# Trump's Executive Order on Immigration - Let it Rip Dopers **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 29, 2017, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468 "2017-01-29T01:44:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 34
**Author:** ![truthSeeker2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7cd45c/32.png) [@truthSeeker2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/truthSeeker2)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/661 "2017-02-06T15:26:30Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > If what you believe were true, you would already have been killed. Islam is a poison, incomparable with any other religion, is true and the world has already suffered a lot due to that… You want to portray that I believe that most Muslims are bad when I don’t believe so (of course). Basically there are many like you, just dishonest people fooling only themselves. But Cheers anyways. I love you as always…bbye. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/662 "2017-02-06T15:45:09Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > You think I haven’t interacted? 15% of Indians are Muslims, means 1 in every 6.67 people. Separate Muslims as individuals from Islam as ideology. Don’t be confused. > > Islam is poison which causes bloodshed, division, backwardness in the society… It’s not Muslims’ fault that they are born into Islam, rather they are trapped in it…Islamic extremists/fundamentalists/terrorists, who vastly outnumber such people in other religions (there is just no comparison), will not be such backward extremists if they were not born into Islam. > > I am called a bigot in every post but the fact is, I am one of the most open-minded respecting individuals. People here know it and yet will be dishonest and call me bigot racist etc Sorry, your posts reveal you to be a bigot and a racist. Go the fuck away, you shithead. ---
**Author:** ![truthSeeker2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7cd45c/32.png) [@truthSeeker2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/truthSeeker2)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/663 "2017-02-06T15:48:06Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Sorry, your posts reveal you to be a bigot and a racist. Go the fuck away, you shithead. OK dear pitiable fellow human being. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/664 "2017-02-06T15:50:54Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > [Chuck Todd embarrassed Vice President Mike Pence with his own words](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/2/5/1630268/-Chuck-Todd-embarrassed-Vice-President-Mike-Pence-with-his-own-words) > > > [@](#): > > > > … He used Mike Pence’s words against him. What is amazing is Pence’s inability to break the narrative. > > > > When Chuck Todd used Mike Pence’s words against him, he displayed an embarrassed smile but amazingly expectedly to form after a few seconds. > > > > … > > > > “Well look, the President of the United States has every right to criticize the other two branches of government,” Mike Pence said. “We have a long tradition of that in this country.” > > > > Todd asked if that is the best way to do it. Pence said the American people find it refreshing. > > Mike Pence exposed > > > > “On this issue of criticism,” Chuck Todd continued. "I found something you said about President Obama seven years ago. Take a listen. > > > > “This president has shown an unusual interest in commenting on his critics in the media and here on Capitol Hill,” Pence said about Obama in the clip Todd played. “The American people don’t want to hear the President’s reflections and commentary on criticisms.” > > So he’s full of shit. Surprise surprise. Pence is a dishonest, hypocritical shithead, whose only core philosophies are: It’s OK If A Republican Does It I’m Superior to Everyone Else Only My Rights Are Important Give Me More Money ---
**Author:** ![Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/brown_eyed_girl/32/3574_2.png) [@Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brown_Eyed_Girl)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/665 "2017-02-06T16:17:42Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Pence is a dishonest, hypocritical shithead, whose only core philosophies are: > > It’s OK If A Republican Does It > I’m Superior to Everyone Else > Only My Rights Are Important > Give Me More Money Also, at the end of the clip Pence says: “And in President Donald Trump, just like his predecessor, he is going to exercise the prerogative to criticize other branches of government when he thinks they are not acting in a way that is consistent with the best interest of the American people.” They have apparently not noticed that the American people is notably expansive swaths have been making it extremely clear that this immigration ban is not in their interest. Or, it’s not about the “best interest of the American people.” Note to Trump: Your approval rating is less than 50%. The majority of Americans do NOT believe you are acting in their best interest. We are all waiting for you grow up and do the right thing. These people you’ve surrounded yourself with are doing you a disservice by not preparing you better and reigning in your impulsive tendencies. They are invested in your failure and will dump you when you can no longer rile the masses. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/666 "2017-02-06T16:23:49Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > OK dear pitiable fellow human being. You’re going to go away? That’s great news. Take your disgusting bigotry somewhere else. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/667 "2017-02-06T17:17:34Z")
> [@Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](#): > > Also, at the end of the clip Pence says: “And in President Donald Trump, just like his predecessor, he is going to exercise the prerogative to criticize other branches of government when he thinks they are not acting in a way that is consistent with the best interest of the American people.” > > They have apparently not noticed that the American people is notably expansive swaths have been making it extremely clear that this immigration ban is not in their interest. Or, it’s not about the “best interest of the American people.” > > Note to Trump: Your approval rating is less than 50%. The majority of Americans do NOT believe you are acting in their best interest. We are all waiting for you grow up and do the right thing. These people you’ve surrounded yourself with are doing you a disservice by not preparing you better and reigning in your impulsive tendencies. They are invested in your failure and will dump you when you can no longer rile the masses. Note to Trump: Pleasing a bigot and/or an idiot twice is not the same as pleasing two people once. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/668 "2017-02-06T17:59:24Z")
I hope a lawyer will chime in on this. This morning on BBC News, the newsperson interviewed a legal eagle (didn’t catch his name) who had been an advisor to Reagan and Bush Senior. He said the suit brought by the state of Washington is entirely without merit because such a suit has to be brought by the person/s who were/are likely to be injured by the executive order. I wish I could find the story and post a link, but my search hasn’t turned up anything. Maybe someone else heard it, too? My question: if this is true, can’t a giant class action suit be brought on behalf of the people who \*\*were \*\*affected by the ban? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/669 "2017-02-06T18:02:04Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I hope a lawyer will chime in on this. > > This morning on BBC News, the newsperson interviewed a legal eagle (didn’t catch his name) who had been an advisor to Reagan and Bush Senior. He said the suit brought by the state of Washington is entirely without merit because such a suit has to be brought by the person/s who were/are likely to be injured by the executive order. > > I wish I could find the story and post a link, but my search hasn’t turned up anything. Maybe someone else heard it, too? > > My question: if this is true, can’t a giant class action suit be brought on behalf of the people who \*\*were \*\*affected by the ban? Do you mean “The Bad Guys”? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/670 "2017-02-06T18:54:55Z")
I think the notion of “standing” is open to question, it is a field where lawyers frolic and gambol. The states advance the notion than an injury to the citizens of the state is an injury to each and every citizen, thus all have “standing”. This is countered by the claim that an individual citizen must show himself directly injured in some way, and may join others who are directly injured, but the state of Washington or Minnesota cannot make such a claim on their behalf. A cornucopia, a _pinata_ stuffed full of billable hours. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/671 "2017-02-06T21:22:07Z")
I’m not going to insult you like these others, **truthSeeker2**. I understand & to some degree share you concerns. > [@truthSeeker2](#): > > Islam is poison which causes bloodshed, division, backwardness in the society… **It’s not Muslims’ fault that they are born into Islam, rather they are trapped in it…** [bolding added] This is why Trump’s order makes no sense to someone fighting against toxic Muslim extremism. Islam is something _inflicted_ on these people. And letting them into the USA, into a multicultural, multi-ethnic society, can help them see a way out of the more radicalized political forms, and escape them. Sending them back to imbibe the toxic fumes of political Islam at full strength is bad for them, and possibly more dangerous to the world. So why is Trump doing it? He cares not for these poor people, drowning in Islamism. Perhaps he does it because he is now the political “radical Westerner” or “radical Christian.” Then _he_ is now the toxic bigot, pushing conformity to his culture. And his faction will not be great friends of American Hindus either, I fear. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/672 "2017-02-06T22:04:36Z")
Many think that I only worry about climate change, nope, I actually get deep into issues were 1) the stupid, it burns. And: 2) there is evidence -sometimes overwhelming evidence- already reported before and even in scientific journals that showed already how what an ignorant poster posted was debunked. One of the things that I warned many times during the election was that Trump was relying on conspiracy sites full of weaponized ignorance. As it was said many times before: if you think education is expensive try ignorance. We are in deep trouble folks. It is very likely that Bannon, Trump and others relied on very unsavory sources of information to come up with the EO and other dumb actions. And that Trump continues to rely on the garbage sites for information, not the ones that are crucial and available for a president. > **[Trump Shared False Travel Ban Story On His Facebook Page](https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-shared-false-travel-ban-story-on-his-facebook-page)** > > The president shared a story on his Facebook page on Thursday contending that Kuwait issued a travel ban akin to his own. It has 250,000 likes and over 68,000 shares. One problem: Kuwait denies that it’s true. > [@](#): > > At 12:25 p.m. on February 2, President Trump posted a story on his official Facebook page which contended that Kuwait issued a visa ban for five Muslim-majority countries. > > Trump’s post, which is still up as of Sunday morning, read: “Smart! > > 'Kuwait issues its own Trump-esque visa ban for five Muslim-majority countries | Al Bawaba,’” citing the source of the information. > > It has some 250,000 likes,over 68,000 shares, and was picked up by Breitbart and Infowars. But there’s one problem: Kuwait denies that anything of this sort ever took place. > [@](#): > > The story in the Jordanian news outlet Al Bawaba did not have an official statement or order from the Kuwaiti government—nor from any of the countries it said were facing a ban. > > It then went from Trump’s mouth to his most fervent online support base’s ears. > > On February 2, the conspiracy-hub InfoWars ran with the story citing reporting by Sputnik International, a Russian-government news agency. > > Sputnik did in fact have a story on their site as well, but later issued a correction saying “the following news article proved to be untrue.” They cited a denial by Ghulam Dastagir, Pakistan’s ambassador in Kuwait. (Pakistan was listed as one of the five alleged countries under the false visa ban). > > … > > As of Sunday morning, Breitbart, Infowars and the President of the United States have not issued corrections or amendments to their posts about the story. Really, similar misinformation can lead a nation to war. Specially when we have a president that believes that listening to the American intelligence groups is an optional thing. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/673 "2017-02-06T23:46:52Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > Islam is a poison, incomparable with any other religion, is true and the world has already suffered a lot due to that… > > You want to portray that I believe that most Muslims are bad when I don’t believe so (of course). Basically there are many like you, just dishonest people fooling only themselves. > > But Cheers anyways. I love you as always…bbye. We’ve already noticed [what passes for love in your so-called mind](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18397746&postcount=1111). > [@foolsguinea](#): > > I’m not going to insult you like these others, **truthSeeker2**. I understand & to some degree share you concerns.[bolding added] What concerns of his do you share and to what degree? > [@](#): > > This is why Trump’s order makes no sense to someone fighting against toxic Muslim extremism. Islam is something _inflicted_ on these people. And letting them into the USA, into a multicultural, multi-ethnic society, can help them see a way out of the more radicalized political forms, and escape them. Sending them back to imbibe the toxic fumes of political Islam at full strength is bad for them, and possibly more dangerous to the world. I’m really hoping I’m getting whooshed here. Is this your belief about Islam or your depiction of Trump’s and his supporters’ beliefs? > [@](#): > > So why is Trump doing it? He cares not for these poor people, drowning in Islamism. Perhaps he does it because he is now the political “radical Westerner” or “radical Christian.” Then _he_ is now the toxic bigot, pushing conformity to his culture. And his faction will not be great friends of American Hindus either, I fear. Of course he doesn’t care about those people. He’s never cared about people. Why would he begin now? And his EO showed that it’s not really about security either. He’s pandering to bigotry. As to Trump’s faction’s attitude towards Hindus: no doubt many, if not most, of those faction will see them as Muslims. After all, those particular foreigners are brown. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2017, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/674 "2017-02-06T23:50:11Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > You’re going to go away? That’s great news. Take your disgusting bigotry somewhere else. Really. Good fucking riddance. ---
**Author:** ![truthSeeker2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7cd45c/32.png) [@truthSeeker2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/truthSeeker2)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2017, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/675 "2017-02-07T01:41:08Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > I’m not going to insult you like these others, **truthSeeker2**. I understand & to some degree share you concerns.[bolding added] > > This is why Trump’s order makes no sense to someone fighting against toxic Muslim extremism. Islam is something _inflicted_ on these people. And letting them into the USA, into a multicultural, multi-ethnic society, can help them see a way out of the more radicalized political forms, and escape them. Sending them back to imbibe the toxic fumes of political Islam at full strength is bad for them, and possibly more dangerous to the world. > > So why is Trump doing it? He cares not for these poor people, drowning in Islamism. Perhaps he does it because he is now the political “radical Westerner” or “radical Christian.” Then _he_ is now the toxic bigot, pushing conformity to his culture. And his faction will not be great friends of American Hindus either, I fear. I said in first post itself I disagree with Trump’s blanket ban and for different reasons…like someone may require visa for advanced medical treatment , someone else may be a professional needed in USA. I have different thoughts than Yours. These people already know (through internet,tv etc) what non-islamic societies are about which is way they are willing to come. 1.But if they are not allowed, perhaps by being forced to stay in their lands They will reform their own societies. 2. Of course, the ban serves as a symbolic thing, that how worrisome Islam is for the world. But regardless of above 2 points about the ban which are positive, I still oppose the ban. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2017, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/676 "2017-02-07T02:00:21Z")
You are going away far too slowly. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2017, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/677 "2017-02-07T02:29:10Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Do you mean “The Bad Guys”? What’s Arabic for _hombres_? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2017, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/678 "2017-02-07T02:40:48Z")
> [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](#): > > What’s Arabic for _hombres_? According to [Google Translate:](https://translate.google.com/?oe=utf-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&client=tw-ob#auto/ar/hombre) rajul رجل ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2017, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/679 "2017-02-07T07:24:00Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > What concerns of his do you share and to what degree? Hey, no one _really_ wants their country overrun by Islamists. I’m just trying to open the door a crack for **truthSeeker2** to understand that not everyone from a “Muslim country” is a violent political Muslim, any more than Muslims he knows in India. > [@Monty](#): > > I’m really hoping I’m getting whooshed here. Is this your belief about Islam or your depiction of Trump’s and his supporters’ beliefs? I’m attempting to meet our angry subcontinental friend halfway instead of insulting and blocking him. [1 Cor. 9:22](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Corinthians%209:19-23) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2017, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468/680 "2017-02-07T07:32:36Z")
That said, I think it’s fair to say that unless you grew up in a really intensely religious family, most people from Muslim ethnicities aren’t “drowning in Islamism.” They’re just people. Some of them hate Jews the way **truthSeeker2** hates Muslims, but they’re just people. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468.md?page=33) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-executive-order-on-immigration-let-it-rip-dopers/778468.md?page=35)