# Trump... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 10, 2019, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002 "2019-09-10T19:55:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![cmosdes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@cmosdes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmosdes)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/41 "2019-09-11T15:58:20Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > The OP is bordering on histrionic Please elaborate. ---
**Author:** ![Annoyed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f04885/32.png) [@Annoyed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annoyed)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/42 "2019-09-11T16:13:04Z")
Trump is gonna win again and it’ll be no ones fault but the oppositions. The left needs votes from independents and fence sitters but all they do is vilify, throw shit, isolate themselves, and fall off the left side of the political map. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/43 "2019-09-11T17:02:50Z")
> [@Annoyed](#): > > Trump is gonna win again and it’ll be no ones fault but the oppositions. > > The left needs votes from independents and fence sitters but all they do is vilify, throw shit, isolate themselves, and fall off the left side of the political map. Sounds like both a convenient and inaccurate excuse to absolve Trump voters. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/44 "2019-09-11T21:05:29Z")
> [@cmosdes](#): > > Bolding mine. He is winning. How else do you define victory? Actually accomplishing something by your own efforts. A chimpanzee could do as well or better than him, and I wouldn’t credit a chimp with “victory” if people made it President. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/45 "2019-09-11T21:38:43Z")
> [@Annoyed](#): > > Trump is gonna win again and it’ll be no ones fault but the oppositions. > > The left needs votes from independents and fence sitters but all they do is vilify, throw shit, isolate themselves, and fall off the left side of the political map. “The left of the political map” being defined as “anyone who does not think that dirty immigrants should be locked up in cages” ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/46 "2019-09-11T21:49:03Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > I agrew with the OP. In the end, Trump is only concerned for himself. He knows he can cry and spittle like a baby and his supporters will overlook it. Anyone in a position to tell him “no” gets thrown under not just a bus, but a whole fleet. > > After his reign is over, he’ll still enjoy the benefits of his notoriety. All his shady legal situations will have been defanged by his and Mitch’s policies, and he can rely on the snail-paced speed of government to not be able change them back until he’s long past dead and buried. He’ll make zillions from endorsements, speaking rallies, more autobiographies, and foreign investors who previously had to contend with legal barriers. > > Trump is winning for himself, not the US. We’re just a means to an end. That’s all that matters to him. It doesn’t matter how incompetent he is as president, and he knows it. If he can’t find enough toadies to help him get away with murder, he’ll “I didn’t know them that well” them out of his way and find somebody else. Or, alternatively, jail. I’m pretty sure that about 99% of the reason he keeps talking about third, fourth and fifth terms in this job _he doesn’t like_ is because one of the few things he fully understands is that the sharks are circling him and the presidency is his shark cage. Once he’s out of it, he’s dead meat. > [@Dinsdale](#): > > Yeah, the OP definitely has a point. As best I can tell, Trump is ALL about self promotion and ego gratification, combined with material greed. With respect to the first 2, it is hard to imagine how one could be more successful than to become president of the US, driving daily news reporting and water cooler discussions with tweets from his shitter. The extent to which he has financially succeeded will have to be judged later. I HOPE there are prosecutions when he is out of office which seriously harm his and his family’s portfolio, but I’m not holding my breath. I’d imagine he will live out his years being feted by the same mouthbreathers who attend his rallies. All the while enjoying the security, benefits, and advantages of an ex-president. For getting everything he wants, he’s reported as being _furious_, like, all the time. He’s all about ego gratification and the presidency doesn’t give him that - he’s constantly aware that most of the population and all the world leaders think he’s a piece of shitty toilet paper stuck to America’s shoe. He’s _constantly_ lashing out at the people who don’t suck up to him. His happiest times appear to be when he’s campaigning, before mostly-empty high-school gymnasiums with tiny crowds that genuinely adore him. But when he has to be president it’s nothing but grief. > [@cmosdes](#): > > Bolding mine. He is winning. How else do you define victory? Handed to him or not, rewarded out of luck or because of others, he is the one sitting in the presidency and is untouchable. You might say he didn’t earn it, but that doesn’t change the result. He’s an unhappy, scared little man. I’m winning _way_ more than that, sheerly on the basis that I’m _satisfied_ with most parts of my life. ---
**Author:** ![cmosdes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@cmosdes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmosdes)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/47 "2019-09-11T22:23:56Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Actually accomplishing something by your own efforts. A chimpanzee could do as well or better than him, and I wouldn’t credit a chimp with “victory” if people made it President. Huh. When was the last chimp you met that lived the lifestyle of a billionaire? One that owned multiple luxury resorts? One that was elected president? People have never made a chimp President. They never will. Your definition is absurd. You are exactly the type that I’m railing against. You are refusing to acknowledge that Trump has gotten himself into a very, very successful position. As wrong as that is, to continue to deny he made it there is dumb because it likely means he will continue to succeed due to people continue to under estimate him. You can rail all you want to say he was just plain lucky and fortunate and hope his luck runs out, but he continues to do what he wants when he wants. Bury your head in the sand, plug your ears and say, “la la la la la” all you want. He got there. He needs to be gone and waiting for him to screw it up himself is seeming to be less and less likely. ---
**Author:** ![cmosdes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@cmosdes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmosdes)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/48 "2019-09-11T22:33:42Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > He’s an unhappy, scared little man. I’m winning _way_ more than that, sheerly on the basis that I’m _satisfied_ with most parts of my life. I’m not so sure he is as dissatisfied as you outlined, but if he is, sure, you are ahead of him under a different definition of winning. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/49 "2019-09-11T22:34:46Z")
> [@cmosdes](#): > > Huh. When was the last chimp you met that lived the lifestyle of a billionaire? One that owned multiple luxury resorts? One that was elected president? Actually 100% of chimps who are sons of multimillionaires end up living lives of luxury. And, by sheer chance, all of them have also been elected president! Human sons of multimillionaires don’t do as well as chimp sons of multimillionaires, sadly. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/50 "2019-09-11T22:37:04Z")
Trump got there exactly because he understood his electorate and appealed to it in the right way through a series of calculated steps and statements. He remains there because he made deals with key people whose position would otherwise be able to facilitate his removal from office–and those deals were made before they were needed. That takes insight and planning, and as such a desired result = win. Trump amazes me with his skills and foresight, and his ability to constantly play the buffoon nevertheless. The son of a bitch is a master of misdirection and should be studied. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/51 "2019-09-11T22:43:04Z")
> [@Annoyed](#): > > Trump is gonna win again and it’ll be no ones fault but the oppositions. > > The left needs votes from independents and fence sitters but all they do is vilify, throw shit, isolate themselves, and fall off the left side of the political map. But they need _those_ votes, too. Democrats need the votes of every who has ever voted Democratic and some folks who never have. Because they need not just more votes but QED:2000+2016, they need _more_ more votes. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/52 "2019-09-11T22:43:09Z")
> [@cmosdes](#): > > I’m not so sure he is as dissatisfied as you outlined, but if he is, sure, you are ahead of him under a different definition of winning. Trump has made it pretty clear that he doesn’t like the white house (not enough gold plating), and he most certainly doesn’t like doing the job. And sure he gets to spend most of his time watching TV and golfing, but can you credibly say he wasn’t doing that already? I get the distinct impression he considers the presidency a step _down_ from where he was prior to being elected, in pretty much every material way. And that’s before you get into the increased legal scrutiny that being president has gotten him. You may think that being president is the height of success, but I think he _doesn’t_. He claims otherwise because admitting failure or fault makes his neurotic little brain break, and he’ll cling to the office to his last breath because however much of a step down it was, where he’s going after will almost certainly be far worse - four walls and a cot, or six walls and a pillow. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/53 "2019-09-11T23:38:40Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > Trump got there exactly because he understood his electorate and appealed to it in the right way through a series of calculated steps and statements. … That ain’t how he got there. He got there by throwing random idiocy, hustler con man grand promises and racist vulgarity at the wall. Seeing what stuck, he doubled down on that. He ain’t a fucking strategist, he’s a salesman. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2019, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/54 "2019-09-11T23:47:34Z")
> [@cmosdes](#): > > Huh. When was the last chimp you met that lived the lifestyle of a billionaire? One that owned multiple luxury resorts? One that was elected president? > > People have never made a chimp President. Because there’s never been a chimp in Trump’s position. > [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > Trump got there exactly because he understood his electorate and appealed to it in the right way through a series of calculated steps and statements. No, he got to be President because the Republicans spent decades propagandizing their base into idolizing bigotry, cruelty, stupidity and arrogance; Trump just exemplifies more that more than the people they intended to take advantage of it. He doesn’t make calculated statements, he emits verbal white noise his followers interpret to mean what they like. He accidentally stepped into the hole they carved into themselves and rode the machine they made to victory. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2019, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/55 "2019-09-12T00:53:56Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > …The son of a bitch is a master of misdirection and should be studied. I agree completely, as long as we bring back anesthesia-fee vivisection. ---
**Author:** ![Annoyed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f04885/32.png) [@Annoyed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annoyed)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2019, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/56 "2019-09-12T01:16:36Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Sounds like both a convenient and inaccurate excuse to absolve Trump voters. Absolve? The electorate has the right to vote in any way they choose, if your party lost its your own fault, not the people. > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > “The left of the political map” being defined as “anyone who does not think that dirty immigrants should be locked up in cages” You mean illegal immigrants, and detention centers. You know, like every other country on the plant does when someone illegally crosses the border. But again this just reflects my original point. Statements like these are so far to the left they almost fall of the map, and are very unpopular with the electorate, yet your party insists on putting them front and center, giving trump all the ammunition he needs. Or, for every illegal immigrant that illegally crosses the border, Trump should import 3 impoverished right wing Polish/South African/Ukrainian patriots to offset the future electorate impact. Fair is fair. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2019, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/57 "2019-09-12T01:20:59Z")
> [@Annoyed](#): > > You mean illegal immigrants, and detention centers. You know, like every other country on the plant does when someone illegally crosses the border. ?Really? Every other country separates children from their parents, and then locks the kids up? I must admit, I did not know this. Astounding. I guess Canada is so far to the left that it falls off the map. If your idea of “far left” is “don’t lock children up in cages for crossing a border” then it’s hard for me to figure out the political spectrum, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2019, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/58 "2019-09-12T01:24:26Z")
> [@cmosdes](#): > > Huh. When was the last chimp you met that lived the lifestyle of a billionaire? One that owned multiple luxury resorts? One that was elected president? > > People have never made a chimp President. They never will. Your definition is absurd. You are exactly the type that I’m railing against. You are refusing to acknowledge that Trump has gotten himself into a very, very successful position. As wrong as that is, to continue to deny he made it there is dumb because it likely means he will continue to succeed due to people continue to under estimate him. You can rail all you want to say he was just plain lucky and fortunate and hope his luck runs out, but he continues to do what he wants when he wants. > > Bury your head in the sand, plug your ears and say, “la la la la la” all you want. He got there. He needs to be gone and waiting for him to screw it up himself is seeming to be less and less likely. Personally, I view this not so much as Trump’s accomplishment, but as America’s failure. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2019, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/59 "2019-09-12T01:29:43Z")
> [@Annoyed](#): > > Absolve? The electorate has the right to vote in any way they choose, if your party lost its your own fault, not the people. Make up your mind, either votes represent the will of the people casting them or are the result of conditioned response to salesmanship. If the electorate has the right, they should also accept the responsibility and if need be, the scorn and blame. If they don’t like it, well… tough shit, fuckfaces. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2019, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002/60 "2019-09-12T01:33:55Z")
Odd thing, though, is that the “will of the people” in the 2016 election was for the other candidate, not the clown who got voted in by the EC. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trump/840002.md?page=4)