# Trump's disgusting shakedown of Zelensky **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [February 28, 2025, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940 "2025-02-28T19:52:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/61 "2025-02-28T22:20:49Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > However, the European contingent could simultaneously all withdraw from NATO and announce a new EU-based defensive military alliance that would be pretty much identical to NATO minus US & Canada. There are a half dozen or so minor nations that are in NATO but not the EU or vice versa, but nothing that would pose much of a problem for a Europe-based military alliance. I just checked my map and it clearly shows that Canada is in Europe. Sharpies are magic! ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/62 "2025-02-28T22:23:07Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > It’s like she’s just shitting all over my father’s career, and really, her father’s career as well, by placating our enemies. When the US entered World War 2, my great grandfather (he was either Russian, Ukranian, Romanian or Polish- we don’t know) kept trying to enlist. They kept turning him away because he was too old. My Mom still has a clipping from the local paper about it. I’ve spoken of my Zeyde Herman (zeyde being Yiddish for grandather often). He joined the army before the war. He wanted to learn a trade, travel the world and to be part of something bigger and grander than himself. When news about the concentration camps broke, he wanted to go figh the Nazis. They refused to reassign him because he was a chief mechanic fixing planes. He was a fantastic human being and taught me many things. In the USSR, Judaism was basically illegal. Every time we attended services, there was a prayer for the freedom of Soviet Jews. My first apartmnent was in a neighborhood filled with Jews from the former USSR. They were, seriously, thrilled to be in a country where they could vote and be openly Jewish. Trump has, to put it mildly, betrayed a whole lot Americans, the country, the Constitution and probablt some other things I am forgetting. ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/63 "2025-02-28T22:35:19Z")
I would provide a link, but The Economist gift links are one-person only. The Economist has an article up right now about the number of things in NATO that only the US can provide. Things like AWACS. The thesis of the article is that it will take many years and billions to fill the hole left by the US. In full disclosure they didn’t actually say AWACS, but the things they described sounded like that. Just in case someone comes along to tell me they have AWACS planes. You get the point. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/64 "2025-02-28T22:41:28Z")
> [@OldOlds](#): > > The thesis of the article is that it will take many years and billions to fill the hole left by the US. At the same time, many if not all of the NATO countries contributing to Ukraine’s defense have good reason to bolster their own defenses against an unreliable and increasingly hostile America. Trump wanted other NATO countries to spend more on defense, and now he’ll get his wish, but not in the way or for the reason that he wanted. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/65 "2025-02-28T22:44:05Z")
Operation Deep Shame is in full swing. There’s no doubt this was all a coordinated attack on Ukraine planned from the start. Pretty much as any reasonable person would’ve expected. > **[Exclusive: Hegseth orders Cyber Command to stand down on Russia planning](https://therecord.media/hegseth-orders-cyber-command-stand-down-russia-planning)** > > The secretary of Defense has ordered U.S. Cyber Command to stand down from all planning against Russia, including offensive digital actions, sources tell Recorded Future News. You know what’s crazy? If Ukraine had taken the 50% mineral deal, Trump still would’ve done all of this to fuck them over, but we’d hold the mineral rights in our hands anyway. They were just trying to extort a little more profit before they crushed them. ---
**Author:** ![WalterBishop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/aeb1de/32.png) [@WalterBishop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WalterBishop)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/66 "2025-02-28T22:47:28Z")
Just a thought, but has anyone suggested to Zelensky that he start a sex-trafficking ring in Romania? Y’know, since he’s having trouble getting on Trump’s good side… ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/67 "2025-02-28T22:47:30Z")
Yes, our legally elected President and the other higher ups are now giving lawful orders (follow them or go to prison) to aid a fascist dictator. Oh, goody ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/68 "2025-02-28T22:54:33Z")
Full video of the, actual, Dolchstoßlegende, [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/7pxbGjvcdyY/maxresdefault.jpg "Full Meeting between President Trump, VP Vance and Ukrainian President Zelenskyy in Oval Office") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pxbGjvcdyY) ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/69 "2025-02-28T22:54:50Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > What they might do ( and I think they should do ) is something that pisses Trump off so mightily that he throws a baby tantrum and withdraws the US from NATO - then everyone else can vote really fast to admit Ukraine. That’s not ever going to happen in the foreseeable future - I mean the Ukraine being admitted to NATO part. It’s absolutely not something the POTUS should ever be publicly acknowledging, but it’s the simple fact of the matter. Admission to NATO requires the unanimous agreement of all members. For starters Hungary and Slovakia are certainly going to veto it. As for the rest of NATO, they’re never going to vote unanimously to admit a nation that has unresolved border disputes. Even if the war were to miraculously end tomorrow, continued low intensity fighting of the kind that was happening from 2014-2022 would mean an immediate invocation of Article 5 requiring every NATO member to treat Russian attacks on Ukraine as attacks upon themselves. Providing aid to Ukraine as a non-NATO member is one thing, escalating it to WWIII is something entirely different. ---
**Author:** ![Jihi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jihi/32/17768_2.png) [@Jihi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jihi)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/70 "2025-02-28T23:03:31Z")
That was one of the most disgusting things on the stage of international politics that I have had the distinct displeasure of witnessing in real time. A perfect Venn diagram of hatred, greed, narcissism, and entitlement. The worst impulses of American psychology placed on full display. I don’t think it’s too far into hyperbole to state that Trump, either knowingly or not, is helping Putin to reconstitute something that looks like the Soviet union by blowing up NATO as we know it. That orange bastard is going to be almost single-handedly responsible for destroying the post WWII international order. I am ashamed and disgusted by this country right now and by the cancer currently in the oval office that half of us saw fit to elect. (Yes I know, technically half of the electorate didn’t vote for Trump, but you know what I mean). I weep for the future of America. What comes next? I don’t know, but it won’t be anything good. ---
**Author:** ![Frilly\_Heck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/90ced4/32.png) [@Frilly\_Heck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frilly_Heck)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/71 "2025-02-28T23:05:04Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > In the USSR, Judaism was basically illegal. Every time we attended services, there was a prayer for the freedom of Soviet Jews. > > My first apartmnent was in a neighborhood filled with Jews from the former USSR. They were, seriously, thrilled to be in a country where they could vote and be openly Jewish. > > Trump has, to put it mildly, betrayed a whole lot Americans, the country, the Constitution and probablt some other things I am forgetting. My partner is a naturalized US citizen who grew up in Ukraine during the Soviet years. He is ethnically Jewish, but not religious. He’s one of the folks you were praying over. He’s one of the best Americans I know, because he chose it for himself and takes it seriously. I am so incandescent with rage right now. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats2)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/72 "2025-02-28T23:06:48Z")
What grinds my gears is you just know that Maga types watching this will be like "YEAH!! YOU TELL 'EM!! THAT’S HOW YOU TALK TO THEM FURRINERS!! YOU GET GODDAM RESPECT LIKE THAT!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/73 "2025-02-28T23:13:22Z")
> [@Jihi](#): > > I don’t think it’s too far into hyperbole to state that Trump, either knowingly or not, is helping Putin to reconstitute something that looks like the Soviet union by blowing up NATO as we know it. Putin has never to my knowledge concealed his ambitions to start a new Soviet Union with him as dictator for life. I hadn’t really thought about the destruction of NATO. But, I am not seeing any hyperbole. > [@Dissonance](#): > > Providing aid to Ukraine as a non-NATO member is one thing, escalating it to WWIII is something entirely different. I also hadn’t considered the possibiliy of WWIII, That might actually be for the best. As long as Trump does not harm other countries too much and just concentrates on turning democracy into a fascist dicatorship, the world will not actually do anything. If the rest of the world declares war on the US, we ill eventually lose. The victors will then step in and impose a new form of government. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/74 "2025-02-28T23:16:33Z")
I wouldn’t exactly say that Trump went into this negotiation with the full intention that it must fail and break out into verbal hostilities. He’s incapable of thinking that far ahead. Rather, I’d say that he went into it holding all the cards and intending to demand major concessions from Zelinksky in return for basically nothing, which amounts to the same thing, but without the “evil plan” aspect. Hitler would do the former, Trump can only do the latter, to much the same effect. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/75 "2025-02-28T23:21:53Z")
Trump is clearly coordinating with Putin. The best thing for the world is for America to collapse quickly. There is no greater threat to humanity than the United States. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/76 "2025-02-28T23:26:27Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Full video of the, actual, Dolchstoßlegende, Except that it isn’t a myth in this case; if Trump’s tiny hands could grasp a dagger he would be actually stabbing Zelenskyy in the back. > [@DocCathode](#): > > I also hadn’t considered the possibiliy of WWIII, That might actually be for the best. It would not. What would be for “the best” is the non-MAGA Republicans in the House to locate whatever actual principles they still have, join with Democrats (who, we can hope, will also find their balls since most of them seem to be trying to hide them like Buffalo Bill), and impeach Trump, and then a similar miracle happens in the Senate to vote for conviction and removal. I’ve been watching this normalization of autocracy, erosion of civil liberties, and rise of naked fascist sentiment literally for decades (and no, it didn’t start with Trump, or even Dick Cheney and Karl Rove), and even I’m shocked at just how much the Congress, the Supreme Court, and anyone in any position to block or stall this has just rolled over like a dead armadillo in the hot sun. This is sickening. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/77 "2025-02-28T23:30:37Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > Just a thought, but has anyone suggested to Zelensky that he start a sex-trafficking ring in Romania? Y’know, since he’s having trouble getting on Trump’s good side… Ha! So many sad truths in this. Well done. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/78 "2025-02-28T23:38:04Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > What would be for “the best” is the non-MAGA Republicans in the House to locate whatever actual principles they still have, join with Democrats (who, we can hope, will also find their balls since most of them seem to be trying to hide them like Buffalo Bill), and impeach Trump, and then a similar miracle happens in the Senate to vote for conviction and removal. I don’t see any chance of that happening. The Republican party has been reshaped from a sane, even respectable groupo with principals to a group that exists to serve MAGA. They knew who Trump was when they made him their candidate last election. Without support from a significant number of Republican elected officals, I don’t know if there is anything we can do. At best, we may be able to slow the transition to fascism. ETA They were showing video of Zelensky and Trump on the news. I had to switch channels to keep from yelling at television. Besides his many other laudable qualities, Zelensky has a truly incredible amount of self restraint. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/79 "2025-02-28T23:47:24Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > I don’t see any chance of that happening. The Republican party has been reshaped,… I don’t disagree; I just don’t see a desirable outcome any other way. This situation is dire, particularly in light undermining our entire national defense and intelligence capabilities. We’re vulnerable from both within and without, and now we’ll be without allies on the global stage who will never trust the United States ever again without a demonstration that we can clean our own shop. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Coriolanus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coriolanus/32/18769_2.png) [@Coriolanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coriolanus)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940/80 "2025-02-28T23:55:23Z")
> [@Jihi](#): > > That orange bastard is going to be almost single-handedly responsible for destroying the post WWII international order. Your entire post - well said. Good that this thread was created and I’ve no idea when it can be logically concluded. The Clusterfuck - I think - will go on as long as the steroids and drugs DJT takes keeps him alive. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-disgusting-shakedown-of-zelensky/1014940.md?page=5)