# Trump's Shutdown **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 11, 2019, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577 "2019-01-11T06:18:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![3trew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/13edae/32.png) [@3trew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3trew)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/201 "2019-01-16T19:48:19Z")
Don’t want 'em to suffer but don’t want 'em around… so these guys’d be on board for some sort of, what can we call it, an option where things, while being completely separate, are also strictly equal… I wonder if that’s ever been tried anywhere before. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/202 "2019-01-16T19:52:45Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > In their defense, this administration has provided a lot of evidence for that black hole. There’s Carson’s $31,000 dining set, and Price’s use of military jets, and Mnuchin’s honeymoon, and … etc., etc. that’s true, but even that money recirculated. Someone got paid for the dining set, they used that money to buy something else, which money was then used to buy something else again, etc. But people really think those dollars are just burned or something. And the recirculation is one of the points of progressive taxation - you take cash from rich person A’s mattress and inject it back into the economy, causing mostly positive knock-on effects. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/203 "2019-01-16T20:01:30Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > that’s true, but even that money recirculated. Someone got paid for the dining set, they used that money to buy something else, which money was then used to buy something else again, etc. But people really think those dollars are just burned or something. > > And the recirculation is one of the points of progressive taxation - you take cash from rich person A’s mattress and inject it back into the economy, causing mostly positive knock-on effects. Without the wasted expense/graft, taxes could be lower allowing people to inject the money into the economy in a way that benefits them. Theoretically. Lower taxes for the middle class. I am so damn _funny._ ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/204 "2019-01-16T20:59:31Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > And?.. Why do you, with no prompting whatsoever, bring up that factoid? I was gently chiding you for believing that coal is fossilized trees. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/205 "2019-01-16T21:23:09Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I was gently chiding you for believing that coal is fossilized trees. As I said, I was being glib (and maybe poorly poetic) But, my “belief” that coal is fossilized trees is still far, far, far more correct than their belief that their coal mining job is coming back. P.S. See, doesn’t “coal mining job” sound so much more lackluster and boring than “digging up fossilized trees”. It being the Pit, I’m more than happy to take poetic license over literal accuracy. I’ve also referred to oil as Dinosaur blood… Also not something that I literally believe. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/206 "2019-01-16T21:50:28Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Self-government? Is that what you call the US system? The ratio of representatives to individuals makes that claim one of ideology, not reality, which is where the pageantry and pledges come in. The term “self-government” has a meaning, you moron. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/207 "2019-01-16T21:57:18Z")
> [@3trew](#): > > Don’t want 'em to suffer but don’t want 'em around… so these guys’d be on board for some sort of, what can we call it, an option where things, while being completely separate, are also strictly equal… I wonder if that’s ever been tried anywhere before. Maybe we could concentrate them in some kind of camps… ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/208 "2019-01-16T22:19:07Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > Maybe we could concentrate them in some kind of camps… Good idea, and we can call it college. Then they can get a job as a programmer or something. That way, the racists who just don’t want to be around minorities can stick to pining for their jobs in mining and manufacturing that are never, ever coming back, and the minorities that they so loathe can stay out of their way by becoming educated and wealthy. Everyone wins. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2019, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/209 "2019-01-16T22:22:37Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I’ve also referred to oil as Dinosaur blood… Also not something that I literally believe. I think that used to be algae. A hell of a lot of algae. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/210 "2019-01-17T05:06:13Z")
Trump did sign the Democratic legislation which guaranteed back pay to the federal workers today. Also this law requires back pay in case of future shutdowns. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/211 "2019-01-17T08:03:34Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Trump did sign the Democratic legislation which guaranteed back pay to the federal workers today. Also this law requires back pay in case of future shutdowns. To the second part, seriously? That’s going to be a weight lifted from the shoulders of several of my friends. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/212 "2019-01-17T11:53:32Z")
> **[Trump signs law guaranteeing back pay for federal workers](https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/425725-trump-signs-law-guaranteeing-back-pay-for-federal-workers/)** > > President Trump on Wednesday signed a bill guaranteeing back-pay to federal workers furloughed during the partial government shutdown that began in December.The White House announced that Trump has… That article does not mention the future back pay, but it is cited here: > ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/213 "2019-01-17T12:30:42Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Trump did sign the Democratic legislation which guaranteed back pay to the federal workers today. Also this law requires back pay in case of future shutdowns. So Turtle McTurtleface actually permitted a piece of Democratic legislation to pass through his tightly clenched fists and land on thump’s desk (with a _thump_, I presume)? This does not sound like Mitch–doing something sensible that will actually benefit people who are not millionaires? What’s his game? Where’s the catch? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/214 "2019-01-17T12:36:02Z")
I can’t recall hearing of him before the 2016 campaign (perhaps in some foodie article; in any case, nothing that made an impact), but more and more I’m thinking I have to visit D.C. again just so I can eat in José Andrés’ restaurant and ask if he’ll let me hug him. His non-profit is offering meals to furloughed [federal workers](https://edition.cnn.com/2019/01/15/us/chef-jose-andres-feeding-federal-workers-shutdown-trnd/index.html). ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/215 "2019-01-17T12:40:56Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Trump did sign the Democratic legislation which guaranteed back pay to the federal workers today. Also this law requires back pay in case of future shutdowns. Sounds like Popeye’s Wimpy: “I’ll gladly pay you some day for work done today.” ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/216 "2019-01-17T12:47:14Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Trump did sign the Democratic legislation which guaranteed back pay to the federal workers today. Also this law requires back pay in case of future shutdowns. If that is the case, won’t that make it OK to just force EVERYBODY to go to work without pay, instead of making a meaningless distinction between “essential” an “non-essential” employees? If everybody is going to get paid, furloughing some of them doesn’t save any money. Just keep the whole government open, without paying anyone. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/217 "2019-01-17T14:10:27Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > If that is the case, won’t that make it OK to just force EVERYBODY to go to work without pay, instead of making a meaningless distinction between “essential” an “non-essential” employees? If everybody is going to get paid, furloughing some of them doesn’t save any money. Just keep the whole government open, without paying anyone. …_permanently_! Think how much money that will save! ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/218 "2019-01-17T15:34:39Z")
The shutdown is[costing 0.1% in economic growth every week](https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjones/2019/01/16/white-house-more-than-doubling-the-shutdowns-negative-impact-on-the-economy/#5e32814059a1), according the the WH itself. So much winning. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2019, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/219 "2019-01-17T16:08:56Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > The shutdown is[costing 0.1% in economic growth every week](https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjones/2019/01/16/white-house-more-than-doubling-the-shutdowns-negative-impact-on-the-economy/#5e32814059a1), according the the WH itself. > > So much winning. From the link. > [@](#): > > it seems the White House’s Council of Economic Advisors did not include contractors not being paid (and who probably won’t receive retroactive payments) or the ripple effect on the economy such as restaurant meals not being taken or movies seen or the greater personal impacts of not having money to buy food, pay rent or have to sell a car. Only hires the [del]best.[/del] most incompetent. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577/220 "2019-01-18T22:45:05Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > If that is the case, won’t that make it OK to just force EVERYBODY to go to work without pay, instead of making a meaningless distinction between “essential” an “non-essential” employees? If everybody is going to get paid, furloughing some of them doesn’t save any money. Just keep the whole government open, without paying anyone. > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > …_permanently_! Think how much money that will save! Yeah, the ‘private prisons’ route to re-introducing slavery was going too slowly. This plan is _much_ better. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/trumps-shutdown/827577.md?page=12)