# Trump Vs. The Boy Scouts: Much Ado About Nothing, or An Embarrassing Mess? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 25, 2017, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080 "2017-07-25T15:15:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/181 "2017-07-27T20:40:10Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > LOL. > > I’m just trying to imagine your reaction if Obama had spoken to the Scouts about the necessity of passing the Affordable Care Act, or the need to shut down Guantanamo Bay, or the importance of not discriminating against LGBTQ people in the scouting organization. I believe we have [a photo](http://i.imgur.com/nVJg4hm.jpg)! ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/182 "2017-07-27T20:58:34Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > I wonder if in the future they’ll ask all President’s to give a recorded speech (as Obama did) just to forestall this sort of bullshit. Screw tradition, anyone dumb enough to invite Trump to speak is an idiot who deserves to listen to the inappropriate stupidity he delivers. (Not to imply that the kids deserved it, but the so called adults in the room that didn’t know better? Just asking for it.) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/183 "2017-07-27T22:31:10Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > It’s much ado about nothing. However, the libs and the msm will blow it up out of all proportion. I would say keep on fucking that chicken, **Precious Snowflake** , but that one’s been dead for years. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/184 "2017-07-27T22:34:02Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > It’s much ado about nothing. However, the libs and the msm will blow it up out of all proportion. The Boy Scouts thought it worthy of an apology. Me too. As others have said, this is not in the top ten list of deplorable actions by Mr Trump recently, but still a good ireminder of what a total ass he is. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/185 "2017-07-27T22:44:14Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > The Boy Scouts thought it worthy of an apology. Me too. > > As others have said, this is not in the top ten list of deplorable actions by Mr Trump recently, but still a good ireminder of what a total ass he is. What the BSA should apologize for is failing to instill the qualities they claim to represent. It seems the Scouts are [full of the same howling baboons](http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2017/07/25/the_boy_scouts_loved_trump_s_speech_reminding_us_how_different_girl_scouts.html) that voted for Trump. > [@](#): > > Plenty of member of Trump’s audience were right there with him. They clapped when he insulted the press and the specific videographers at the event. They booed when Trump made a passing mention of Hillary Clinton during an extended rant about how thoroughly he won the presidential election. They chanted “USA!” when he said that former Boy Scout and current Secretary of Health and Human Services Tom Price is “helping to keep millions of Americans strong and healthy” by getting the Senate votes necessary to start “killing this horrible thing known as Obamacare that’s really hurting us.” (If Price didn’t get those votes, Trump told the scouts, he’d fire the secretary.) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/186 "2017-07-27T23:04:01Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > [The head of the BSA apologizes and clarifies.](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/boy-scouts-trump-apology_us_597a28b3e4b02a4ebb73ea20?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009) > _Much_ better. The fact that the head of the Boy Scouts feels compelled to apologize for a speech by the President of the United States is completely surreal. But so is everything else that’s happened in the last eight months. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/187 "2017-07-27T23:10:54Z")
It’s also a pretty big example of why I have trouble thinking well of anyone who continue to support him. He’s being petty to everyone, and your best excuse is “it’s not that big a deal, considering all the other horrible stuff he says and does.” That’s not a defense. We all have the period where we fall to support someone we like, but, eventually, if they keep being shitty, we do usually get over it, and realize we were wrong. I really hope the Trump supporters do so. Trust me, it feels a whole lot better once you don’t have to defend that crap and can just let go. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2017, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/188 "2017-07-27T23:54:48Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > [The head of the BSA apologizes and clarifies.](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/boy-scouts-trump-apology_us_597a28b3e4b02a4ebb73ea20?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009) > _Much_ better. > [@Colibri](#): > > The fact that the head of the Boy Scouts feels compelled to apologize for a speech by the President of the United States is completely surreal. But so is everything else that’s happened in the last eight months. He’s angling for an invitation to accompany Dick Cheney on his next hunting trip. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/189 "2017-07-28T00:26:16Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > He’s angling for an invitation to accompany Dick Cheney on his next hunting trip. Not [Junior](http://www.gocomics.com/bloom-county/2017/07/27)? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/190 "2017-07-28T04:22:48Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > What the BSA should apologize for is failing to instill the qualities they claim to represent. > It seems the Scouts are [full of the same howling baboons](http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2017/07/25/the_boy_scouts_loved_trump_s_speech_reminding_us_how_different_girl_scouts.html) that voted for Trump. Bear in mind that howling baboons are really loud. One howling baboon can drown out a heap of quietly appalled baboons. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/191 "2017-07-28T04:32:26Z")
I would feel worse about this if the BSA hadn’t been politicizing homosexuality and atheism for decades. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/192 "2017-07-28T07:44:47Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I’m sure that if Obama had addressed a bunch of schoolchildren halfway through his first year in office and had included anything even vaguely political in his speech, **Clothahump** and other conservatives would have rightly considered it to be “much ado about nothing” and would not have completely lost their shit about it [oh wait, they totally fucking did](http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-obamas-school-speech-controversy/story?id=8506095). And that speech was about the least objectionable thing imaginable. Not “fucking supermodels on a yacht”, not even “we need this policy”, just “stay in school, kids!” ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/193 "2017-07-28T08:56:02Z")
\*\*This \*\*is the apology the National BSA should have made. As it’s a public statement I’ll quote the whole thing: > [@Marc Ryan](#): > > Friends, Neighbors, Fellow Scouters, Fellow Parents, > > Today, as I’m sure you can imagine, has been a difficult day. But, it’s been the type of day that brings in to clear focus why we do the work that we do. In between meetings and our efforts to move Scouting forward here at the local level, I reflected on the news coming out of the National Jamboree and tried to figure out what I could say on behalf of our council as well as from me personally that could encapsulate how I and many of you who have reached out to me feel. > > As I am closing out this day’s work, I can come up with only one thing and it’s the one thing that no one else seems to want to say. I am sorry. Truly sorry. > > Scouting is a platform for young people to observe and learn about civics, but it is not a platform for politicized messages. To use Scouting for that purpose is poor judgement and inappropriate behavior and runs counter to many, if not all, of the points in the Scout Law and tenants of the Scout Oath - PERIOD. > > Before I go further, let me address a few facts to hopefully dispel any misconceptions. > > Fact: Since its inception in 1910, each sitting U.S. President has served as the Boy Scouts of America’s honorary president. It is a long-standing tradition for the Boy Scouts of America to invite the U.S. President to attend the National Jamboree. Seven of the eleven U.S. Presidents who were in office at the time of the National Jamboree attended the event in person to address the largest gathering of Scouts in the country. > > Fact: The Boy Scouts of America is wholly non-partisan and does not favor the interests of one political candidate or party over another. We do not promote any one position, product, service, political candidate or philosophy. > > Fact: The president had prepared remarks. They, like presidents before him, focused on patriotism, leadership and citizenship. Here are a few excerpts: > > “The United States has no better citizens than its Boy Scouts. The values, traditions, and skills you learn here will serve you throughout your lives, and just as importantly they will serve your families, your cities, and in the future and in the present, will serve your country. The Scouts believe in putting America first.” > > “When natural disaster strikes, when people face hardship, when the beauty and glory of our outdoor spaces must be restored and taken care of, America turns to the Boy Scouts because we know that the Boy Scouts never, ever, ever let us down.” > > Unfortunately, despite a well written speech designed to inspire the thousands of Scouts and Scouters in attendance, the sharing of extemporaneous thoughts and ideas cast a shadow over an event many years in the making. By many accounts, including those of our local leaders and scouts in attendance, it has been otherwise incredibly successful. But, it has also damaged our credibility with many of those who rightfully look to Scouting to teach our young people lessons that will help them be successful and to understand the simple differences between right and wrong. > > I am sorry that this happened. > > I am sorry that we have come to a place where we are unable to trust that the patriotic remarks might not be delivered in the way they were written. > > I am sorry that ANY (even if had been only one) Scouts acted in an un-scout-like manner by displaying any kind of disrespect to others through their actions and/or reactions. > > I am sorry that we shook your faith in what we stand for. > > Dr. Robert Gates, former Secretary of Defense and former Director of the FBI, as well as past president of the BSA, once said “we must address the world as it is and not how we wish it was”. For some, this instance has caused them to question this movement and whether they can or should continue to support it with their time, talents and treasure. I will tell you that it has reminded me that our work is more important than ever. > > In fact, it has reminded me that how we react to the circumstances we encounter is precisely what this movement has sought to instill in each of us since the first day we chose to become part of it. > > For those of us in the Lake Erie Council, how we react to this moment, to this challenge to the very ideals of Scouting, matters. Remember that our goal is not to simply build a bigger council, but a new and more relevant organization that focuses on the positive impact we can and should have on our communities every day by providing solutions and service; and by helping to improve the lives of young people. We are focused on putting our youth and our units at the center and focusing on their success. > > We have a significant amount of work to do to achieve our goals. And I truly understand the frustration and the sense of mistrust an incident like this can create. But I humbly ask - please stay with us. Let’s continue to work together. Young people are counting on us and they deserve the opportunity to benefit from what this movement does when it does it well. > > God bless each of you. > Yours in service to youth and communities, > Marc Ryan > Eagle Scout, Father, Scout Executive You, Mr. Ryan, are a class act and a credit to the Scouts. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/194 "2017-07-28T17:21:28Z")
Ryan’s words should have been the official response. Trump is what he is, what he has always been. He has no interest in limiting or filtering or controlling a single thing about himself. The world revolves around him, him alone, and to hell with everyone else. Everything and everyone exists only to serve him and then be discarded. The BSA should have known it. While it has been tradition to invite the president, they should have known what was about to happen. It could not possibly have gone down any other way. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2017, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/195 "2017-07-28T18:00:43Z")
Astorian wrote: “Originally Posted by BobLibDem There will be a national crisis, terror attack, false flag, Reichstag fire, or something. The panic drums will be pounding and the Constitution “temporarily” suspended. I realize it may sound cuckoo, but it is impossible to overestimate the utter evil of this creature. MAY sound cuckoo?” The question isn’t “Are you paranoid?” The question is “Are you paranoid _enough_?” ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2017, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/196 "2017-07-29T13:57:46Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > I would feel worse about this if the BSA hadn’t been politicizing homosexuality and atheism for decades. Wait… you think the SCOUTS politicized those things? They had a set of values for decades and hardly ever spoke about them publicly. I know that, when I was in the Scouts in the 1970s, nobody ever talked about atheism or homosexuality. Those things didn’t become issues for the Scouts until liberals started attacking their values and demanding that they embrace gays and atheists. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2017, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/197 "2017-07-29T14:26:31Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Wait… you think the SCOUTS politicized those things? > > They had a set of values for decades and hardly ever spoke about them publicly. I know that, when I was in the Scouts in the 1970s, nobody ever talked about atheism or homosexuality. Those things didn’t become issues for the Scouts until liberals started attacking their values and demanding that they embrace gays and atheists. Everything was okey dokey until them outsiders stuck their noses where they didn’t belong. Just like the War Of Northern Aggression, right? ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2017, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/198 "2017-07-29T15:24:27Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > It’s pretty trivial compared to how the Republicans are turning the US into an autocracy that serves Russia, but it does serve as a reminder that Trump is an awful person as well as an inept leader. There is a pattern that has emerged. Every fucked up thing he does is “well that’s just that one thing”. Every fucking time! He sold us out to Russia. That’s just one thing. He gave top intel that Israel trusted us with, to Russia. t’s just one thing. He keeps trying to remove the sanctions against Putin (I didn’t say Russia because the sanctions affect Putin directly in HIS wallet). That’s just one thing. He has a mind blowing list of conflicts of interest and emoluments issues. That’s just one thing. During the campaign he called for “second amendment solution” and offered to pay legal fess(right, he never pays for shit) if his people start beating the shit out of anyone he doesn’t like. That’s just one thing. He keeps appointing more Nazis and Russia stooges. That’s just one thing. He’s an admitted pussy grabber. That’s just one thing. **It’s always “just one thing”.** ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2017, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/199 "2017-07-29T15:39:35Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Wait… you think the SCOUTS politicized those things? > > They had a set of values for decades and hardly ever spoke about them publicly. I know that, when I was in the Scouts in the 1970s, nobody ever talked about atheism or homosexuality. Those things didn’t become issues for the Scouts until liberals started attacking their values and demanding that they embrace gays and atheists. Woolworth’s had a set of values for decades and hardly ever spoke about them publicly… ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2017, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080/200 "2017-07-29T17:08:19Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Wait… you think the SCOUTS politicized those things? > > They had a set of values for decades and hardly ever spoke about them publicly. I know that, when I was in the Scouts in the 1970s, nobody ever talked about atheism or homosexuality. Those things didn’t become issues for the Scouts until liberals started attacking their values and demanding that they embrace gays and atheists. So, by your definition, something is political if it challenges the status quo, but not if it maintains the status quo? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump-vs-the-boy-scouts-much-ado-about-nothing-or-an-embarrassing-mess/792080.md?page=11)