# Trump's disgusting shakedown of Zelensky **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [February 28, 2025, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940 "2025-02-28T19:52:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/261 "2025-03-02T01:39:11Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > That’s my point. And that is _exactly_ what Broomstick was saying – I’m not sure why you were disagreeing with her. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/262 "2025-03-02T01:41:20Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > And that is _exactly_ what Broomstick was saying – I’m not sure why you were disagreeing with her. I missed the part where it was said that the defense of NATO was also a guideline while the point was being made that the expenditures were a guideline. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/263 "2025-03-02T01:42:07Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > MAGAts don’t do logic. Or facts. 🤯 The do “alternative facts”, or as normal people refer to them, bald-assed lies. Whatever happened to [Kellyanne Conway](https://youtu.be/sb9ybImGwkU?si=SJTTxdLi51dCMW6Y), anyway? Stranger ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/264 "2025-03-02T01:46:03Z")
By the way … that particular ambiguity is brought to you buy The Good Folks at the US of A: > **[Willfully Vague: Why NATO’s Article 5 Is So Misunderstood](https://cepa.org/article/willfully-vague-why-natos-article-5-is-so-misunderstood/)** > > Confusion over NATO’s key Article 5 on collective defense predates the alliance itself and still continues. ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/265 "2025-03-02T01:52:27Z")
She’s on FOX of course. Highlighting how great Trumps 2017 taxcuts helped everyday Americans. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVoP0CW4kNE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVoP0CW4kNE) ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/266 "2025-03-02T01:56:56Z")
If you view everything through a monetary lens, as Trump might, he likely sees Ukraine as a European problem and NATO as a money suck. Of course, Trump has greatly pandered to Putin since taking office. My opinion is this display was staged, and was meant to embolden Putin. But if Europe decides it must spend more money to help Ukraine and/or NATO, Trump will likely see that as a win. Extorting mineral moneys or rebuilding rights was gravy, but pleasing Putin seemed to be as important. After all, signed deals mean little to Trump as his tariff discussions have shown. Naturally, things like goodwill, trust, democracy, humanitarian issues, investment in the US, the stability of the greenback as a reserve currency, intelligence, security, law and political issues matter greatly. But it is not clear if Trump and his associates prioritize all or any of these issues. Most Canadians think the country should spend more on its military. It is unable to attract recruits because of low pay. Canada insists on playing politics and using multiple local firms on big procurement contracts, with changing specifications that inevitably result in enormous delays and cost overruns and use limitations. Canada would often be better off buying new equipment from other countries, but that provides less political pork. ---
**Author:** ![natureboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/4491bb/32.png) [@natureboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/natureboy)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/267 "2025-03-02T02:30:14Z")
Contrarian opinion, but I am glad Rubio exists. I know he looked like Fredo Corleone on camera, but I think he’s actually maybe one of the few ‘adults’ (young adults) left in the room. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanubv.2/32/3260_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/268 "2025-03-02T03:16:44Z")
How so? I may have agreed(ish) two months ago, but today he’s just another sycophant, who thought the ass kissing paid off with his shiny new position, but now knows he’s no higher in his boss’s opinion than any of the other toadies. Or at least that what it looks like to me. If there truly is a reason to believe he may prove to be normal, I honestly, non-snarkily would like to hear your thoughts. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/269 "2025-03-02T03:22:09Z")
> **[https://preview.redd.it/c9uuvri8k3me1.png?auto=webp&s=b8a1e92589a752c5275242...](https://preview.redd.it/c9uuvri8k3me1.png?auto=webp&s=b8a1e92589a752c5275242e994b70c662d9c1e99)** ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/270 "2025-03-02T05:10:34Z")
I’m seriously concerned that now Trump will intervene on the side of Russia. Russia is pretty spent, it’s no guarantee that they can easily conquer Ukraine if Europe can step up enough fast enough, though it is still likely that they’d win within a few months if US completely abandons Ukraine. Still, Trump abandoning Ukraine and Europe picking up the slack will look pretty bad for the US and won’t please Putin. Actual US boots on the ground are unlikely but possible. Military support like AWACs and even airstrikes? Probably not, but I wouldn’t rule them out. That would be absolutely evil. But intelligence? Probably. The US military has been coordinating with Ukraine and our intelligence and guidance is a huge factor for why Ukraine has been able to out-fight Russia. Just removing those things is extremely detrimental to Ukraine’s cause, but if the US betrays Ukraine and sends Russia all of the locations of their weak points, intel about their units, etc. that would be devastating to Ukraine, and because that can be done in secret (I would hope someone would be brave enough to leak it) it seems like a likely route to assist Russia. I just don’t feel like the US leaving Ukraine out to dry is enough for Putin/Trump. It would probably work but it’s no guarantee. I think actively backstabbing Ukraine to make sure they lose decisively is probably more likely than not at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Ellie\_Williams](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellie_williams/32/17989_2.png) [@Ellie\_Williams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellie_Williams)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/271 "2025-03-02T07:23:33Z")
As a Ukrainian-Canadian, with a Ukrainian coworker deployed on the front that I only get to message every 2-3 weeks to see if he’s alive, this entire encounter made my blood boil. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/272 "2025-03-02T09:16:31Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I just don’t feel like the US leaving Ukraine out to dry is enough for Putin/Trump Of course it’s not. Trump wants to utterly crush Zelenskyy for daring to defy him. That would, of course, include destroying everything Zelenskyy cares about… including his entire country. It’s about revenge (as well as anything else he might get). ---
**Author:** ![natureboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/4491bb/32.png) [@natureboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/natureboy)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 10:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/273 "2025-03-02T10:24:03Z")
He’s not going to challenge MAGA-DOGE publicly. Once they’ve made their decision to do whatever circus act shit they’re going to pull, he’ll carry their water, the same way Colin Powell did for Bush-Cheney. But once in a while, behind closed doors, he might be able to talk them out of some of the bigger blunders. I’m not saying Rubio is going to be particularly effective. But he’s actually one of the very few in the administration who is fundamentally competent in his role. And for now, I think he’s interested in trying to do his job, even if that’s not obvious in front of the camera. I do suspect that Rubio will grow weary of this, though. ---
**Author:** ![natureboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/4491bb/32.png) [@natureboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/natureboy)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/274 "2025-03-02T10:32:35Z")
I could be wrong, but I never got the sense Russia wanted to occupy the whole of Ukraine for long. There would be a real fierce insurgency, which Russia would probably do best to avoid, particularly if they’re interested in recovering from this conflict. Russia wants influence over Ukraine’s politics. Over time, they will seek greater influence over European politics, which won’t necessarily require invasions, but it will almost certainly involve other forms of strong-arming and manipulation - maybe the threat of invasion or nuclear destruction. For purely practical reasons, I could actually see Europe and Russia going through a bit of a diplomatic thaw (to the extent that’s possible). Europe and China as well. Both will be the consequence of an unstable United States. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/275 "2025-03-02T12:15:04Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Actual US boots on the ground are unlikely but possible. Military support like AWACs and even airstrikes? Probably not, but I wouldn’t rule them out. That would be absolutely evil. > > But intelligence? Probably. Yep. And of course step 1 towards that was dismantling the russian counter-intelligence ops as happened this week. I think I said upthread that the “five eyes” intelligence sharing agreement between the 5 Anglosphere countries **must not** share intelligence on Russia with the US. Absolutely can’t be trusted right now. I think they’ll be a time very soon where there are reports of apparently American-made munitions being used in Russia and MAGA will be saying “fake news” and “russia russia russia” again. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/276 "2025-03-02T12:56:49Z")
The thing that has stuck with me is the repeated demands for thanks and respect. People who find themselves demanding respect and thanks have to do that for a reason, and the reason is that there is no natural cause for it to happen on its own. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/277 "2025-03-02T13:11:46Z")
So well said! ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/278 "2025-03-02T14:31:08Z")
Rubio is indeed the only sane and competent person in the cabinet. How many times can he stand to defend the indefensible? This game is going to get old for him quickly. But he knows if he leaves, a brain-dead sycophant will replace him. But what is the point of being the only sane person in the room if nobody listens to you? Why was he even at the meeting? He sunk himself so deep in the couch that Vance wanted to bang him. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/279 "2025-03-02T14:47:20Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > The thing that has stuck with me is the repeated demands for thanks and respect. Pretty much anytime I’m interacting with anyone outside of immediate family and closest friends, my overwhelming desire is that they DO something, not that they SAY something specific or BEHAVE in a certain way. Say I’m dealing with a store clerk, a customer service person on the phone, a boss or cow-orker, or an attorney (as I often do at work.). I really couldn’t care less about the pleasantries, excuses for non-performance, apologies, flowery language, expressions such as “with all due respect”… Just do your fucking job, hold up your end, ACT in a predictable and competent manner. Once we’ve gotten past the point where we are both doing our parts, THEN we can worry about whether every verbal nicety is expressed appropriately. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2025, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/280 "2025-03-02T15:24:25Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I’m seriously concerned that now Trump will intervene on the side of Russia. Russia is pretty spent, it’s no guarantee that they can easily conquer Ukraine if Europe can step up enough fast enough, though it is still likely that they’d win within a few months if US completely abandons Ukraine. Still, Trump abandoning Ukraine and Europe picking up the slack will look pretty bad for the US and won’t please Putin. There are two competing things at play here. One is that Trump serves Putin. The other, though, is that Trump is legitimately obsessed with winning a Nobel Peace Prize. Finding a way to end the war peacefully, in his head, would cause him to win that. Hey, it worked for Teddy Roosevelt, right? That’s why he makes the “proposals” he does. He just wants to the war to stop, but in so doing, Putin must effectively win. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940.md?page=15)