirely speculative, if reasonable. And Trump would assume the position of a sobbing, persecuted victim being bullied by huge corporate interests. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/46 "2015-07-01T19:03:53Z")
How is Trump’s first amendment rights being suppressed. Did Congress pass a law instructing Univision to fire him because of what he said? That would violate his first amendment rights. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/47 "2015-07-01T19:38:20Z")
> [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](#): > > I just saw a blurb that Macy’s has pulled all the Trump merchandise from their shelves. > > Trump is going to be quite busy with lawsuits. After Martha Stewart and Tiger Woods, I’d suspect any such contract has a clause allowing removal of the merchandise if the brand is damaged, which the Trump brand it. Plus, keeping Trump merchandise on the shelves could be seen as endorsing him as a candidate, which is clearly against the interest of the store. ---
**Author:** ![Grotonian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c2a13f/32.png) [@Grotonian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grotonian)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/48 "2015-07-01T20:20:26Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > They’re an ethnic group. > > On edit: a number of ethnic groups, actually. I have no idea what this means. Mexicans are citizens/residents of Mexico, or their descendants. I can move to Mexico and change my nationality. That does nothing to my ethnicity, unless you think nationality and ethnicity are synonymous, in which case I really don’t get your point. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/49 "2015-07-01T20:26:49Z")
> [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](#): > > I just saw a blurb that Macy’s has pulled all the Trump merchandise from their shelves. > > Trump is going to be quite busy with lawsuits. > [@Voyager](#): > > After Martha Stewart and Tiger Woods, I’d suspect any such contract has a clause allowing removal of the merchandise if the brand is damaged, which the Trump brand it. Plus, keeping Trump merchandise on the shelves could be seen as endorsing him as a candidate, which is clearly against the interest of the store. Why did Macy’s have Trump merchandise in the first place? According to the article I read, it was menswear. Is anybody really taking style tips from that trumped-up buffoon? ---
**Author:** ![Grotonian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c2a13f/32.png) [@Grotonian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grotonian)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/50 "2015-07-01T20:34:49Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > I said ‘race war tactics’. Turn on any right-leaning tv news show, and you will ALWAYS see black people portrayed as gang members or some kind of criminal. It is important to certain forces on the right to keep the image of black people as criminals in the minds of the public, so that people don’t recognize the injustice of wrecking their lives with the criminal justice system in a modern-day Jim Crow kind of way the way we do in this country. This hyperbole makes sense with black people, they are a race. Mexicans are not. > [@](#): > > I characterized Mexicans as a ‘minority’. Right. That made no sense either, except in the sense that ALL non-Americans are minorities in this country. Canadians are just as much minorities as Mexicans, but I never hear them referred to that way. Why do you think Mexicans are minorities? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/51 "2015-07-01T21:29:11Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > He characterized Mexicans as rapists. These are race war tactics, portraying minorities as criminals. Networks should be allowed to not humor it. > [@Bricker](#): > > People should not be allowed to answer legal questions with statements that do not invoke legal principles. Ah, but his last sentence was a legal principle! (It’s a really bad one, and would entail government censorship of contracts to prevent the humoring of “race war tactics” in speech, but it is a “legal principle.”) (And, of course, so was your response!) ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/52 "2015-07-01T21:36:59Z")
> [@Grotonian](#): > > I have no idea what this means. Mexicans are citizens/residents of Mexico, or their descendants. I can move to Mexico and change my nationality. That does nothing to my ethnicity, unless you think nationality and ethnicity are synonymous, in which case I really don’t get your point. “Or their descendants.” To what degree? If a guy has a Mexican father, is he a Mexican? If so, a guy with a patrilneal G’G’G’G’G’Grandfather who was Mexican…is a Mexican. In practice, it’s an ethnic group, and those are “fuzzy sets.” You can’t define them absolutely, but only point to instances close to the center of the set. There are no “Mexican surnames” that are always, by definition, Mexican. Mr. Garcia might be Venezuelan; there’s no way to know. But if you meet a guy in Los Angeles named Garcia, the odds are pretty strong he’s ethnically of Mexican descent. The words “Latino” and “Hispanic” serve similar purposes. They cannot be rigorously defined: there is no single test that will always correctly include members of the set and exclude non-members. But that doesn’t mean that the set doesn’t exist. ---
**Author:** ![Grotonian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c2a13f/32.png) [@Grotonian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grotonian)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/53 "2015-07-01T22:02:56Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > “Or their descendants.” To what degree? If a guy has a Mexican father, is he a Mexican? If so, a guy with a patrilneal G’G’G’G’G’Grandfather who was Mexican…is a Mexican. > > In practice, it’s an ethnic group, and those are “fuzzy sets.” You can’t define them absolutely, but only point to instances close to the center of the set. > > There are no “Mexican surnames” that are always, by definition, Mexican. Mr. Garcia might be Venezuelan; there’s no way to know. But if you meet a guy in Los Angeles named Garcia, the odds are pretty strong he’s ethnically of Mexican descent. > > The words “Latino” and “Hispanic” serve similar purposes. They cannot be rigorously defined: there is no single test that will always correctly include members of the set and exclude non-members. But that doesn’t mean that the set doesn’t exist. Latino and Hispanic have nothing to do with nationality. Mexican has everything to do with nationality, and nothing to do with race. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/54 "2015-07-01T23:04:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The First Amendment does not operate to prevent me from opining on what you shouldn’t be allowed to say. > > Just as it doesn’t operate to prevent you from opining that networks should be allowed to disregard contracts if they feel the party to them is using “race war” language. Which, by your own logic, would prevent you from saying they shouldn’t do anything, since according to you, we can’t discuss anything but the legal situation. You’re making a moral “should” that does not involve the law. As long as he’s not pretending to give legal advice, there’s nothing wrong with it. It’s just you wanting to control the conversation–the thing a lot of people get pissed off at you about. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/55 "2015-07-01T23:07:55Z")
I doubt seriously that the suit will ever go anywhere near a courtroom, but supposing it does. NBC/Univision will claim they fulfilled the contract by paying him the $13.5 million, and that nothing in the contract requires that they actually broadcast the pageants. Trump will argue that voiding the contract damaged him in some material way. NBC/U will point to any number of breach suits filed by producers, stars, studios, etc. that show that indirect damages caused by the cancellation of a program aren’t its problem as long as the network paid off the contract and didn’t actually defame Trump (which would be a separate lawsuit anyway.) ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Krupe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Leo\_Krupe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Krupe)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2015, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/56 "2015-07-01T23:20:55Z")
Trump’s polling very high at the moment. When he crashes and burns, I’m going to do my best Flounder impression (“Oh, boy! Is this great!”) ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/57 "2015-07-02T00:04:32Z")
I do not understand either party’s actions here ( nor care greatly, to be honest ). Surely his ex-partners would be in a far better position if they had the President of the United States presenting their programs, including Miss Universe [_I didn’t realise these sort of things were still a thing_]; whereas Mr. Trump is jeopardising his bid for supreme power by engaging in petty bickering, and indicating, however falsely, that he cares for anything other than winning the race. If unable to simply say, ‘_I am above these mundane matters; do what you will_’, he should at least come to an agreement with them to postpone litigation until he has either won or withdrawn. He should consider how much America needs him. Palin — Trump 2016 ! ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/58 "2015-07-02T00:30:15Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > I doubt seriously that the suit will ever go anywhere near a courtroom, but supposing it does. > > NBC/Univision will claim they fulfilled the contract by paying him the $13.5 million, and that nothing in the contract requires that they actually broadcast the pageants. > > Trump will argue that voiding the contract damaged him in some material way. > > NBC/U will point to any number of breach suits filed by producers, stars, studios, etc. that show that indirect damages caused by the cancellation of a program aren’t its problem as long as the network paid off the contract and didn’t actually defame Trump (which would be a separate lawsuit anyway.) This post is excellent. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/59 "2015-07-02T00:37:41Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > I doubt seriously that the suit will ever go anywhere near a courtroom, but supposing it does. > > NBC/Univision will claim they fulfilled the contract by paying him the $13.5 million, and that nothing in the contract requires that they actually broadcast the pageants. According to the lawsuit, the contract did require that the show be broadcast “at least once”. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2015, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940/60 "2015-07-02T00:42:06Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > People should not be allowed to answer legal questions with statements that do not invoke legal principles. Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaa. Start your own Message Board and set the rules as you see fit. > [@Simplicio](#): > > According to the lawsuit, the contract did require that the show be broadcast “at least once”. Funny, that. It’s 2015. Broadcast at least once could easily mean that NBC/Universal ( just to be clear, when people refer to the parent company as “NBC/UNI”, they are not referring to it as “NBC/ Univision”. ) could easily stream it from 2 a.m. to 4 a.m. once on a Sunday morning. Voila. It has been broadcast once. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-threatens-to-sue-univision-and-nbc-case-can-haz-legs/723940.md?page=4)