# Trump's Executive Order on Immigration - Let it Rip Dopers **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 29, 2017, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468 "2017-01-29T01:44:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/381 "2017-01-31T04:08:00Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Shouldn’t I? Weeks and weeks of news reports and polls saying that Hillary had it in the bag, and it didn’t happen that way. How many people stayed home because it was a done deal? As has been said many times since the election, Trump won with a lower vote total than both McCain and Romney, and they got smoked. Voter apathy is absolutely a big cause of this. Trump got more votes than both of them. Hilary got more votes than anyone not named Obama. Trump had the 3rd highest ever. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/382 "2017-01-31T04:08:31Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > But this is the government we wanted, and the government we deserve. In the immortal words of Tonto, “What do you mean, ‘we’?” ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/383 "2017-01-31T04:09:47Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > :dubious: Cite? AFAIK, there were few if any polls claiming that Clinton’s lead was well outside the margin of error. Pretty much everyone other than Nate Silver had Clinton as a huge favorite. Sam Wang said he’d eat a bug if Trump won. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/384 "2017-01-31T04:13:44Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > Tell me, how many legal residents were detained, contrary to court order, at the airports? How many were denied legal representation? How many children were separated from their parents? Cmon I want hard figures. With cites. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/385 "2017-01-31T04:17:13Z")
> [@arfurvirus](#): > > Besides, if muslim countries don’t want these muslim immigrants, why should America take them? It’s not a law or requirement that we accept or let them in. Nobody’s ever claimed that we’re obligated to take in **all** aspiring immigrants from majority-Muslim countries. And in fact, we don’t. We screen them, vet them, check them, question them, inspect them, and scrutinize them extremely carefully before giving a very small percentage of them visas to come to the US. But once we **do** give them permission and visas (and in some cases even permanent-resident status), then it’s an extremely asshole move to suddenly revoke that permission, especially if they’re actually in transit at the time. Trump has essentially told the world that we can’t be trusted to know what we’re doing or to honor our commitments. For foreign visitors, the US is now no better than a banana republic, where you can comply with all the conditions and fill out all the forms correctly and get all the necessary authorizations and permissions, and then at the whim of the Dicktator get thrown into a detention cell anyway because he’s suddenly decided to unilaterally declare take-backsies. Rule of law? What’s that? ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/386 "2017-01-31T04:18:03Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > Fucken hell America, how the hell is this going to pan out? ☹ Worst case? Military troops in our streets and all-out revolution. I don’t think the last will happen, but I predicted the first months ago when Twitler was campaigning on ‘cleaning up our cities’; the only conclusion to draw from his verbiage being he was going to declare martial law. Best case: he will be unable to travel to any major city in this country without seeing a minimum of 50,000 angry people screaming “FUCK YOU”, and serious clashes with police and counter-demonstrators. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/387 "2017-01-31T04:20:05Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > All this shit does, is validate and help ISIS. They can now say to their followers and prospective friends… > > “See that shit? This is what we were warning you about. This is what we were fighting against” > > **And it will sell.** > > Trump is the best friend they have right now. He is a walking talking ISIS advertisement. Are you implying that that is not what he wants? I mean, I would rather not think the worst of him, but every day he makes it more difficult not to. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/388 "2017-01-31T04:20:13Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Pretty much everyone other than Nate Silver had Clinton as a huge favorite. In early November? Like, when voting was about to be happening? Got a cite for that? Because the [news stories I’ve seen](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/05/upshot/polling-still-shows-hillary-clinton-with-a-lead-but-not-a-safe-one.html) from that time describe the polls as giving Clinton “a lead, but not a safe one”. Nothing “huge” about it. ---
**Author:** ![arfurvirus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@arfurvirus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/arfurvirus)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/389 "2017-01-31T04:20:34Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > Next time, put or something between the “accuse others of being stupid and retarded” part and the “make stupid and retarded assertion of easily refuted alternate facts” part. [Here let me help you. [http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://)](Here let me help you. [http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://)) Then there was This Time , citizens of South Vietnam sought refuge in the United States following their country’s defeat by communist forces from North Vietnam, many liberal Democrats opposed efforts by Republican President Gerald Ford to admit them. The group of Democrats included then-Governor of California Jerry Brown (who currently serves as the state’s governor), then-Delaware Senator Joe Biden, former Presidential candidate and South Dakota Senator George McGovern, and New York Representative Elizabeth Holtzman. “As a rookie governor when Saigon fell in 1975 and the U.S. was flying Vietnamese refugees to America, Brown was outspokenly opposed,” reported the Los Angeles Times in 2015. In particular, Brown said in 1975: “There is something a little strange about saying, ‘Let’s bring in 500,000 more people’ when we can’t take care of the 1 million [Californians] out of work.” His administration even attempted to block planes carrying Vietnamese refugees from landing at Travis Air Force Base near San Francisco. > **[FLASHBACK: Democrats Tried To Block Thousands Of Vietnam War Refugees,...](https://dailycaller.com/2017/01/29/flashback-when-liberal-democrats-opposed-refugees-and-even-orphans/)** > > in 1975 most liberals, led by California’s Gov. Jerry Brown were part of a chorus of big name Democrats who refused to accept any Vietnamese refugees. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/390 "2017-01-31T04:23:27Z")
> [@arfurvirus](#): > > God are all these people stupid or retarded? > > Trump is parroting what FBHO had on the 7 or so countries from back in 2011(I believe was year). Where was the uproar when FBHO denied immigrant travel from these same countries? > > Besides, if muslim countries don’t want these muslim immigrants, why should America take them? It’s not a law or requirement that we accept or let them in. Wow. You are one stupid person. First: In my experience, those who use “BHO” or in any other way bring attention to President Obama’s middle name are simple bigots. Second: You do not seem to understand the term “refugee”. Third: It actually is a requirement of American law that when someone applies for something from the government, say a visa, and that applicant meets all the particulars to receive that thing, they get it. Finally: You are now displaying even less understanding of the constitution than Trump is. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/391 "2017-01-31T04:25:55Z")
> [@arfurvirus](#): > > [Here let me help you. [http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://)](Here let me help you. > [http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://)) > > Then there was This Time , citizens of South Vietnam sought refuge in the United States following their country’s defeat by communist forces from North Vietnam, many liberal Democrats opposed efforts by Republican President Gerald Ford to admit them. > > The group of Democrats included then-Governor of California Jerry Brown (who currently serves as the state’s governor), then-Delaware Senator Joe Biden, former Presidential candidate and South Dakota Senator George McGovern, and New York Representative Elizabeth Holtzman. > > “As a rookie governor when Saigon fell in 1975 and the U.S. was flying Vietnamese refugees to America, Brown was outspokenly opposed,” reported the Los Angeles Times in 2015. > > In particular, Brown said in 1975: “There is something a little strange about saying, ‘Let’s bring in 500,000 more people’ when we can’t take care of the 1 million [Californians] out of work.” > > His administration even attempted to block planes carrying Vietnamese refugees from landing at Travis Air Force Base near San Francisco. > [FLASHBACK: Democrats Tried To Block Thousands Of Vietnam War Refugees, Including Orphans | The Daily Caller](http://dailycaller.com/2017/01/29/flashback-when-liberal-democrats-opposed-refugees-and-even-orphans/) So what you’re saying is “The other side once did it so we get to do it, too” rather than “The other side did it but we will do the right thing and allow in refugees.” Is that about it? You’re just looking for an excuse to do wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/392 "2017-01-31T04:34:21Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > :dubious: Cite? AFAIK, there were few if any polls claiming that Clinton’s lead was well outside the margin of error. > Some? Maybe none? And why would you imagine that Clinton voters in tight races in _swing_ states would have been likely to “stay home because it was a done deal”? > But I don’t think voter apathy can plausibly be ascribed to those of us who turn out for protests. > > And, of course, let’s not forget that the people who directly made this happen are the ones who voted for Trump. …seriously: just leave Airman alone. He’s on the same side as you. He just disagrees with some of the details. I don’t entirely disagree with what Airman says. And I don’t entirely disagree with what you say. There are a heck of a lot of reasons why Trump won: and pretty much all of them are a little bit correct. It took everything to align and a little bit of luck for Trump to get over the “finishing line.” Lets not burn ourselves out fighting each other over something so trivial for fucks sakes. The pit is for ranting. We don’t need to debate every post in the pit. Save your fury for people like arfurvirus: who are actually propagating false news. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/393 "2017-01-31T04:37:08Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > In early November? Like, when voting was about to be happening? Got a cite for that? > > Because the [news stories I’ve seen](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/05/upshot/polling-still-shows-hillary-clinton-with-a-lead-but-not-a-safe-one.html) from that time describe the polls as giving Clinton “a lead, but not a safe one”. Nothing “huge” about it. [11/04/2016](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/high-probability-clinton-winning_us_581d0399e4b0e80b02ca2498) In fact, there was this hilarious article from Huffington’s Ryan Grim: “It’s not easy to sit here and tell you that Clinton has a 98 percent chance of winning. Everything inside us screams out that life is too full of uncertainty, that being so sure is just a fantasy. But that’s what the numbers say. What is the point of all the data entry, all the math, all the modeling, if when the moment of truth comes we throw our hands up and say, hey, anything can happen. If that’s how we feel, let’s scrap the entire political forecasting industry.” NYT gave Clinton, on [October 29](https://sites.stanford.edu/predict2016/will-hillary-clinton-be-one-term-president), 91% chance of winning. Is that “a lead, but not a safe one”? And of course Princeton Election Consortium, cited in a bunch of news stories, put her chances at 99%. ---
**Author:** ![arfurvirus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@arfurvirus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/arfurvirus)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/394 "2017-01-31T04:37:35Z")
> [@arfurvirus](#): > > [Here let me help you. [http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://)](Here let me help you. > [http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/politics/ct-trump-refugee-policy-fact-check-2011-20170129-story.htmlhttp://)) > > Then there was This Time , citizens of South Vietnam sought refuge in the United States following their country’s defeat by communist forces from North Vietnam, many liberal Democrats opposed efforts by Republican President Gerald Ford to admit them. > > The group of Democrats included then-Governor of California Jerry Brown (who currently serves as the state’s governor), then-Delaware Senator Joe Biden, former Presidential candidate and South Dakota Senator George McGovern, and New York Representative Elizabeth Holtzman. > > “As a rookie governor when Saigon fell in 1975 and the U.S. was flying Vietnamese refugees to America, Brown was outspokenly opposed,” reported the Los Angeles Times in 2015. > > In particular, Brown said in 1975: “There is something a little strange about saying, ‘Let’s bring in 500,000 more people’ when we can’t take care of the 1 million [Californians] out of work.” > > His administration even attempted to block planes carrying Vietnamese refugees from landing at Travis Air Force Base near San Francisco. > [FLASHBACK: Democrats Tried To Block Thousands Of Vietnam War Refugees, Including Orphans | The Daily Caller](http://dailycaller.com/2017/01/29/flashback-when-liberal-democrats-opposed-refugees-and-even-orphans/) > [@running\_coach](#): > > So what you’re saying is “The other side once did it so we get to do it, too” rather than “The other side did it but we will do the right thing and allow in refugees.” > > Is that about it? You’re just looking for an excuse to do wrong? No, I’m saying Trump did it brilliantly. They took a look at 325,000 people, **detained 109** , yes all of the screeching and tears for 109 people who were inconvenienced. Great Job Radicals and dinosaur media. He’s slowing down the flood that Obama opened up, and properly vetting people. Yes, people from known terrorist supporting/breeding places will have to wait 90 days to get their free socialist healthcare and visas stamped. I know it makes him “literally” Hitler. Get over it. 8 years I’m going to have to listen to David Brocks and Soros’ paid shills around here… Meanwhile in the real world Soro’ NGO’s are attempting to overthrow Hungry, I hope Sessions brings he and his son’s up on sedition charges. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/395 "2017-01-31T04:42:53Z")
Great, did I miss your cites? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/396 "2017-01-31T04:45:45Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > Great, did I miss your cites? One of them was the Faily Caller, Fucker Carlson’s joint, so that pretty much sets the tone. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/397 "2017-01-31T04:47:23Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > One of them was the Faily Caller, Fucker Carlson’s joint, so that pretty much sets the tone. Was that for President Fucking FORD? I would love some from this century, please. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/398 "2017-01-31T04:50:01Z")
Here is an archeologist (sorry, the report is on Trump’s favorite platform) who was denied entry: > ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/399 "2017-01-31T04:56:46Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > In early November? Like, when voting was about to be happening? Got a cite for that? > > Because the [news stories I’ve seen](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/05/upshot/polling-still-shows-hillary-clinton-with-a-lead-but-not-a-safe-one.html) from that time describe the polls as giving Clinton “a lead, but not a safe one”. Nothing “huge” about it. Here’s PEC [http://election.princeton.edu/history-of-meta-analysis/](http://election.princeton.edu/history-of-meta-analysis/). Here are the final predictions of a bunch of pollsters, but they don’t give percentage chances. I know 538 was a big outlier in giving Trump as much as a 30% chance. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2017, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/400 "2017-01-31T05:00:33Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > The real truth is, the countries were selected based on his own business interests. No county that he has (or wants) a business connection with, is on the list. Nor are any countries that export Eastern European prostitutes. Because, you know, there’s never any telling when Trump will want a new wife. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468.md?page=21)