# Trump voters prefer Jefferson Davis as president to Barack Obama **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 23, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487 "2017-08-23T21:33:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Reluctant\_A](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/839c29/32.png) [@Reluctant\_A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reluctant_A)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/321 "2017-08-28T20:19:13Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > Speaking in overly broad generalities, the Left views personal racism as a spectrum, ranging from ways in which culturally ingrained implicit biases are manifested to David Duke-style racism, and a whole lot in between. In this understanding, lots of people harbor racist beliefs that they do not even recognize as racist. Moreover, good intention is insufficient unless you also have perfect knowledge and no implicit bias. The corollary to all of that is that being racist is not this enormous slur upon one’s character, at least for the more common forms of racism. > > The Right, by contrast, views racism as much closer to a binary, and a deep character flaw. Either one consciously believes other races are manifestly inferior or one does not. If you believe that, you know it. And good people do not believe that. Most people in 2017 are not racist, goes this view. And then, there’s this… reminds me a little of this ‘meme’ pic I discovered some time ago, except replace “white people” on the first line with “conservatives”: [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbCspkfWEAE7CQM.jpg:large](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbCspkfWEAE7CQM.jpg:large) Forgot to add before the edit window closed: > [@Bone](#): > > I’ve long maintained that casual accusations of racism do real damage when it comes to seeking justice for actual racism. I, myself, have long maintained that casual racism is, by far, more injurious than casual accusations of racism. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/322 "2017-08-28T20:25:03Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > > [@QuickSilver](#): > > > > That’s fucking rich coming from a Trump supporter. HA! > > > > You’re just another delusional idiot, among many. > > How many times do I have to state that I didn’t vote for Trump? Just because someone sees/points out how the left has gone off the rails, it doesn’t mean he’s ipso-facto a Trump supporter. > > But to the everyone-who-disagrees-with-me-is-evil crowd, I can see how the distinction might be without a difference. :rolleyes: I formally retract my accusation of you being a Trump supporter. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/323 "2017-08-28T20:26:42Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > I think it’s problematic to put a special burden on racism as an explanation. If you’re just saying we ought to be careful about identifying the level of evidence we have for an explanation, then of course I agree. If you’re saying we should be more careful with racism, I think that’s a mistake. For one, I don’t see that putting a special burden on one kind of explanation advances truth-finding. And, for another, identifying and rooting out the effects of racism is among the most important work we can be doing on social science and political discourse. Even identifying something as potentially racist, and therefore highly worthy of additional investigation, is important. Another thoughtful post. A little bit of both actually. We should be very careful about identifying the level of evidence because of the nuke nature of the accusation. I also think special care should be taken because of the nuke nature. The reason is because the risk of misidentifying racism carries greater harms than the risk of misidentifying more innocuous things, so with greater risk, there should be a greater amount of care taken. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/324 "2017-08-28T20:34:33Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > We should be very careful about identifying the level of evidence because of the nuke nature of the accusation. I also think special care should be taken because of the nuke nature. The reason is because the risk of misidentifying racism carries greater harms than the risk of misidentifying more innocuous things, so with greater risk, there should be a greater amount of care taken. I had understood the “nuke nature of the accusation” to be about the sort of unthinking moral scorn heaped on a person accused of racism, without careful reflection on the accuracy of the accusation or on whether the kind of racism being alleged even merits that level of moral blame. I’m not sure I’m convinced that is as widespread and as threatening as you claim, but I understand the logic of it. I don’t understand how that concept applies to criticizing, say, unnamed anonymous people in a poll sample. Do you think it applies in that context? If so, why? ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/325 "2017-08-28T20:38:52Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > I don’t understand how that concept applies to criticizing, say, unnamed anonymous people in a poll sample. Do you think it applies in that context? If so, why? You’re right, it doesn’t really apply in that context and I wasn’t trying to use it that way. I jumped into the thread towards the end after I think it meandered a bit. The only way it could apply is when tangential participants are associated with the label, but that’s weak to non-existent at best. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/326 "2017-08-28T21:14:40Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Uhhh…the GOP IS the Snowflake party. Almost a year later, there are still people crying about “deplorable”. > > But talk shit like they’re gonna actually do something. They’ll find out that 20 guns are useless with only two hands, and plenty of liberals own guns, too. Yes, we do. But we don’t drive to some podunk town and parade with our guns, in our cute little hoods or “designer Hitler Jugend” outfits. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2017, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/327 "2017-08-28T23:16:08Z")
To judge from the evidence so far, what you do is show up with your faces masked because you know you’re going to be breaking the law, and then you either outnumber and beat up on individual right wing demonstrators, or you throw rocks and tumbling wine bottles into the crowd or you clock people in the head with bicycle locks. Then when you’re met with equal or superior resistance you run away, leaving your injured compatriots behind to face the madding crowd on their own. ---
**Author:** ![Itself](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d07c76/32.png) [@Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/328 "2017-08-29T00:49:59Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > And speaking of left-wing violence against the right, I have to question the wisdom of some of the Snowflake party deciding to resort to violence against the **NFL** , Nascar, **NFL** and MMA party. If they keep it up things are not going to end well for them. My dad could beat up your dad. And he works at Nintendo, so I have all the secret cool games. What’s genuinely pathetic— not just sad, but genuinely pitiable— is that you actually think the country works like that. You think that liberals are pusillanimous teenagers whinging about safe spaces and social justice, and you want some big, strong Republican Adonis to sweep in, satisfy the angry hard-on you’ve got in your head from strawman liberals, and give you whatever masturbatory reward you expect for being a True American. You’re a fucking idiot. There’s a lot that’s admirable about liberals and conservatives and moderates, and there’s a lot that’s open to debate on both sides. Instead, you’ve latched on to this ridiculous caricature of political sides and whine about it at the kids’ table while the grown-ups sit at the big table and talk about actual ideas. And that’s the best place for you, because you’re too stupid to do anything else. You’re going to live out the rest of your pointless life sad and lonely because you lack the mental awareness— not just intelligence, but merely not being so goddamned lazy— to see the world around you as anything more than an arbitrary contest between sports teams. In the meantime, kindly shut the fuck up and let the grown-ups talk about something you’re deliberately choosing not to understand, you stupid, stupid child. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/329 "2017-08-29T05:33:50Z")
Wow, and another one gets triggered. If you’ll settle down a little and re-read the quote of mine in your very own post you’ll see that the scenario I was talking about was not one in which some Republican ‘Adonis’ comes sweeping in to smite the innocent liberal, but rather one in which liberals get their butts handed to them should they continue their current practice of inflicting or trying to inflict violence upon right-wing demonstrators. They are the aggressors, you see, not the conservatives, who are traditionally more well behaved to begin with. I never cease to be amazed at the blindness lefties exhibit toward the behavior of their own. Just last night someone claimed in this very thread that left-wing violence was a myth. I then posted a link to a story about just such a myth that occurred two days ago. Crickets chirped. In closing, I’d suggest that you be more careful about calling people childish idiots. Pot, kettle, etc.? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/330 "2017-08-29T05:47:00Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > […] but rather one in which liberals get their butts handed to them should they continue their current practice of inflicting or trying to inflict violence upon right-wing demonstrators. They are the aggressors, you see, not the conservatives, who are traditionally more well behaved to begin with. Um, you seem to be forgetting that it was the conservatives in Charlottesville who showed up armed to the teeth and shouting racist and antisemitic slogans, who beat up innocent bystanders and actually murdered a nonviolent protester while injuring many more. That’s not exactly being “more well behaved.” ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/331 "2017-08-29T06:03:35Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > the scenario I was talking about was not one in which some Republican ‘Adonis’ comes sweeping in to smite the innocent liberal No, I think “Adonis” is exactly how I would describe the typical NASCAR enthusiast. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/332 "2017-08-29T06:25:58Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Um, you seem to be forgetting that it was the conservatives in Charlottesville who showed up armed to the teeth and shouting racist and antisemitic slogans, who beat up innocent bystanders and actually murdered a nonviolent protester while injuring many more. That’s not exactly being “more well behaved.” Reprehensible for sure. Can’t help but wonder if they’d still been armed and behaving the way they did had liberal douchebags never attacked Trump’s supporters at rallies or began throwing wine bottles and swinging bicycle locks at other right wing demonstrations. The racial insults are probably 50% or more insincere and intended to cheese off the libs, which also would be unnecessary were the nation’s liberals not behaving in such an obnoxious and violent manner. I was amused the excuse that the ACLU dreamed up to excuse themselves from having to defend the free speech rights of Nazis by announcing they would not defend hate groups who come to demonstrations armed. I can’t help but wonder if ‘armed’ covers wine bottles and bicycle locks as well. How dare those evil Nazis, the entire handful of them, attempt to defend themselves. Nazism is vile and evil but free speech is free speech. The best approach is to ignore them, like has been the case throughout the country’s history since WWII. They existed in the 40s, the 50s, the 60s (Playboy published an extensive interview with George Lincoln Rockwell, the founder of the American Nazi Party in 1966, and in so doing gave his views wide exposure. Crickets chirped and when he was murdered a few years later by one of his own followers, the reaction of most of the country was, “Who?”) and throughout all the time since. But let’s call a spade a fucking shovel here, mmkay? This is all about Trump. The left has tried to portray Trump and his supporters as Nazis ever since he first became a serious contender for the presidency, and that nonsense has been ratcheted up exponentially since he actually won. Lefties the country over are looking for ways to take out their frustration over Trump’s election and are using the non-threat of Nazism as a way to attack as many of the people who support Trump as they can. And what happened in Charlottesville is the result. I’m sure you and many of the rest of the country’s lefties would love it if Trump’s demonstrators and everyone who voted for him just stood there benignly and took their well-deserved lumps, but in the real world people fight back. Actions have consequences and had your political compatriots not turned to violence to begin with, the tragedy of Charlottesville would never have happened. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/333 "2017-08-29T06:27:03Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > No, I think “Adonis” is exactly how I would describe the typical NASCAR enthusiast. Cool, I’ll alert the press. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/334 "2017-08-29T06:36:19Z")
OK, let’s see… > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > How dare those evil Nazis, the entire handful of them, attempt to defend themselves. So, the Nazis were just defending themselves when they brutally murdered an innocent woman? Nah, I gotta be reading that wrong, right?.. > [@](#): > > Actions have consequences and had your political compatriots not turned to violence to begin with, the tragedy of Charlottesville would never have happened. …okkkayyyy…apparently I was reading it right the first time. It’s the left’s fault that Nazis brutally murdered some innocent woman. In all seriousness, your family needs to check up on you more often. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/335 "2017-08-29T06:41:14Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > …In closing, I’d suggest that you be more careful about calling people childish idiots. Pot, kettle, etc.? Can I still call you deplorable? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/336 "2017-08-29T07:17:54Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > OK, let’s see… > > So, the Nazis were just defending themselves when they brutally murdered an innocent woman? Nah, I gotta be reading that wrong, right?.. Of course you’re wrong, it is you after all. They were defending themselves when they showed up armed. I would have thought even a moron could have gleaned that from what I said, but evidently not. Were the Nazis showing up to their demonstrations armed before leftie asshats began showing up in greater numbers and attacking/beating/assaulting them with their weapons? The answer, since I’m sure you’ll be loathe to acknowledge it, is _no_! > [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > It’s the left’s fault that Nazis brutally murdered some innocent woman. More than likely, yeah! That douchebag very likely wouldn’t have gotten so het up at Nazi counter-demonstrators had they not behaved so violently and obnoxiously at other demonstrations. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/337 "2017-08-29T07:24:27Z")
Google “Charlottesville chat” to get the links to the stories from _Wired, Fortune_, and _Politico_. Boiled down, its internet chats amongst the earnest patriots of the alt-Reich before the events in question. An eager bunch they were, it would seem. There are other less well known outlets with similar stories. Read a couple of these, and that’s gonna have to do it for me. Trying to stay sane and sober, shit like this makes me feel like I have to choose. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/338 "2017-08-29T07:25:20Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > …okkkayyyy…apparently I was reading it right the first time. It’s the left’s fault that Nazis brutally murdered some innocent woman. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > More than likely, yeah! That douchebag very likely wouldn’t have gotten so het up at Nazi counter-demonstrators had they not behaved so violently and obnoxiously at other demonstrations. Do you have family who can get you checked out? You’re an older guy, right? You should go to a doctor and get your cognitive functions checked out. In all seriousness, not being a dick, you should get a health checkup. I’m not going to respond to any more of your posts. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/339 "2017-08-29T07:37:30Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Trying to stay sane and sober, shit like this makes me feel like I have to choose. Ah, yes, mind altering substances - the time-honored refuge for lefties when faced with reality. It’s worked out so well for so many of you, hasn’t it? > [@Evil Economist](#): > > In all seriousness, not being a dick… Oh, please. You’ve always been a dick and you’re not so cleverly being one now. Go peddle phony someplace else, I’m not buying. ---
**Author:** ![Itself](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d07c76/32.png) [@Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487/340 "2017-08-29T07:43:58Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Wow, and another one gets triggered. Dude, I’m a conservative. Your tired schtick about triggered snowflakes is nowhere near as clever or funny as you seem to think it is. You’re going to continue to be scared, angry, and confused for the rest of your life. That’s sad, but you deserve it. You’re not a conservative; you’re a lickspittle bitch of whatever strongman you think will save you from the nasty liberals. You are a useless, sniveling, subhuman coward; you’re a worthless excuse for an American and a human being; and you disgust me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-voters-prefer-jefferson-davis-as-president-to-barack-obama/794487.md?page=18)