# Trump to Eliminate Immigration Dreamers Program for Undocumented Immigrants who Arrived as Children **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 4, 2017, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443 "2017-09-04T01:32:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/1 "2017-09-04T01:32:03Z")
> [@](#): > > President Donald Trump has decided to end the Obama-era program that grants work permits to undocumented immigrants who arrived in the country as children, according to two sources familiar with his thinking. Senior White House aides huddled Sunday afternoon to discuss the rollout of a decision likely to ignite a political firestorm — and fulfill one of the president’s core campaign promises. > > Trump has wrestled for months with whether to do away with the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals, known as DACA. He has faced strong warnings from members of his own party not to scrap the program and struggled with his own misgivings about targeting minors for deportation. > > Conversations with Attorney General Jeff Sessions, who argued that Congress — rather than the executive branch — is responsible for writing immigration law, helped persuade the president to terminate the program, the two sources said, though White House aides caution that — as with everything in the Trump White House — nothing is set in stone until an official announcement has been made. > > In a nod to reservations held by many lawmakers, the White House plans to delay the enforcement of the president’s decision for six months, giving Congress a window to act… [http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/03/trump-dreamers-immigration-daca-immigrants-242301](http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/03/trump-dreamers-immigration-daca-immigrants-242301) I strongly disagree with this. Children don’t make the decision to illegally immigrate. And in many cases they are not even familiar with their home country. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/2 "2017-09-04T02:10:27Z")
I’m kinda OK with this as I don’t like a powerful Executive who can essentially make immigration law. That should be done by Congress. I would have extended the program by 12 months, though, as I don’t see Congress being able to pass new legislation in 6 months. I would support legislation from Congress that more or less does the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/3 "2017-09-04T02:50:27Z")
> [@](#): > > …struggled with his own misgivings about targeting minors for deportation… Give me a break. He hasn’t struggled with anything resembling a “misgiving,” unless it’s a misgiving about whether this move will lose him some votes. The attorneys general who have brought the lawsuit are doing it on principle, but Trump has no principles and frankly, isn’t capable of reasoning. These are 700,000 to 800,000 (depending on where you read) human beings, students, employed individuals, taxpayers. Heard on NPR (don’t have a cite): the Mexican school system can’t handle the thousands of younger kids who would be sent there, and American schools will lose funding if their student populations take a precipitous drop. Just one more MAGA idea that is good for NO ONE. Seriously: how does this Make America Great?? Whom does it help to deport these people? Unless he’s just threatening to do it so he can change his mind at the last minute and be a hero. ---
**Author:** ![dogbutler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dogbutler/32/428_2.png) [@dogbutler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dogbutler)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/4 "2017-09-04T03:26:20Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Unless he’s just threatening to do it so he can change his mind at the last minute and be a hero. He won’t. He has to pander to his Nazi/KKK voting base. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/5 "2017-09-04T04:26:47Z")
By delaying it for 6 months, he drops the ball in Congress’s lap, giving them the chance to override his decision with legislation. (Hopefully. And hopefully veto-proof.) With so many in Congress – even including some leading Repubs – urging that DACA be continued, there might be some hope of that. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/6 "2017-09-04T05:43:19Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Unless he’s just threatening to do it so he can change his mind at the last minute and be a hero. More like find a couple really photogenic model minorities and pardon them or some shit so they can stay. It’s wanna-be dictator shit: let the government be harsh, he gets to extend mercy, be generous. This makes it about pleasing the personality at the top, not rule of law. People that hate dreamers won’t mind a couple being allowed to stay, and moderate conservatives will allow this to soothe their conscience: if a couple get to stay, there was a chance, for the most deserving. Maybe a 1/200,000 chance, but still a chance. If you really wanted to work for it. The ones who really deserve it get to stay. Fuck the other 799,999. I cannot tell you how ill I am about this. My job is getting first generation kids into good colleges. So many are dreamers. My heart aches. And what about this admissions cycle? What will colleges do? The timing is terrible: early action/early decision deadline is Nov 1st, so they need to know if they are going to even review undocumented kids applications before then. And Jesus, can you imagine being 17 and putting your best effort into a college application that may well be utterly futile? It’d be hard for an adult to maintain motivation in that case. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/7 "2017-09-04T06:08:12Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > More like find a couple really photogenic model minorities and pardon them or some shit so they can stay. Can’t use his daughter’s makeup artist, that one immigrated illegally as an adult… ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/8 "2017-09-04T07:44:30Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > More like find a couple really photogenic model minorities and pardon them or some shit so they can stay. It’s wanna-be dictator shit: let the government be harsh, he gets to extend mercy, be generous. This makes it about pleasing the personality at the top, not rule of law. People that hate dreamers won’t mind a couple being allowed to stay, and moderate conservatives will allow this to soothe their conscience: if a couple get to stay, there was a chance, for the most deserving. Maybe a 1/200,000 chance, but still a chance. If you really wanted to work for it. The ones who really deserve it get to stay. Fuck the other 799,999. > > I cannot tell you how ill I am about this. My job is getting first generation kids into good colleges. So many are dreamers. My heart aches. And what about this admissions cycle? What will colleges do? The timing is terrible: early action/early decision deadline is Nov 1st, so they need to know if they are going to even review undocumented kids applications before then. And Jesus, can you imagine being 17 and putting your best effort into a college application that may well be utterly futile? It’d be hard for an adult to maintain motivation in that case. You are ill about the President of the United States not being a god-King and Congress finally undertaking something resembling immigration reform?:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![SOJA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@SOJA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SOJA)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/9 "2017-09-04T08:08:27Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > By delaying it for 6 months, he drops the ball in Congress’s lap, giving them the chance to override his decision with legislation. (Hopefully. And hopefully veto-proof.) With so many in Congress – even including some leading Repubs – urging that DACA be continued, there might be some hope of that. Bingo. Trump ran as a Republican and Pretends to be a Republican. It’s the only party he had a choice. You think a die hard Liberal for 60 some years just changes to Republicanism at the tip of a hat overnight? No siree. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/10 "2017-09-04T10:38:44Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > By delaying it for 6 months, he drops the ball in Congress’s lap, giving them the chance to override his decision with legislation. (Hopefully. And hopefully veto-proof.) With so many in Congress – even including some leading Repubs – urging that DACA be continued, there might be some hope of that. Well, E-verify is going to come with a permanent DREAM Act, and possibly more wall funding as well. ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/11 "2017-09-04T11:29:59Z")
Yet another in his steps to eliminate anything Barack Obama ever did during his term. I truly believe that’s all that matters to him. Typical spoiled brat behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/12 "2017-09-04T13:24:02Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > I strongly disagree with this. Children don’t make the decision to illegally immigrate. And in many cases they are not even familiar with their home country. It’s not their “home country” if they left as a small child and never went back. Don’t call it a “home country” because that diminishes what’s going on here. It’s a “country of origin” or “birth country”, but it’s not _home_ to these kids. _Home_ is the United States, where they grew up. American is their home, not where they started by accident of birth. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/13 "2017-09-04T13:32:47Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Heard on NPR (don’t have a cite): the Mexican school system can’t handle the thousands of younger kids who would be sent there, and American schools will lose funding if their student populations take a precipitous drop. I would question that. One of the requirements to even apply for DACA is that you have to be 15 years old, although there is a waiver of that requirement if you are currently in the process of being deported. There is also a requirement that you have lived in the US continuously since 2007. My guess is that whoever reported that was misinformed and just assumed that anyone under the age of 18 could be deported. I suppose that might be a theoretical maximum for deportation, but that would assume logistics that would be physically impossible to implement. DACA is primarily utilized by folks who have finished school and are looking for legal status to work or continue their post-secondary education. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/14 "2017-09-04T16:13:34Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I would question that. … I stand corrected. Maybe the story was about deportation in general. > [@FairyChatMom](#): > > Yet another in his steps to eliminate anything Barack Obama ever did during his term. I truly believe that’s all that matters to him. Typical spoiled brat behavior. This is the whole reason the attorneys general are bringing suit. It’s all about a legal principle and undoing one more thing Obama did. The effect on people does not matter at all. ---
**Author:** ![DummyGladHands](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/49beb7/32.png) [@DummyGladHands](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DummyGladHands)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2017, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/15 "2017-09-04T16:29:02Z")
> [@FairyChatMom](#): > > Yet another in his steps to eliminate anything Barack Obama ever did during his term. I truly believe that’s all that matters to him. Typical spoiled brat behavior. Yup. ---
**Author:** ![Buttercup\_Smith](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buttercup_smith/32/473_2.png) [@Buttercup\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buttercup_Smith)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2017, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/16 "2017-09-06T09:14:20Z")
And Trump is a ass. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2017, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/17 "2017-09-06T13:50:22Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I stand corrected. Maybe the story was about deportation in general. That could be it. These kids (and young adults) are in a terrible position, and although we have no legal obligation to allow them to stay, it would be a moral travesty to start deporting them. But… there is a moral hazard that has to be dealt with and I think we need to do something about that. What we do, I’m not sure. It may seem cruel, but I think the parents should be punished in some way, as what they did is a form of child endangerment. I’m just not sure how you would do that without inadvertently punishing the children, too. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2017, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/18 "2017-09-06T15:57:49Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I would question that. One of the requirements to even apply for DACA is that you have to be 15 years old, although there is a waiver of that requirement if you are currently in the process of being deported. There is also a requirement that you have lived in the US continuously since 2007. My guess is that whoever reported that was misinformed and just assumed that anyone under the age of 18 could be deported. > > I suppose that might be a theoretical maximum for deportation, but that would assume logistics that would be physically impossible to implement. DACA is primarily utilized by folks who have finished school and are looking for legal status to work or continue their post-secondary education. Many Dreamers are now in their 20s and 30s and have small children of their own who are not likely to remain in the U.S. without their parents. These kids often have very poor Spanish skills, and the Mexican school system is simply not equipped to deal with them. And let’s not forget that a large chunk of DACA recipients are from countries other than Mexico. The Mexican school system is fantastically well-equipped compared to, say, rural Huehuetenango. But let’s be real; most of these people are not going to leave on their own, so all this accomplishes is kicking them out of the decent jobs that many have managed to get and kicking them back into the underclass. ---
**Author:** ![rbroome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/838e76/32.png) [@rbroome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rbroome)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2017, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/19 "2017-09-06T18:23:01Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Unless he’s just threatening to do it so he can change his mind at the last minute and be a hero. He has already said he will revisit the decision if Congress doesn’t act. So he can tell his base he ended DACA while keeping parts of the program going. His base will love it. They don’t expect accuracy, they just want him to do what they want. The conservatives will object, but I doubt anyone will listen. The next question is what will happen to the details-new enrollments, renewals (is that required?), record-keeping, etc. While Obama ran it, we could assume a humane system. Now that Trump is in charge, it is unlikely there will be much of a system at all. But there won’t be mass deportations, which is good. BTW, has anyone noticed that his campaign threats to deport all the illegals have evaporated and no one has noticed? Good thing, but another example of how easy it is to underestimate Trump. He makes all sorts of outrageous threats and then ignores them. His base understands. The rest of us don’t. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2017, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443/20 "2017-09-08T16:56:50Z")
Didn’t DACA only apply to kids who’d grown up and either graduated college or been in the military? Why would anyone think they were the best people to kick out? In Obama’s comment on Trump’s law change he mentioned that one of the reasons for DACA was to use the ICE budget more wisely by allowing them to focus on criminals, and that deportations of criminals had actually gone up. Seems to me that’s something conservatives should like. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-to-eliminate-immigration-dreamers-program-for-undocumented-immigrants-who-arrived-as-children/795443.md?page=2)