# Trump's distraction du jour. Pardon convicted war criminals over Pentagon objections. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 16, 2019, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514 "2019-11-16T00:00:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/41 "2019-11-22T19:23:03Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > I made my brother laugh by saying that Trump’s strategy is to point at the sky and yell “LOOK! A UFO!”. He (my brother) now refers to everything Trump tweets and says as “the latest sighting”. My brother refers to everything Trump tweets as “the latest thing to believe”. So, consider yourself lucky! ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/42 "2019-11-22T20:59:46Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No matter how bad Trump is, or how bad what the people he’s pardomed did is, the military ignoring or overruling their democratically elected boss is many times worse. It’s a coup, basically. Well, no, as below: > [@Slash1972](#): > > From the CNN article linked in the other thread: > > Chief Navy spokesman Rear Adm. Charlie Brown told CNN, “The Navy follows the lawful orders of the President. We will do so in case of an order to stop the administrative review of SOC Gallagher’s professional qualification. We are aware of the President’s tweet and we are awaiting further guidance.” > > Because tweets are not orders. Good to know that the President may be the Commander in Chief but is still subject to following military procedures when issuing orders. Something, something rule of law. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/43 "2019-11-22T22:38:30Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Well, no, as below: > > Good to know that the President may be the Commander in Chief but is still subject to following military procedures when issuing orders. Something, something rule of law. But as with Bill Barr, give him time, and he will find someone who follows the rule of men. Give him time. Give him another 4 years and he will show you what he can do to democracy. ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2019, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/44 "2019-11-22T22:51:43Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Give him another 4 years and he will show you what he can do to democracy. You are absolutely right about that. Guess we shouldn’t give him 4 more years. We have a way to prevent that. Trump has a razor thin path to victory that requires all of the rust belt states he won in 2016. A increase in voter turnout in those states of less than 10% eliminates that, even accounting for social media rat-fucking and electoral districting shenanigans. Any and all GOTV efforts help produce that turnout. Anyone who works against those efforts, by discouragement or disparagement of those who promote the efforts, shouldn’t be given room to spread their bullshit. You with us? ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2019, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/45 "2019-11-23T19:59:08Z")
_[NYT](https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1198308544455593985)_: > [@](#): > > “The secretary of the Navy and the admiral who leads the SEALs have threatened to resign or be fired if plans to expel a commando from the elite unit in a war crimes case are halted by President Trump, administration officials said Saturday.” ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2019, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/46 "2019-11-23T20:13:31Z")
Hugh Thompson Jr. Remember him? Helicopter pilot who threatened to open fire on the soldiers committing the atrocity at My Lai, and later testified against them. Who were all either acquitted or pardoned. His life turned to shit in reward. War destroys minds and souls. Your call which is worse. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2019, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/47 "2019-11-23T22:56:45Z")
I think that this is probably just the beginning. It won’t be long before he starts claiming that there are deep state actors in the military who need to be rooted out. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/48 "2019-11-24T01:30:44Z")
I wonder what kind of options the SEALs would have if Trump says this guy must stay a SEAL? Permanent latrine duty in Thule, Greenland? An order to infiltrate a nuclear facility in North Korea all by himself? I’m sure they’ll think of something. ---
**Author:** ![romansperson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/romansperson/32/17100_2.png) [@romansperson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/romansperson)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/49 "2019-11-24T01:38:42Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > I wonder what kind of options the SEALs would have if Trump says this guy must stay a SEAL? Permanent latrine duty in Thule, Greenland? An order to infiltrate a nuclear facility in North Korea all by himself? I’m sure they’ll think of something. Yup. He’ll get the assignment with least amount of responsibility and most amount of tedium until such time as he decides to retire. And I wouldn’t be at all surprised if he decides to retire soonest. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/50 "2019-11-24T01:39:20Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > [lobster henchman]I will pinch you SO HARD![/lobster henchman] [This Guy](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BMTMzNTFlOTYtZjQwMi00MjUzLTgzZDgtYWI5N2NhMGRjNzMxXkEyXkFqcGdeQXVyNTM3MDMyMDQ@._V1_UY1200_CR485,0,630,1200_AL_.jpg)? ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/51 "2019-11-24T16:40:19Z")
Trump backs down for now, will not intervene. [Secretary of Navy says Trump’s tweet is not a formal order | AP News](https://apnews.com/fa25ecd5399b45529ece8f77ff71cfcd) ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/52 "2019-11-24T17:55:51Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > My take on this whole sordid affair is classic mob loyalty manipulation. By Trump pardoning these miscreants he is basically saying to them, “I know you are a killer who doesn’t follow the rules. I saved your ass, you owe me. So someday I will expect you to follow my bidding, wherever that takes us. Wherever that takes us.” > > He’s building his own little mobster army. He wants the military to be personally loyal to him, the Bonespur Coward. He wants it to be his own personal political tool, his own private goon squad. Never mind that there is a reason the oath is to the Constitution, NOT to any person. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/53 "2019-11-24T18:01:02Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I think that this is probably just the beginning. It won’t be long before he starts claiming that there are deep state actors in the military who need to be rooted out. I guarantee it. A guy who was a cowardly draft dodger, a guy who sells us out on an daily basis to line his own pockets, a guy who undermines national security for personal gain and to stroke his own ego, has the balls to attack the people who ARE loyal to the country, And the flag waving phonies in his base and the GOP are OK with it, ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/54 "2019-11-24T18:04:55Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > Trump backs down for now, will not intervene. > > [Secretary of Navy says Trump’s tweet is not a formal order | AP News](https://apnews.com/fa25ecd5399b45529ece8f77ff71cfcd) for NOW, but subject to repeated change at any time, for no reason at all. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/55 "2019-11-24T22:22:22Z")
[Jonathan Lemire](https://twitter.com/JonLemire/status/1198727799034597376), _AP_: > [@](#): > > WASHINGTON (AP) — Pentagon chief asks for resignation of Navy secretary in connection with SEAL controversy. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/56 "2019-11-24T22:24:51Z")
[Rebecca Ballhaus](https://twitter.com/rebeccaballhaus/status/1198727813693689858), _WSJ_: > [@](#): > > Navy Secretary Richard Spencer has resigned at the defense secretary’s request amid controversy over the Navy SEAL case. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/57 "2019-11-24T22:32:25Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > for NOW, but subject to repeated change at any time, for no reason at all. I agree - I think this is temporary…sanity? Or maybe a stopped clock that happens to be right? Whatever, I think he’ll pull something else later. He’s already destroying other agencies with conspiracy theories and the DoD won’t be any different. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/58 "2019-11-24T22:34:17Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > [Rebecca Ballhaus](https://twitter.com/rebeccaballhaus/status/1198727813693689858), _WSJ_: Well then, there you have it. Didn’t take long to prove SteveG1 and me correct. The hyper-politicization of the military is underway. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/59 "2019-11-24T22:45:19Z")
My money is that the president is getting ready to implement the 2006 reauthorization act, which essentially gave the president sweeping powers to ‘restore order’ in the event of an emergency…which could be literally anything that the WH deems serious. The president can take control of national guards in any or in all 50 states. In order to do this, however, you have to have a military leadership that understands it cannot question the president. That means getting rid of the professionals and replacing them with ambitious idiots, which the president seems to do pretty well across all of the agencies in his dominion. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2019, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514/60 "2019-11-24T23:09:38Z")
[Jake Tapper](https://twitter.com/jaketapper/status/1198739031263252487), _CNN_: > [@](#): > > Outgoing Secretary of the Navy Spencer’s resignation letter says that he “cannot in good conscience” obey an order he believes “violates the sacred oath“ he took & that he and POTUS disagree on the “key principle of good order and discipline” _[Letter attached]_ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-distraction-du-jour-pardon-convicted-war-criminals-over-pentagon-objections/843514.md?page=4)