# Trump's ban on transgender individuals in the military **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 26, 2017, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159 "2017-07-26T14:09:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/401 "2017-08-01T12:19:20Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Trump is deranged, but so is your fear of a fragment of a tweet starting a war in the course of 10 minutes. Your concern is ludicrous, silly, and unfounded. On the contrary; there are reports that the Pentagon leadership was on Orange Alert for a few minutes between the first tweet and the second. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/402 "2017-08-01T12:30:27Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > But – but it pleased his base! Surely that makes the fact we’ve got a complete loon and a man-child egging each other on insignificant. What’s really disturbing is that both descriptions apply equally to Trump and Kim. Who would’ve thought that we’d be in a situation where the hand-basket to Hell is actually the up elevator? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/403 "2017-08-01T13:58:06Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > Surely that makes the fact we’ve got a complete loon and a man-child egging each other on insignificant. Wait - which one is which? ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/404 "2017-08-01T14:06:18Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Wait - which one is which? Does it matter? “No question now what has happened to the faces of the pigs. The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again: but already it was impossible to say which was which.” ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/405 "2017-08-01T14:56:53Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > On the contrary; there are reports that the Pentagon leadership was on Orange Alert for a few minutes between the first tweet and the second. The Pentagon thought a Trump might be about to declare a war. That’s a far, far cry from a war _accidentally_ starting because of an incomplete a tweet. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/406 "2017-08-01T15:36:32Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > The Pentagon thought a Trump might be about to declare a war. That’s a far, far cry from a war _accidentally_ starting because of an incomplete a tweet. Yeah, but what happens when north korea thinks we are about to start a war? Think that they will wait until official orders come down? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/407 "2017-08-01T16:04:00Z")
It’s like that time that German girl let all those red balloons go. That didn’t end well. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2017, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/408 "2017-08-03T22:29:47Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > On the contrary; there are reports that the Pentagon leadership was on Orange Alert for a few minutes between the first tweet and the second. Orange. Ironic, isn’t it. The Pentagon, and the military in its entirety, take this very seriously. They can’t afford to just blow it off and get it wrong. Throughout history, wars have been started for less. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2017, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/409 "2017-08-03T22:32:55Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > It’s like that time that German girl let all those red balloons go. That didn’t end well. Sure did, all neun und neunzig of them. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2017, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/410 "2017-08-04T02:10:05Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Yeah, but what happens when north korea thinks we are about to start a war? > > Think that they will wait until official orders come down? I think worrying that North Korea would initiate hostilities over that first Tweet Trump sent is only marginally less stupid than thinking the US military would do it. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2017, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/411 "2017-08-04T03:20:13Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Orange. Ironic, isn’t it. > > The Pentagon, and the military in its entirety, take this very seriously. They can’t afford to just blow it off and get it wrong. Throughout history, wars have been started for less. I think you will find that for the most part of history, there’s not a lot of things less than a tweet that leaves you hanging. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2017, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/412 "2017-10-30T17:54:54Z")
MEANWHILE, Back At The Ranch - A federal judge just blocked Trump’s order on transgender people in the military, on the grounds that Donald’s reasons for the order “do not appear to be supported by any facts.” See here, for a brief article about it (this all just happened while we were admiring Robert Mueller’s footwork): > **[Federal Judge Blocks Enforcement Of Trump's Transgender Military Ban](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-transgender-military-ban-blocked_n_59f7572ce4b0aec146792e00?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009)** > > Trump’s reasons for the controversial ban "donot appear to be supported by any facts,” the judge found. And here, for Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly’s decision > **[10-30-17-Doe-v-Trump-Order.pdf](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/4163521/10-30-17-Doe-v-Trump-Order.pdf)** > > 24.66 KB ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2017, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/413 "2017-10-30T19:19:11Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > MEANWHILE, Back At The Ranch - > > A federal judge just blocked Trump’s order on transgender people in the military, on the grounds that Donald’s reasons for the order “do not appear to be supported by any facts.” > > See here, for a brief article about it (this all just happened while we were admiring Robert Mueller’s footwork): > > [Federal Judge Blocks Enforcement Of Trump's Transgender Military Ban | HuffPost Latest News](https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-transgender-military-ban-blocked_us_59f7572ce4b0aec146792e00?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009) > And here, for Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly’s decision > > [https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/4163521/10-30-17-Doe-v-Trump-Order.pdf](https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/4163521/10-30-17-Doe-v-Trump-Order.pdf) Not a good day for Trump. Which means it’s a wonderful day for the rest of us! ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2017, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/414 "2017-10-30T23:46:44Z")
We haven’t seen the Twitterstormer-in-chief respond yet. I’m about 60% certain he will refuse to acknowledge the news, and 40% certain he’ll combine a tweet decrying the decision with one about “distracting us from Hillary’s crimes against humanity.” ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2017, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/415 "2017-10-31T00:30:34Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > I’m about 60% certain he will refuse to acknowledge the news, and 40% certain he’ll combine a tweet decrying the decision with one about “distracting us from Hillary’s crimes against humanity.” But that doesn’t leave a percentage for casting aspersions on the judge’s ethnicity or gender. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2017, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/416 "2017-10-31T10:29:29Z")
While I’m thrilled that the ban has been blocked, is a “failure to be supported by facts” sufficient grounds for a judicial action? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2017, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/417 "2017-10-31T10:51:48Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > While I’m thrilled that the ban has been blocked, is a “failure to be supported by facts” sufficient grounds for a judicial action? With you on both accounts. So his justification for this nonsense is and always was BS – but is the CinC really legally impeded from issuing stupid orders based on BS justifications? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2017, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/418 "2017-10-31T12:27:38Z")
If they’re discriminatory against a protected class, including sexual orientation and gender identity, they need a rational basis. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2017, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/419 "2017-10-31T15:54:00Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > If they’re discriminatory against a protected class, including sexual orientation and gender identity, they need a rational basis. At the Federal Level neither of those is explicitly a “protected class,” although there is numerous and growing court precedent that discrimination against gender identity and gender expression, as well as transgender persons like myself, is in fact sex discrimination. The current Administration has challenged and denies that transgender persons are covered under sex discrimination, and they may very well lose (unless Trump is allowed to pack the USSC with more people of his ilk). ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2017, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159/420 "2017-10-31T16:44:18Z")
Maybe it’s time to challenge the notion that “not having explicitly being declared an unacceptable reason for discriminate automatically makes something a valid reason to discriminate.” That laundry list of protected classes was supposed to be a benefit, making it easier for people in one of them to get defense, but it gets treated as if it was an excuse for anything not listed there. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-the-military/792159.md?page=22)