# Trump voters prefer Jefferson Davis as president to Barack Obama **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 23, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487 "2017-08-23T21:33:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/281 "2017-08-28T00:48:30Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I fully expect to be voting for a Democrat for President in 2020, and it would be nice if it were someone that fit that bill. I gave up making predictions about Trump awhile back, but let’s hope he’s not one of the choices. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/282 "2017-08-28T01:07:54Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I gave up making predictions about Trump awhile back, but let’s hope he’s not one of the choices. I no longer make predictions either. But every time my wife asks me if I’ve heard the news, my first and most sincere wish is to hear that he’s suffered a near fatal anuirysm that’s left him unable to speak and tweet, or change the tv channel from CNN. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/283 "2017-08-28T01:14:45Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Or you could just stay home and fuck cactuses. Lots of cactusses, plural cactusses ending in es’s! Maybe I’ve just not noticed before, but you are one seriously angry dude lately. You okay, man? 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/284 "2017-08-28T01:29:03Z")
Yeah, it’s this fucking Trump thing. It ain’t right. It ain’t funny, and those who oppose him, aren’t necessarily those who voted against him. Even “smart” lawyers. It’s a bad deal. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/285 "2017-08-28T01:37:01Z")
_Illegitimi non carborundum_, **bobot**. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/286 "2017-08-28T02:35:41Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > There’s been no racism or sexism from any conservatives in the last 50 years? > > If this isn’t your point, then what is your point? That some accusations have been false or mistaken? If so, do you imagine a future real world with no false or mistaken accusations ever? That doesn’t strike me as anything other than a fantasy. The point is the tactic of erroneously calling people racist, bigoted, or whatever is not isolated. It’s a deliberate and vital part of left wing strategy. Cite? This board is infested with examples. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/287 "2017-08-28T02:41:28Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Some time back, I read a series of essays, later collected into a book, about how to win at competitive video games. Rather than discussing specific strategy, the author first discussed a mindset he called the “scrub” mindset: > > He goes on to give other examples: > > I feel there’s a useful analogy here, although clearly not an exact match for th political realm. But I say it’s possible, as Obama did, do win elections without making the election about how awful your opponent and his supporters are. Obama did not sacrifice his duty to uphold noble goals. He didn’t sell his soul to win the White House. It’s possible to stand for what is right without gratuitous attacks on the opposing voters. > > You hold up this notion of calling out bigotry as some sort of holy calling, that, win or lose, your candidate must do it. But if the result is a Trump victory, then it seems that the end result is that bigotry GAINS footholds. > > I agree that my putative party is more to blame for Trump’s victory. And I admit that part of the reason I’m pushing this theory is that I would rather saddle you (collectively) with the blame than think about the flaws on my side. > > But that doesn’t make false anything I said. Republicans are not going to defeat Trump now. We had our chance and fumbled the ball right into out own end zone. I acknowledge this. But as long as your team sneers and condescends to half the Trump voters, they’re not going to budge. That’s something you guys have to adjust. Here’s the thing though, you can still call out bigotry. You do it without being directly accusatory towards a group of people. Instead of saying 50% of Trump’s supporters are deplorable say bigoted actions don’t reflect American values. Hilary made the same mistake Romney made. She made a directed personal attack that was overly broad and unnecessary. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/288 "2017-08-28T04:18:50Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Or you could just stay home and fuck cactuses. Lots of cactusses, plural cactusses ending in es’s! I’m not really sure what this response means. Maybe it’s a request to explain how I can say I’m generally interested in Republicans staying in power, but also predict that I’ll be voting for a Democrat for President in 2020? If so, then the answer is straightforward. I can’t vote for Trump. I believe he’ll be the GOP candidate in 2020. So that handles the Presidential vote. But I still expect to support Republicans in down-ticket races. None of this involves any caryophyllales. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/289 "2017-08-28T04:24:54Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Here’s the thing though, you can still call out bigotry. You do it without being directly accusatory towards a group of people. Instead of saying 50% of Trump’s supporters are deplorable say bigoted actions don’t reflect American values. Hilary made the same mistake Romney made. She made a directed personal attack that was overly broad and unnecessary. 45% of Trump supporters would prefer a traitorous Confederate to a black President. I mean, it’s not EXACTLY half, but it’s pretty damn close, no? ---
**Author:** ![Reluctant\_A](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/839c29/32.png) [@Reluctant\_A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reluctant_A)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/290 "2017-08-28T04:51:09Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I feel there’s a useful analogy here, although clearly not an exact match for th political realm. But I say it’s possible, as Obama did, do win elections without making the election about how awful your opponent and his supporters are… Sure, it’s possible. Provided you and your opponent are, by agreement spoken or otherwise, playing by the same rules. To borrow from the text you quoted about competitive video gaming, Obama ran a campaign under the political equivalent of “scrub” rules. And he had the good fortune to be campaigning in opposition to candidates whom were also campaigning under “scrub” rules: in both 2008 and 2012, the two major candidates more or less had a handshake agreement to not use throws, and they upheld that agreement in both campaigns. I think that Clinton made the mistake of expecting that Trump would play by the same ‘rules’ as she was, and then compounded her mistake by believing that, when the American public saw that he was not, that they would come to the reasonable conclusion that Trump was an dishonorable shitbag, who was not fit to be President… But they didn’t. Now, I happen to be one of those people whom you referred to earlier in the thread, who lacks both “skills as a rhetor” and “the temperament to engage in debate,” which is why I avoid the #GreatDebates and #Elections sub-folders like the plague. But, I admit to being perplexed as to why so many people in this country appear to believe that being accused of being a racist, or being accused of breaking bread with racists is equally bad, or even worse, than actual racism? Like, given the choice between being thought of as a bigot, and being a publicly visible ally for oppressed groups, why would anyone who doesn’t choose option B think that it would be unfair or unreasonable for other people to call them a bigot? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/291 "2017-08-28T05:35:10Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > 45% of Trump supporters would prefer a traitorous Confederate to a black President. I mean, it’s not EXACTLY half, but it’s pretty damn close, no? Oh, please! I’d bet my last dollar that the vast majority of respondents have no idea who Jefferson Davis even is, and of those who do, I’d bet my last dollar that they don’t think of him as a traitorous Confederate. And I’d also bet my last dollar that most of the respondents by far would have answered the same way in regard to _any_ Democrat president. You are aware that Democrat presidents routinely draw opposition from those who disagree with their approach/philosophy/goals, aren’t you? Trump’s supporters are almost exclusively conservative and Republican in their politics. Do you really think their opposition to Obama boils down to nothing but the color of his skin? When come back, bring maturity…and logic…and brains…and at least some sense that you have a grasp on how things work in the real world, none of which are evident in the nonsense you posted above. ---
**Author:** ![lokij](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/5e9695/32.png) [@lokij](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lokij)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/292 "2017-08-28T05:52:20Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Some time back, I read a series of essays, later collected into a book, about how to win at competitive video games. Rather than discussing specific strategy, the author first discussed a mindset he called the “scrub” mindset: Yeah, the issue is that there is a clear delineation between competitive video game play and casual/recreational video game play… and using methods successful in one arena in the other is often poor form. It’s not just video games though, it can be a lot of things and I’ve seen it play out in several games/hobbies… a game gets popular because it’s fun and people enjoy playing it, then a competitive arena evolves and optimal strategies are quickly found, people take those strategies back into the casual arena and win big, then the game community collapses. Reason? It’s no longer fun. It’s no longer enjoyable to get your ass handed to you by a completely predictable player doing the same things over and over, things you could do too if you cared to but… don’t, so you just go find a new game. Then it’s just a small group of masturbatory ‘elite’ players slowly dying off. One could even find message board equivalents if one so desired. 😛 Politics isn’t like a video game, there is no casual arena… it’s all competitive… but also, there are no other games to play that aren’t disastrous so everybody is forced to play. Because of this for a long time, recognizing that we all must participate in the game, informal and formal rules were observed which preserved some civility. Republicans in the last twenty years have become the political equivalent of a basement dweller ‘elite’ player who’s determined to win at all costs, fuck ‘fun’… 'cause winning is fun amirite? Lest one think I’ve always been a devoted progressive lefty snowflake SJW libtard, check out my early post history. This is a race to the bottom and I don’t know what is going to stop it… but let’s not uphold this kind of philosophy regarding politics. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/293 "2017-08-28T06:09:56Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Don’t you mean the myth of left-wing violence? Of course. Here’s a mythical example from just yesterday. **[Black-clad anarchists storm Berkeley rally, assaulting 5](Black-clad anarchists storm Berkeley rally, assaulting 5)** > [@](#): > > Black-clad anarchists on Sunday stormed into what had been a largely peaceful Berkeley protest against hate and **attacked at least five people** , including the leader of a politically conservative group **who canceled an event a day earlier in San Francisco amid fears of violence**. > > The group of more than 100 hooded protesters, with shields emblazoned with the words “no hate” and waving a flag identifying themselves as anarchists, busted through police lines, **avoiding security checks by officers to take away possible weapons**. Then the anarchists blended with a crowd of 2,000 largely peaceful protesters who turned up to demonstrate in a “Rally Against Hate” opposed to a much smaller gathering of right-wing protesters. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/294 "2017-08-28T06:38:45Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Of course. Here’s a mythical example from just yesterday. > > **[Black-clad anarchists storm Berkeley rally, assaulting 5](Black-clad anarchists storm Berkeley rally, assaulting 5)** You aren’t going to believe SDMB’s own version of Baghdad Bob? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/295 "2017-08-28T07:04:15Z")
I never cease to be amazed at the blindness those on the left exhibit toward the harmful or wrongful behavior of their own. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/296 "2017-08-28T07:20:32Z")
And speaking of left-wing violence against the right, I have to question the wisdom of some of the Snowflake party deciding to resort to violence against the NFL, Nascar, NFL and MMA party. If they keep it up things are not going to end well for them. They’ve been somewhat successful so far because most of those on the other side are out of school and have jobs, but if they keep it up and members of the right begin to turn out in equal or greater numbers they’re gonna be hurtin’. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/297 "2017-08-28T07:21:33Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I never cease to be amazed at the blindness those on the left exhibit toward the harmful or wrongful behavior of their own. They are disingenuous. Note the amount of threads hyperventilating about every little thing they can pin on Republicans or Trump or whomever. Yet, nothing but silence or misleading spin and deflection when video evidence of radical leftist attacking people is linked. Or, even worse, when they do concede that the video is real they sidetrack the issue with pedantic discussions of how to label that group while hypocritically attacking groups with no regards to the nuance they demand of others. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/298 "2017-08-28T07:37:16Z")
Yep. They remind me of McGregor fans last night, who went from confidently predicting a two-round victory for McGregor beforehand to proclaiming afterward that he really won because he went ten rounds against the best in the sport. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/299 "2017-08-28T09:17:44Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > The point is the tactic of erroneously calling people racist, bigoted, or whatever is not isolated. It’s a deliberate and vital part of left wing strategy. Cite? This board is infested with examples. Bullshit. There can be honest disagreements on whether something is motivated by bigotry or not, and there have been, on this board and in America in general. I see no reason to believe that most of the disagreements are not honest. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/300 "2017-08-28T09:19:10Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > They are disingenuous. Note the amount of threads hyperventilating about every little thing they can pin on Republicans or Trump or whomever. Yet, nothing but silence or misleading spin and deflection when video evidence of radical leftist attacking people is linked. Or, even worse, when they do concede that the video is real they sidetrack the issue with pedantic discussions of how to label that group while hypocritically attacking groups with no regards to the nuance they demand of others. Wonderful broad-brushing! Tell us more about how evil “they” are. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487.md?page=16)